Is Rugby Growing Faster in Argentina or Italy?

[RWC2011Fan]

What do you guys think? I know Argentina's only been in TRC for less than two seasons, but rugby's been on the rise there for some time.

 

[Big Ewis]

great question...I just don't know.
I'd imagine, maybe, Argentina: they're the newest addition to one of two major annual int'l tournaments in the sport. Italy's been in the 6N for the past 13 years and the popularity seems stagnant now. Their teams in the RaboDirect league don't seem to be making much progress for an outsider, though maybe ppl familiar with them would say the opposite, but probably just on details though, nothing considerably moving forward...

I take, though it may not be all that telling perhaps, the mere fact that we've got so many Argies on this very forum as testament. We've got like 1 Italian and he lives in London, and those are all authentic Argies from the land.
And then there's just simply success: Argentina did reach 3rd place world wide, and with their fine results last year in the tournament despite no win...
Plus the crowd looks absolutely ecstatic each time I watch a match that takes place in Argentina. Italian fans are also rather virulent, but it doesn't seem to be quite as intense.

And I'd like to say that Italians are just far too attached to their footie, but the same can be said about the Argies obviously.
But the Argies do have a far wider spectrum of sports they touch on - they've got world-class, respectable Rugby and Basketball teams as well as Soccer, and they seem present in many other fields. It seems Argentina has really developed the whole sports dimension as an int'l strength per se, while Italy seems more stuck on historical and cultural preferences (for Soccer, mainly).

Hopefully some Argies can give us some answers here.

 

[TRF_stormer2010]

great question...I just don't know.
I'd imagine, maybe, Argentina: they're the newest addition to one of two major annual int'l tournaments in the sport. Italy's been in the 6N for the past 13 years and the popularity seems stagnant now. Their teams in the RaboDirect league don't seem to be making much progress for an outsider, though maybe ppl familiar with them would say the opposite, but probably just on details though, nothing considerably moving forward...

I take, though it may not be all that telling perhaps, the mere fact that we've got so many Argies on this very forum as testament. We've got like 1 Italian and he lives in London, and those are all authentic Argies from the land.
And then there's just simply success: Argentina did reach 3rd place world wide, and with their fine results last year in the tournament despite no win...
Plus the crowd looks absolutely ecstatic each time I watch a match that takes place in Argentina. Italian fans are also rather virulent, but it doesn't seem to be quite as intense.

And I'd like to say that Italians are just far too attached to their footie, but the same can be said about the Argies obviously.
But the Argies do have a far wider spectrum of sports they touch on - they've got world-class, respectable Rugby and Basketball teams as well as Soccer, and they seem present in many other fields. It seems Argentina has really developed the whole sports dimension as an int'l strength per se, while Italy seems more stuck on historical and cultural preferences (for Soccer, mainly).

Hopefully some Argies can give us some answers here.

Don't forget field hockey where I see their women's team as arguably the finest (ITO merit, on looks the Dutch take it hands down).

IF they manage to beat Aus at home (and Aus lose in SA) they'll likely top Aus on the Rugby Championship log. That would surely be seen as a big step up (or return to form) for Argentine rugby and success will be a big determining factor for popularity IMO.

 

[Superalexmarket]

The rugby in Argentina is still the sport of the elite, such as Polo. Although in recent years this concept has changed a bit and is a little more massified.
Anyway, football is by far the most popular sport, second the GT race car (TC 2000 and TC) third basketball, tennis, and rugby, hockey is popular in girls. In the province of Tucuman is the second sport and in the 80's was number one by far.

 

[Big Ewis]

Don't forget field hockey where I see their women's team as arguably the finest (ITO merit, on looks the Dutch take it hands down).

hah, but of course ! how could I uhh..forget..?

 

[Superalexmarket]

great question...I just don't know.
I'd imagine, maybe, Argentina: they're the newest addition to one of two major annual int'l tournaments in the sport. Italy's been in the 6N for the past 13 years and the popularity seems stagnant now. Their teams in the RaboDirect league don't seem to be making much progress for an outsider, though maybe ppl familiar with them would say the opposite, but probably just on details though, nothing considerably moving forward...

I take, though it may not be all that telling perhaps, the mere fact that we've got so many Argies on this very forum as testament. We've got like 1 Italian and he lives in London, and those are all authentic Argies from the land.
And then there's just simply success: Argentina did reach 3rd place world wide, and with their fine results last year in the tournament despite no win...
Plus the crowd looks absolutely ecstatic each time I watch a match that takes place in Argentina. Italian fans are also rather virulent, but it doesn't seem to be quite as intense.

And I'd like to say that Italians are just far too attached to their footie, but the same can be said about the Argies obviously.
But the Argies do have a far wider spectrum of sports they touch on - they've got world-class, respectable Rugby and Basketball teams as well as Soccer, and they seem present in many other fields. It seems Argentina has really developed the whole sports dimension as an int'l strength per se, while Italy seems more stuck on historical and cultural preferences (for Soccer, mainly).

Hopefully some Argies can give us some answers here.

You're absolutely right, we developed very good team sports, not as well as individual performances (excepting tennis) for example in the Olympics, ours amateurs athletes have poor performances. But in team sports the argies are something special...we like to compete and to win, being a little tricky sometimes but with intelligence and smartness too. Greg Popovich says: "Manu Ginobili is most competitive player that I've coached in my life" This post remember me one of my first thread: "Why the argentinians are so competitive in so many sports"...I was punished hard for that topic.

 

[psychic duck]

Italy's been in the 6N for the past 13 years and the popularity seems stagnant now.

So the national team just moved out of a 30,000 stadium for the 6 Nations and into a 70,000 stadium which they are selling out every game and the popularity seems stagnant?

Now I know you don't know much about rugby, but I would have expected that you could have at least observed over the past couple of years the small detail of switching to a stadium of double the capacity and then selling it out.

 

[Jaguares]

The rugby in Argentina is still the sport of the elite, such as Polo. Although in recent years this concept has changed a bit and is a little more massified.
Anyway, football is by far the most popular sport, second the GT race car (TC 2000 and TC) third basketball, tennis, and rugby, hockey is popular in girls. In the province of Tucuman is the second sport and in the 80's was number one by far.

Argentina have 102790 rugby player according to this article:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_rugby_union_playing_countries

One of the countries with the highest number of rugby players:

Cheers

 

[LittleGuy]

Those numbers are really dated and quite probably innacurate anyway does anyone beleive that England number? More recent ones have shown Canada ahead of Scotland and Italy in participation though I've always taken these surveys with a grain of salt.

 

[j'nuh]

Those numbers are really dated and quite probably innacurate anyway does anyone beleive that England number? More recent ones have shown Canada ahead of Scotland and Italy in participation though I've always taken these surveys with a grain of salt.

There are ~3000 rugby clubs in England. If the 2.5m players were true, each club would have 833 players to choose from.

I bet that school kids who play it once a year in PE are included in that figure.

 

[Big Ewis]

You're absolutely right, we developed very good team sports, not as well as individual performances (excepting tennis) for example in the Olympics, ours amateurs athletes have poor performances. But in team sports the argies are something special...we like to compete and to win, being a little tricky sometimes but with intelligence and smartness too. Greg Popovich says: "Manu Ginobili is most competitive player that I've coached in my life" This post remember me one of my first thread: "Why the argentinians are so competitive in so many sports"...I was punished hard for that topic.

well it's more than that man, I'd imagine it's some political strategy of some sort to develop teams in many different fields of sports. Sports are obviously a very important aspect of Argentinian society looking at the Argie presence in basically every main team sports. As I said, the ones I can testify for are Basketball, Rugby and Soccer (don't watch it, but everybody knows Arg. is great, 4 World Cups or smt...).
It seems like Argentina has understood the importance of sports and pushed for a serious development in team sports.

But would you say Rugby is moving forward there ? How popular is the sport there ?
Like, if you were to talk to a few ppl in the street, how many would know about Rugby, how much would they know ? Do you have many friends who are into it ?

 

[Superalexmarket]

Well, answering your question, B..Big Ewis?? (Where the hell is Yoe?) in Argentina 90% of the people knows rugby is a sport (the common answer is:"Rugby? AH..Yes the game with the oval ball, where you hit a lot your rivals!!) and also knows the Pumas is the National Team. From that 90%, the 70% don't have a f...ing idea about the rules, players, others teams (excepting the AB and their haka!) clubs, tournaments, etc.

 

[ratsapprentice]

Well, answering your question, B..Big Ewis?? (Where the hell is Yoe?) in Argentina 90% of the people knows rugby is a sport (the common answer is:"Rugby? AH..Yes the game with the oval ball, where you hit a lot your rivals!!) and also knows the Pumas is the National Team. From that 90%, the 70% don't have a f...ing idea about the rules, players, others teams (excepting the AB and their haka!) clubs, tournaments, etc.

I would say it's the same in England too, probably not quite as bad... but still - most people don't know the rules, or any clubs/players.

Where it is known about and popular, it's very firmly entrenched however.

 

[Wakaloo]

I agree with Superalex. I haven't lived in Argentina for a long time, but if social networks are to be trusted, there was quite a rise in the popularity of rugby during the 2007 RWC. I was born in Rosario, tho, which has a bit of a strong rugby culture (not as much as Tucuman, though). Since 2007, many of the people I have contact with through social networks (that still live there), seem to be more aware.

Which is logical. A good national team performance can do wonders for any given sport, in any country. The opposite happens as well, with Australia's stadiums not being sold out as of late, thanks to a poor Wallabies form.

 

[DuncTheDoodle]

Well, answering your question, B..Big Ewis?? (Where the hell is Yoe?) in Argentina 90% of the people knows rugby is a sport (the common answer is:"Rugby? AH..Yes the game with the oval ball, where you hit a lot your rivals!!) and also knows the Pumas is the National Team. From that 90%, the 70% don't have a f...ing idea about the rules, players, others teams (excepting the AB and their haka!) clubs, tournaments, etc.

Just out of interest, when you talk about player recognition, would the general public know (at least one of) Lobbe/Hernandez/Contempomi (The most famous players) as household names? In a similar way everyone in England could name Jonny Wilkinson, and then I find a large amount can give, perhaps, one or two more contemporary names (Tuilagi, Flood, Ashton, Halfpenny, O'Driscoll are commonplace in terms of recognition), but it's nothing like the stardom of Wilkinson, who is seen as the face of rugby. It's just an idea that interests me.

 

[Big Ewis]

Well, answering your question, B..Big Ewis?? (Where the hell is Yoe?) in Argentina 90% of the people knows rugby is a sport (the common answer is:"Rugby? AH..Yes the game with the oval ball, where you hit a lot your rivals!!) and also knows the Pumas is the National Team. From that 90%, the 70% don't have a f...ing idea about the rules, players, others teams (excepting the AB and their haka!) clubs, tournaments, etc.

ok, that's what I thought. Not too bad then, the situation. But is it still rare or "strange" to find someone who's a fan or actually plays ?
And uh....I..............am Big Ewis. I ate yoe with some sardines and honey mustard.