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Izzy Folau
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<blockquote data-quote="Umaga&#039;s Witness" data-source="post: 947616" data-attributes="member: 65365"><p>Point 5 was that gender and sexuality are different concepts . You have read this as gender and sex are different concepts. Sex and sexuality are different concepts. But you are absolutely right that people wanting to put themselves in a box is part of the problem. Early feminism was trying to address the issue that The personality assigned to females via social stereotyping didn't hold, for two reasons. 1. It was largely derogatory. 2. Some females simply weren't like that stereotype, they actually held more stereotypically masculine qualities. They essentially didn't like the gender construct, to your point. But, against your point, what happens when you live in a society that still holds strong the definitions of what it is to be a man or a woman but you feel like you are the one that is opposite to what your organs suggest you should be? Should you have the right to put yourself in the other box? In other words should you have the right to tell society outrightly that actually if you insist on defining me I would like you to know that I am actually like the other sex? Yo could say the problem really is about people wanting to put others in a box and that sometimes the only way out is to put yourself in one.</p><p></p><p>There is actually An argument to not raise your kids gender neutral that is analogous to the argument to call yourself the gender opposite to your sex; that is, because society has already defined what boy and girl means and I don't want my kid to not belong, hence get picked on.</p><p></p><p>Ok I take your point regarding point 6, I understand it better now. Still, you could address the issues you describe by calling them "kid" almost all the time, except when their sex was relevant. eg when they are good don't call them a good boy but when they are a horny teenager you might say "hey dont be ashamed if you want to ********** ten times a day, it just means you have a whole heap of testosterone, it's natural, especially for boys but everyone is different." Or "boys have penises". Calling them boy all the time though suggests to them that it is a fundamental defining trait that applies all the time and not just when there is something specific to their sex. And I get that the stereotyping has changed, but it's still there.</p><p></p><p>Oh and yes I 100 percent agree about the outside influences, see point 3. Also see points 2 and 1</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Umaga's Witness, post: 947616, member: 65365"] Point 5 was that gender and sexuality are different concepts . You have read this as gender and sex are different concepts. Sex and sexuality are different concepts. But you are absolutely right that people wanting to put themselves in a box is part of the problem. Early feminism was trying to address the issue that The personality assigned to females via social stereotyping didn’t hold, for two reasons. 1. It was largely derogatory. 2. Some females simply weren’t like that stereotype, they actually held more stereotypically masculine qualities. They essentially didn’t like the gender construct, to your point. But, against your point, what happens when you live in a society that still holds strong the definitions of what it is to be a man or a woman but you feel like you are the one that is opposite to what your organs suggest you should be? Should you have the right to put yourself in the other box? In other words should you have the right to tell society outrightly that actually if you insist on defining me I would like you to know that I am actually like the other sex? Yo could say the problem really is about people wanting to put others in a box and that sometimes the only way out is to put yourself in one. There is actually An argument to not raise your kids gender neutral that is analogous to the argument to call yourself the gender opposite to your sex; that is, because society has already defined what boy and girl means and I don’t want my kid to not belong, hence get picked on. Ok I take your point regarding point 6, I understand it better now. Still, you could address the issues you describe by calling them “kid” almost all the time, except when their sex was relevant. eg when they are good don’t call them a good boy but when they are a horny teenager you might say “hey dont be ashamed if you want to ********** ten times a day, it just means you have a whole heap of testosterone, it’s natural, especially for boys but everyone is different.” Or “boys have penises”. Calling them boy all the time though suggests to them that it is a fundamental defining trait that applies all the time and not just when there is something specific to their sex. And I get that the stereotyping has changed, but it’s still there. Oh and yes I 100 percent agree about the outside influences, see point 3. Also see points 2 and 1 [/QUOTE]
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