Euan Murray questions Sunday matches

[ZeFrenchy]

If I was asked: "Do you hope carrots will not be served in the future in the school cafeteria?" I would surely answer "of course I do". That doesn't mean I will start a campaign to annihilate carrots forever.

 

[McTallshort]

Shocking devil dodger, lets just change the RWC because some god botherer doesnt want to play on Sunday. Dont think so

 

[MichaelBoard]

I appreciate his point of view but with the greatest of respect Euan Murray is in the very small minority rather than the majority, so for that reason it is highly unlikely or probably no chance at all that someone higher up will take a blind bit of notice. But massive respect to him for sticking to his religious beliefs. My only concern not just for Euan Murray but any future player who may share the same views as Murray is that he would potentially jeopardise any chances of selection in his national team if his nation was a better team than Scotland, who with the greatest of respect, despite being a decent outfit in top 10 aren't the best, Australia, New Zealand for instance. Luckily for Murray he is arguably still the best that Scotland has, or at least is on par with any rivals for his position, whereas if he was in contention to play for a team like the Boks or Wallabies he would more than likely be completely overlooked due to his decision (an understandable and admirable one) not to play on Sundays in matches that could well be crucial and important matches. It would be a shame to see any country miss out on seeing a player who is very very good not being given a chance to play for his country because of similar beliefs. The selectors wouldn't be at fault either because it would be unfair on other players vying for places in squads to lose out to somebody who may have to miss for instance 2/5 matches in the 6 Nations or 2/4 matches in the World Cup pools then further matches in the knockout stages.

 

[LittleGuy]

Disagree completely and I think that is a slight insult towards someone who has religious belief's, people must respect Murray's view even if they disagree with it.

Jonathan Edwards was another who did not participate on Sunday's.

I'm not sure if I buy this, an argument could be made that his decision dosen't hurt anyone else(except maybe his team) and thats vaild so he can do as he chooses if the SRU and his teamates are fine with it.

But why does religion get a free pass because it has some ancient texts to accompany it or because the majority of mankind is(rightfully) a little frightened and dissapointed about the prospect of nothing after death? As Logorrhea said though this debate is going to go nowhere.

Edit: My Original post was unnessecarily WUMMISH and for that I apologize, but if Euan is a devout Christian than one of his core beleifs is that I as someone who dosen't share them will suffer, possibly eternally on my death, I think criticzing him for not playing on a Sunday kind of pales in comparison to this if I put that in context and let people know where I am coming from.

 

[TRF_Cymro]

I'm not sure if I buy this, an argument could be made that his decision dosen't hurt anyone else(except maybe his team) and thats vaild so he can do as he chooses if the SRU and his teamates are fine with it. But why does religion get a free pass because it has some ancient poorly and written boring texts to accompany it? As Logorrhea said though this debate is going to go nowhere.

Urm ... yes let's not go there because its people like Logorreha and yourself who will offend religious people. For some the Bible is not some ancient poorly and written boring text book, for some it's a way of life and a lot of people base their morals on the book. The world might be a better place if some of the stuff in the Bible was actually considered by some.

If you can't accept someone's religious views because they differ from yours then it says a lot about a person in my eyes. Criticize Murray all you wish but remember he obviously is a devout Christian and believes Sunday is the Sabbath. It his decision on how he should observe it and people should respect that decision. I am not religious by the way, an agnostic.

 

[LittleGuy]

Urm ... yes let's not go there because its people like Logorreha and yourself who will offend religious people. For some the Bible is not some ancient poorly and written boring text book, for some it's a way of life and a lot of people base their morals on the book. The world might be a better place if some of the stuff in the Bible was actually considered by some.

If you can't accept someone's religious views because they differ from yours then it says a lot about a person in my eyes. Criticize Murray all you wish but remember he obviously is a devout Christian and believes Sunday is the Sabbath. It his decision on how he should observe it and people should respect that decision. I am not religious by the way, an agnostic.

Murray can do whatver he wants as long as his team was fine with it, I just don't think the same respect would be conveyed to people who chose not to play for other reasons e.g. political reasons

 

[Sam Owen]

Devout Christian Euan Murray has questioned the need for Rugby World Cup matches to be played on Sundays.

Interesting topic; same beliefs as Ian Jones (I think). I personally love a few matches on Sunday.

Close, but it was Micheal Jones who at the height of his career chose not to play on Sundays due to his strong christian beliefs. This also made room for other good All Blacks such as Mike Brewer.

 

[Seaton]

Murray can do whatver he wants as long as his team was fine with it, I just don't think the same respect would be conveyed to people who chose not to play for other reasons e.g. political reasons

I kinda agree and disagree. There is a much wider variety of reasons, some in my eyes valid and others invalid, in the area of politics that somone could choose not to play for their country.

On the one hand you could have say a white guy from Zimbabwe, who had family killed in the government condoned farm attacks and such, refuses to represent Zimbabwe. Thats alright in my books, same as if a Tibetan refused to represent China.

Then on the other hand you might have a player who refuses to play because the Conservatives raise the VAT percentage, or because they think David Cameron is a ****. Obviously not acceptable.

 

[LittleGuy]

I kinda agree and disagree. There is a much wider variety of reasons, some in my eyes valid and others invalid, in the area of politics that somone could choose not to play for their country.

On the one hand you could have say a white guy from Zimbabwe, who had family killed in the government condoned farm attacks and such, refuses to represent Zimbabwe. Thats alright in my books, same as if a Tibetan refused to represent China.

Then on the other hand you might have a player who refuses to play because the Conservatives raise the VAT percentage, or because they think David Cameron is a ****. Obviously not acceptable.

I think thats a fair view of things LordHope, one is a serious and transcendant issue( On an aside Mugabe and the White African is possibly the most powerful and stunning documentary of all time about the very issue LordHope brought up), while the other one is a purely partisan reason.

 

[Dizzy]

I'm sorry, I'm no Christian but I know a lot of religious people and I'll telll ya, they are the worst of em all. They are the ones who cause all the fights, do the thieving and have you seen in the media over the years about Catholics I think it is touching on little boys and shite....

Back to what I was saying.... Isn't one of the rules of religion or whatever that you cannot bring your body to any harm, well intentionally?.. Or is that Mormon??.. I know one of the religions believe in something like this because when I was younger that is why one of my mates wouldn't play Rugby, because it was a physical sport and they aren't supposed to bring harm to their bodies... Then he goes and gets a tatoo and starts fights every second day...

The way I look at it, Rugby has no religion, and if that's how it's going to be then the next thing that is going to happen is certain people will want to play in their own shirt because the team one is made from cow or sheep or something stupid...

Someone on here has a really good siggy, If there is no rugby in heaven Im not going, and basicly I think, if you can't play because of your religion then don't play, simple as that... Why should the game revolve around one person when the other 29 members in your squad dont mind playing on a Sunday?

 

[TNT88]

Why did this turn into some kind of religious debate? The post above mine (that should be ignored) is just completely ridiculous and if I was a religious person it would make me think atheists are morons. *hint* Try reading the article before you post about it...

Keep it on topic. He doesn't want to impose his views on anyone, he was just quoted saying why he wont play on Sunday. If people think it is disrespectful to his team, then fine, but other than that I see no real objection to his actions.

 

[LittleGuy]

Why did this turn into some kind of religious debate? The post above mine (that should be ignored) is just completely ridiculous and if I was a religious person it would make me think atheists are morons. *hint* Try reading the article before you post about it...

Keep it on topic. He doesn't want to impose his views on anyone, he was just quoted saying why he wont play on Sunday. If people think it is disrespectful to his team, then fine, but other than that I see no real objection to his actions.

As soon as the thread got started it was a religious debate, since Euan has decided not to play for religious reasons. While Dizzy may have gone off topic, it's hardly "above" the debate to launch a thinly veiled personal attack on him which incindentally is the second such time in which members of TRF did not respect his decisions have been indirectly crticized personally as bigots or morons. In my case my original posting was WUMMISH enough that it was partially warranted.

 

[kovana]

Atheism is the new Mormonism.

 

[nickdnz]

Weird debate. Obviously you cannot demand that a RWC cancel Sunday games because of your beliefs. You don't see the RWC being postponed because of Ramadan. I respect Michael Jones not going to the RWC because it was on a Sunday, but it's clearly his choice. You can't delay an international sporting event from what a minority of one religion believe.

I swear we have a religion thread in which all of this has been argued 100x before.

 

[Logorrhea]

Urm ... yes let's not go there because its people like Logorreha and yourself who will offend religious people.

I'm sorry but I should be worried about offending people who have a belief that ... a cosmic Jewish Zombie who was his own father can make you live forever if you symbolically eat his flesh and telepathically tell him you accept him as your master, so he can remove an evil force from your soul that is present in humanity because a rib-woman was convinced by a talking snake to eat from a magical tree? Seriously? You expect me to take people like that seriously?

I take the religious fundies seriously because they will kill me. Anyone with a gun should be taken very seriously. They are of course mad (we all agree there yeah), but lets take em seriously.

I presume you totally accept and respect peoples belief in the invisible pink unicorn? or the worship of the big flying spagetti monster? Do you feel comfortable when they start talkign about how important it is to them, how they were touched by the noodley appendage, how they live their live according to the laws set out in Bobbys book? You wouldnt dare laugh at them because you are consistent in your beliefs to respect all "religions". You also respect the views of the muslim fundies, the same as do with the christian fundies yeah? Convert or die, apostacy deserves death etc. Once its written in a book your okay with it I take it? Or maybe your more of a pic-n-mix kinda guy? Take the good bits, leave out the bad bits?

One thing I would respect would be anyone who came to their beliefs as an adult. If it was his own decision as opposed to the 99% or the sheep who just believe what their parents did. It means hes twice as mad but I can respect that kind of madness.

 

[Logorrhea]

I swear we have a religion thread in which all of this has been argued 100x before.

We did but you guys got all defensive and shut it down I believe. This is a whole new audience though. All the old heads have moved on. This thread will go the same way though.

 

[Saintjay]

Man, this is a little deep for me.

Then again I don't think even Jesus could have pulled off the passes Cooper attempted against Ireland. As they say keep it simple stupid, or prehaps he just has a god complex.

 

[SelimNiai]

How has there not been a Life Of Brian quote yet?!?

 

[gingergenius]

Disagree completely and I think that is a slight insult towards someone who has religious belief's, people must respect Murray's view even if they disagree with it.

Jonathan Edwards was another who did not participate on Sunday's.

No. People must respect Murray's right to have a view and his right to pursue it, providing it affects nobody else. I have no respect for his view, I think he's an idiot - that's my right too.

Exactly the same position as that Romanian fool who wouldn't get on a plane.

 

[no-1-rugby-fan]

Disagree completely and I think that is a slight insult towards someone who has religious belief's, people must respect Murray's view even if they disagree with it.

Jonathan Edwards was another who did not participate on Sunday's.

I respect his own views, if he feels that way then fine but I'm just saying that's not me.