Should Robshaw Captain England?

[Melhor Time]

The Quins are on fire - the guy has a lot to do with this and he should be in the England team.

Could it well be the path to follow?

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Yes.
He's the best 6 in England, and has been for a while.
Criminal that he hasn't got further than being in training camps (usually called up due to injury) - and playing for "England XV" in Australia

 

[gingergenius]

No. Or not yet.

1) we pick a 6N squad based on premiership form & potential,in January. Robshaw is on course to be named in that, IMO.
2) we then narrow down to a starting XV and matchday 22, which with no Haskell, Easter or Moody, Robshaw's almost certainly going to be involved in.
3) We then decide who to pick in the back row. At the moment I'm saying wait and see until nearer the time, but if we were playing Scotland next weekend, we have two conundrums to think about:

at 6, we can choose from the incumbent Tom Croft, or the in-form Robshaw. I'd go with the latter, with Croft on the bench.
at 7 we have Wood, maybe Seymour or some other openside have put their hand up but Wood's pretty bloody obvious right now.
at 8 we do't know yet, maybe Waldrom or someone else relatively untested.

Out of that, only Wood would be guaranteed a place, and if Robshaw cannot even be guaranteed a place, and is also making his test debut, then no he should not be captain.

Captaincy should be decided once we've picked the XV, and I'm pretty certain that that means it'll be Hartley, Wood or Flood. Cole/ Lawes/ Tuilagi etc. don't strike me as captaincy material.

 

[stus768]

Robshaw did pretty well at 8 yesterday..........

 

[j'nuh]

But even if we had Robshaw captaining from 8, that only offsets the selection issue for a year until Haskell gets back. I can see some major rotation at 6/8 through Haskell, Croft and Robshaw, with possibly Morgan and Waldrom around as well, whereas Wood should probably be starting every game. So really you have to make Wood the captain if you wanted one in the backrow.

Captaincy should be decided once we've picked the XV, and I'm pretty certain that that means it'll be Hartley, Wood or Flood. Cole/ Lawes/ Tuilagi etc. don't strike me as captaincy material.

tbh, no matter who captains the team in the six nations, the issue of captaincy will come up again when a permanent coach gets selected. This question could probably wait half a year until the summer internationals. It does also give Robshaw the chance in the six nations to make himself the starting 6/8 during the six nations. Although, it might be that whoever captains in the six nations is their captaincy to lose, especially if the interim coach ends up staying on.

 

[Peat]

I am pretty sure Robshaw has played more games at 7 than at 6 over the past couple of years and therefore questioning why people are talking of him as a 6.

He is course also picking up a fair few games at 8 too.

If Robshaw can justify a place in the England back-row - which is basically a question of 'will Robshaw make the step-up to international rugby in the same form he plays domestic' - then he is the natural captain there. Whether its fair to make him captain before we've established that is another question.

However, as I believe he's a very grounded man, a natural leader, and have little doubts about his ability to play test-level rugby... I'll just go OTT and say

DO EET!

edit: Robshaw playing at 8 does open up a mildly risky possible unit for England in the 6N if all are fit and in form -

6. Croft
7. Wood
8. Robshaw

(sub: Fearns ideally)

Looks good doesn't it?

 

[TRF_Olyy]

I am pretty sure Robshaw has played more games at 7 than at 6 over the past couple of years and therefore questioning why people are talking of him as a 6.

Nope, he only covered 7 when Skinner was out
This season he's played 6 all apart from two games (one at 7, one at 8), last season he played a bit more elsewhere (6 at 7, 4 at 8) but still the majority at 6

 

[nickdnz]

I think it's pretty obvious Simon Shaw should be the captain going into the next World Cup...

 

[lynam1104]

Surly Johnson stepped down form coaching to lead them on the pitch i'd put a tenner on it

 

[Peat]

Nope, he only covered 7 when Skinner was out
This season he's played 6 all apart from two games (one at 7, one at 8), last season he played a bit more elsewhere (6 at 7, 4 at 8) but still the majority at 6

I like your stattoism - however, I suspect he'd have played more at 7 if Guest had kept fit for once in his life (Skinner's definitley down and out on the kerb at Quins for the time being). Guest and Rees - two-thirds of what would have been a credible back-row for England, if only they could have stopped breaking...

But anyway. I'll admit to being wrong on the amount of time Robshaw's spent at 7... however, its still enough for me to chuck him in there.

Basically... what I'm saying is... I don't care how, but just get him on the pitch.

 

[Saintjay]

Martin Corry believes it is out of Flood, Wood and Croft.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugby_union/16025278.stm

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Basically... what I'm saying is... I don't care how, but just get him on the pitch.

Drop Croft then - current Robshaw >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> current Croft

 

[Gavin]

Martin Corry believes it is out of Flood, Wood and Croft.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugby_union/16025278.stm

Flood? God no.

 

[j'nuh]

I would have liked to see Flood as captain, and think he could be a good one, but I think he's got a bit too much competition for the shirt at the minute. I'm hoping Burns will play off the bench during the six nations.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Flood folds in big games/pressure situations (England vs Ireland, Tigers vs Leinster/Saracens) - can't really have a captain like that

Pity that we've got no "Friendlies" in the lead up to the 6N to see who puts their hand up for it
Suppose they can/will make their decision on who looks like it during training - I reckon if Robshaw is starting the first match in the 6N then he'll be Captain. He captained England XV vs Aussie Barbarians, so has experience of it at Premiership, Euro and (kind of) International level

 

[stus768]

Don't rate Flood as a world class player

 

[j'nuh]

Flood folds in big games/pressure situations (England vs Ireland, Tigers vs Leinster/Saracens) - can't really have a captain like that

The whole team folded against Ireland, tbf, like most of the team folded in the WC. I find it hard to criticise a player for having a few bad games - most players will go through a patch where they struggle. When Hartley's leadership credentials are talked about, there's hardly any mention of him choking in the lineout last year(?) for a few games, where he couldn't throw a ball straight.

 

[stus768]

Croft probably will have to play, if only for his lineouts- Palmer will not be eligible. Guess this also means we may be stuck with deacon.

 

[Peat]

Drop Croft then - current Robshaw >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> current Croft

Someone needs to light a fire under Croft's arse, but should he refind form he has to be in the team. So I'd start looking for ways to accomodate both already.

Besides, come 6N, I'm expecting Croft, Robshaw and Wood to be our three best available. Fearns has picked a bad time to get injured, as has Guest, Morgan's picked a bad time to decide he's Welsh, Narraway is struggling to get into the Glaws side which baffles me, Gibson should be in contention but is still behind the three named... Seymour should be in contention if he maintains form... as such, I'd expect to see Robshaw and Croft on the same pitch at some point; as either as 8 and 6, 7 and 6, or starter and replacement.

Flood would be my choice of captain if Robshaw doesn't play if it wasn't for the two games you mention. I'm kinda curious to see if they were just one-offs when he was in bad form/had his kicking destroyed by Alred.

Stus - If Deacon plays for England again I will burn Twickenham to the ground. Lawes plus one of Parling/Robson please (add Attwood to the list if he gets regular games for Bath). Garvey at LI is my dark horse for selection.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

I don't particularly rate Hartley, he's the best of a bad bunch of English hookers. There are a few coming through now who could/should be tested internationally, which is good, but before there was a choice between Hartley, Chuter, Mears and Thompson, of which Hartley and Thompson are the obvious choices.

Croft probably will have to play, if only for his lineouts- Palmer will not be eligible. Guess this also means we may be stuck with deacon.

Urgh, I was just sick in my mouth a bit.
Get Christian Day in if you want a lineout guy - or even Kearnan Myall
We're going to need to look for a new lineout lock anyway because, as you said, Palmer is (probably) not going to get picked again, and Lawes/Attwood are more bruisers than lineout operators.

Definitely not James Gaskell though

Seymour should be in contention if he maintains form

Seymour has no problem with dipping form - he's been consistently brilliant since he arrived at Sale, injuries were his problem though as he kept messing up his shoulder(s) and disappearing for months - Seems to have gotten over that after a lengthy lay off last season to properly rehab though