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Super 15 2011

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Wally @ May 18 2009, 03:11 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>
Well aside from that, I hardly see the ARU letting the fact they are known as Queensland or NSW get in the way of growing the game for history's sake. Gold Coast and Western Sydney will eventually warrant teams. That is if we ever want rugby to upgrade from it's 'boutique' status and actually compete with the other codes on a serious level. Being the fourth most popular football code is not good enough.[/b]

I think we would be better off having these teams compete in a domestic competition than the Super 14...

We don't really need more teams in the Super 14...
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Woldog @ May 18 2009, 02:41 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>
Plus the Reds have been there for 2009 years ever since Jesus played Fullback, so they can't go from being the Queensland Reds to being the Brisbane Reds or simply the QR Reds.[/b]

Even if Christ was from Queensland he'd still move down and play for the Brumbies... :lol:
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Fushitsusha @ May 18 2009, 04:32 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Wally @ May 18 2009, 03:11 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Well aside from that, I hardly see the ARU letting the fact they are known as Queensland or NSW get in the way of growing the game for history's sake. Gold Coast and Western Sydney will eventually warrant teams. That is if we ever want rugby to upgrade from it's 'boutique' status and actually compete with the other codes on a serious level. Being the fourth most popular football code is not good enough.[/b]

I think we would be better off having these teams compete in a domestic competition than the Super 14...

We don't really need more teams in the Super 14...
[/b][/quote]
There will never be a sustainable domestic competition while we have Super 14/15 etc. Therefore we have to at least aim to one day offer something that is competitive with the NRL and AFL. With this new conference style of competition, there is defiantly potential for that.
 
And there'll probably never be a Gold Coast or Western Sydney team in a Super competition involving South Africa and New Zealand...
 
Well, I don't think adding in another team from Australia is really going to do anything. I do kind of like the 3 conference idea. The only thing is it could be hard on NZ teams as it wouldn't exactly be great for my Hurricanes playing the Crusaders twice a season. Of course, the conference idea will also take up a lot more time but that could be good as well.

I think the Australian team should probably be in Melbourne. Of course the problem with adding another team could be that they are uncompetitive. You can't expect to get many NZers. New Zealanders can earn much more in Europe so they would be more like to go there before going to Australia.
 
fair point william 18... however i'm hoping not all players will base their decisions on money alone. to a kiwi, australia is still a familiar country which is only a short trip across the tasman. you could attract a lot of the players with families here as we speak the same language (apart from a few words like jandal, dairy and cell phone), and it wouldn't cost as much to relocate a who family over here as it would to relocate a family to europe, our road rules are pretty much the same too and our dollar is worth more so the player would still be earning more than they would in NZ. plus, you can still buy your beer over here so you don't have to drink warm fosters.
 
On William's other point the conference system doesn't exactly work out well for NZL. Currently the finalists are the best out of all teams. So at the moment, you could say the best 4 teams are the Bulls, Chiefs, Hurricanes and Crusaders. From what I can tell from the conference system, there will be an equal amount of teams from each conference, the finals could look like this: Bulls, Chiefs, Waratahs, somming else. This isn't really fair for the Hurricanes + Crusaders as they are better teams than the Waratahs but miss out.

Correct me if this isn't how it will work. But if this is how it works, its BS.
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (tommowins @ May 18 2009, 07:58 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>
On William's other point the conference system doesn't exactly work out well for NZL. Currently the finalists are the best out of all teams. So at the moment, you could say the best 4 teams are the Bulls, Chiefs, Hurricanes and Crusaders. From what I can tell from the conference system, there will be an equal amount of teams from each conference, the finals could look like this: Bulls, Chiefs, Waratahs, somming else. This isn't really fair for the Hurricanes + Crusaders as they are better teams than the Waratahs but miss out.

Correct me if this isn't how it will work. But if this is how it works, its BS.[/b]
That's how it works. Similar to the model used in the NFL and NBA, it works well over there. It's the best thing for the fans and at the end of the day, if it boosts crowd numbers and interest, it's the best thing for teams too.

On the fifth Australian team, regardless of what some may think it is in the best interest of Australian rugby. There is lots of potential talent in Australia, a fifth team will help uncover it and offer opportunities for player who might have otherwise gone to league.
 
Why stretch already stretched recsources? Including a team from say, Argentina, would be more logical if they are seriously considering including them in the 3N. That, I think, could go a long way in solving the problem with all of Argentina's players playing in the NH.
 
i wonder what the team will be called if melbourne gets it.. will they call them the rebels again? :p who knows

if my memory serves me correctly, the rebels were tipped to be wooden spooners... but ended up runners up. it was a top effort from a couple of has beens and never will be's, hopefully the introduction of a melbourne team will have similar results. maybe we can convert mike pyke back to union, get crofty and cockbain out of retirement, sign digby and peter playford up and the tahs will give back luke burgess for nothing apparently, this is easily a winning combination hahaha :p
 
digby is originally from melbourne, and i'm sure he'll come back to his roots as he did when playing for the Rebels :D
 
Well if you want to go back to roots, he was born in NZ and lived there till he was five.
 
Digby will definetly go back to Melbourne if they get a team. That's why the Reds should get him on a two year deal, telling him after that he can go home. Rocky Elsom will go there too.
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Woldog @ May 19 2009, 06:08 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>
Well if you want to go back to roots, he was born in NZ and lived there till he was five.[/b]

really? didn't know that... all I was told is that a guy I know went to school with him as a kid. this was in melbourne's south eastern suburbs
 
Yeah then he came to school in Queensland, at a GPS school making his rugby talent a product of Gregory Terrace in Brisbane :p, Some of the people at my Club played against him in GPS rugby in 2003.
 
Some "new" news and info:

SANZAR reveal new Super Rugby structure

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div>
The Super Rugby competition will stretch from the last weekend in February to the first weekend of August as part of a new-look tournament agreed by the SANZAR partners.

The revamped tournament will feature an extra team as well as an expanded finals series as part of changes to be proposed by the SANZAR partners to broadcasters next month.

The new 24-week Super Rugby competition guarantees each team a minimum of eight home matches and a 16-match regular season. A new six team finals series includes an extra round with two "sudden-death" qualifiers before the semifinals.

All teams will have a three-week bye while the tournament is suspended during the June International Test window, while the TriNations series has also been given a new time slot in the calendar to run at the conclusion of Super Rugby.
The expanded competition has a 2011 launch date, with the current broadcast agreement to expire at the end of 2010.

"It has been an intense negotiation but we believe the outcome is a very good one for rugby, for the SANZAR alliance, for our players and fans and for broadcasters," said Andy Marinos, the CEO of SANZAR.


"We were all committed to an expanded tournament and have been able to make it work, taking into account the different landscapes of our domestic game. What we have agreed upon is a competition with added domestic interest and a compelling international component that will see Super Rugby retain its status as rugby's toughest provincial competition."

Key features of the proposed new SANZAR landscape are:
- A 15th team playing in the Australian conference will be added to Super Rugby following a tender process open to all territories, and with SANZAR making the decision on the new side's location. A timetable for tenders will be released shortly to ensure adequate lead-in time is provided to the successful bidder;

- The Tournament will kick off in the last week of February and conclude in the first week of August, except in 2011 when the calendar will be shifted earlier to accommodate Rugby World Cup;

- Teams will be divided into three national Conferences of five teams each. The new team will compete in the Australian Conference;

- Teams play the other four teams in their Conference twice (home and away);

- Teams play four out of the five teams from the other two Conferences (four home, four away)

- All teams will have a three-week bye during the June Test window;

- The three Conference winners and three wildcard teams with the highest number of competition points from any Conference qualify for the play-offs;

-The wildcard teams and the Conference winner with the least competition points will play an elimination round to meet the two Conference winners with the greatest number of competition points in the semifinals

- The TriNations will always kick-off in South Africa in mid-August and conclude with two of the three trans-Tasman matches in early October to allow for early release of Springboks to Currie Cup. This will allow for TriNations tests between particular teams in particular countries to become permanent fixtures on the rugby calendar.


Australian Rugby Union Managing Director and CEO John O'Neill said: "This new structure will enable us to further embed Super Rugby as the premier provincial competition in world rugby.

"The extended season, the home and away local derbies and a new-look finals series – we are building on what has already been an enormously successful Rugby tournament.

"This is an important and necessary evolution for Super Rugby and the fans, I'm sure, will embrace the changes we have made.
"From an Australian perspective, having a presence in the marketplace from February to August delivers us the capacity to compete with the other codes from a stronger and more compelling position.

"Australia is the only country in the world where four football codes compete head to head.

"Expanding the Super Rugby season presents us with a wonderful opportunity to further increase the profile and popularity of our game – and in the long term that will benefit SANZAR and the game worldwide."

NZRU CEO Steve Tew said the agreement was a welcome one for rugby in New Zealand given the value that New Zealand's fans, players, partners and media place on the strength of the southern hemisphere competitions and the contribution that makes to maintaining the competitive edge for rugby below the equator.
"We have said at every juncture that our preference was to maintain the three-country alliance and to build on it. We are delighted that we have reached an agreement which allows us to move the Super Rugby competition to a new platform which we believe will capture and excite rugby fans in all three countries.

"It will also create benefits for our players and Super Rugby franchises and give us a certain competition structure we can build on in future years and a protected window for our domestic competitions."

The SANZAR partners will present the proposed structure to the rights-holding News Corporation by the end of June.

Any new deal only comes into force from the 2011 season.

Fact Box - What the changes mean Super Rugby from 2011

Number of teams 14 - New format increases it to - 15

Regular season matches per team 13 - New format increases it to - 16

Regular season home matches per team 6 or 7 - New format increases it to - 8

Regular season away matches per team 6 or 7- New format increases it to - 8

Total number of regular season matches 91 - New format increases it to - 120

Regular season matches played in each country
NZ/SA - 32 or 33
Aus - 26
- New format increases it to -
NZ/SA - 40
Aus - 40 x

Play-offs format 4 teams over two weeks - - New format increases it to - - 6 teams over three weeks

Number of play-off matches 3 - New format increases it to - 5

Number of play-off matches guaranteed per country None - New format increases it to - 1

Byes per team 1 - New format increases it to - RWC year - 2 Standard year - 5
Total competition length (weeks) 16 RWC year - 21 Standard year - 24
Start date 13 February (2009)
New format
RWC year - 19 February
Standard year - 25 February
End date 30 May (2009)
RWC year - 9 July
Standard year - 4 August

x If the new team is an Australian franchise[/b]
http://www.super14.com/news/viewarticle.asp?id=20375

Just make the 15th team an Australian and get it over and done with, each country then has five teams and all is fair and square
 
Players are going to die from all that playing.

Just scrap the Tri Nations already and bring back touring.
 
Argh, what the hell.
And they expect the players to play the Currie Cup as well? I don't like this format but it seems pretty much set.
Although I hear this somehow takes away some of the hectic traveling SA sides need to do? Not sure how.

The Currie Cup must be played in a FA Cup style now imo.

EDIT: The Tri Nations also need to go back to 2 games against each nation, 3 is over kill. Anyone else get the feeling they trying to squeeze too much money out of this?
 

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