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Izzy Folau
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<blockquote data-quote="Ragey Erasmus" data-source="post: 1000116" data-attributes="member: 56232"><p>Think I'll just wade in on this. I dislike Folau immensely but I do feel there is a distinct difference between actively pushing a hateful view (as he did before with homophobia) and passively not going along with a certain action. The former leaves little room for doubt about the motive and their stance on an issue but the latter has a much broader grey area in which a person can oppose a specific aspect without necessarily opposing the whole.</p><p></p><p>Do I think Folau is racist? Let's say I wouldn't be surprised to discover he was but at the same time I have not actually seen evidence to suggest he is, unlike with the homophobia. Not kneeling isn't enough for me. I've been watching F1 and a fair few drivers don't kneel and I'm pretty sure none of them are racist or support the police actions against black people in the USA. For example some may oppose it as they may believe it is a predominantly USA problem with the kneeling action a USA response. Others may refuse not because the oppose the message but because people are demanding they do with threats of being branded racist if they don't, which defeats the whole purpose of it.</p><p></p><p>For me personally, I opposed the clapping for the NHS. The first time I had no problem with it but I thought after that it morphed into something completely different. It became an excuse to outdo each other, a tool to attack and shame people for not loving the NHS enough by claiming that your level of support for the NHS was entirely linked to how vigorously and frequently you went out clapping. I opposed it because it seemed that the only acceptable path was to blindly clap for the NHS and let the government off the hook for how they had gutted the service and how they were royally ******* up the Coronavirus response. It was banging the nationalism drum as a way to suppress dissent but just in a different guise. There were people who were happily out there clapping and proclaiming how much they loved the NHS one day but the next were either destroying the service or voting in those who would do that, but it was all ok because they had clapped more than someone else. When things like that happened, it ceased to have any meaning. When people did it for fear of having hate thrown at them, it ceased to have any meaning. Many likely did it not because they wanted to but because they feared reprisal if they didn't. Kneeling is going the same way.</p><p></p><p>Much as I dislike him, I'm prepared to give Folau the benefit of the doubt on this one and the same with anyone else. Until they actively come out and say they oppose BLM and the primary message, I'm prepared to accept there may be other reasons.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Ragey Erasmus, post: 1000116, member: 56232"] Think I'll just wade in on this. I dislike Folau immensely but I do feel there is a distinct difference between actively pushing a hateful view (as he did before with homophobia) and passively not going along with a certain action. The former leaves little room for doubt about the motive and their stance on an issue but the latter has a much broader grey area in which a person can oppose a specific aspect without necessarily opposing the whole. Do I think Folau is racist? Let's say I wouldn't be surprised to discover he was but at the same time I have not actually seen evidence to suggest he is, unlike with the homophobia. Not kneeling isn't enough for me. I've been watching F1 and a fair few drivers don't kneel and I'm pretty sure none of them are racist or support the police actions against black people in the USA. For example some may oppose it as they may believe it is a predominantly USA problem with the kneeling action a USA response. Others may refuse not because the oppose the message but because people are demanding they do with threats of being branded racist if they don't, which defeats the whole purpose of it. For me personally, I opposed the clapping for the NHS. The first time I had no problem with it but I thought after that it morphed into something completely different. It became an excuse to outdo each other, a tool to attack and shame people for not loving the NHS enough by claiming that your level of support for the NHS was entirely linked to how vigorously and frequently you went out clapping. I opposed it because it seemed that the only acceptable path was to blindly clap for the NHS and let the government off the hook for how they had gutted the service and how they were royally ******* up the Coronavirus response. It was banging the nationalism drum as a way to suppress dissent but just in a different guise. There were people who were happily out there clapping and proclaiming how much they loved the NHS one day but the next were either destroying the service or voting in those who would do that, but it was all ok because they had clapped more than someone else. When things like that happened, it ceased to have any meaning. When people did it for fear of having hate thrown at them, it ceased to have any meaning. Many likely did it not because they wanted to but because they feared reprisal if they didn't. Kneeling is going the same way. Much as I dislike him, I'm prepared to give Folau the benefit of the doubt on this one and the same with anyone else. Until they actively come out and say they oppose BLM and the primary message, I'm prepared to accept there may be other reasons. [/QUOTE]
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