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The Climate crisis

Bada-Bing! said:
Conflicting evidence of what? That global temperatures are increasing past 1.5degrees C.

That polar ice caps are melting?
That we are getting more extreme weather events?
That we are getting more droughts?
That the Great Barrier Reef is bleaching?

He's a hypocrite.

Yes, hypocrisy. Doesn't mean we shouldn't do something about it.

How? Does that justify Trump withdrawing from it?

That doesn't mean we shouldn't strive to get to net zero and you're using these individual instances to deflect.

And India and China are part of the problem and solution. Look at China really ramping up solar panel, battery technology. Hell even Trump knows in his twisted way hence why he's after Ukraine's REMs.

Simple things can be done now whilst not reducing living standards.

I am not saying switching all to EVs overnight. The UK just has too many vehicles on the roads. Congestion and producing fumes is not making our living standards any better.

How about you know parents not continually dropping and picking up their kids from school in gas guzzling SUVs. What is that teaching the next generation?

Designing our urban environments to priorities people instead of cars.

It is and that is why there needs a discussion.
But debating how exactly man is contributing is again deflection. We are. Just those who choose to are again trying to deflect and slow for their own greed. Oh you know Oil, Gas companies. Those with self interest in delaying it as long as possible.

Not going to end, but severe, irreversible consequences.

And of course you are entitled to as an individual.
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Heya bud, jesus I didn't see this reply, it seems so in depth I feel like it would be a disservice to you not to respond, I will try, but also prob ask 10 more questions lol
 
Bada-Bing! said:
www.bbc.co.uk

Three years left to limit warming to 1.5C, top scientists warn

The Earth could be doomed to breach a key climate target in as little as three years, scientists warn.
www.bbc.co.uk www.bbc.co.uk

We're f'd! Looks like we'll just have to live with the consequences of it. More migration from places impacted, food prices rocketing, inequality increasing more so.
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If it makes you feel better, we never had a chance. China consistently did what they wanted, emit 30% odd of the planets emissions, and were allowed carte blanched until 2030.

Nothing from the Paris accord was monitored accurately, or anyone made accountable, and politicking was more important than solving the problem.

It's interesting, some of the reasons given for governments not taking climate change seriously is lack of public awareness hahaha like what, that's all anyone has heard in the west since the 80s, we were constantly told we are on the cliff edge. I think those who ring the bell have catastrophised too much and have essentially had a 100% failure rate in predictions, its not about awareness, its about a bad reputation problem, and organisations like JSO just seem to compound that problem.
 
dirty harry said:
If it makes you feel better, we never had a chance. China consistently did what they wanted, emit 30% odd of the planets emissions, and were allowed carte blanched until 2030.

Nothing from the Paris accord was monitored accurately, or anyone made accountable, and politicking was more important than solving the problem.
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Not just China - although biggest polluters; USA, India, Russia together emitting well over half of the carbon missions.

The issue is no country wants to give up emitting carbon for greater good. All moving in different directions and targets - 2050, 2070 …. And no enforcement if ever they reach it.

UK 1% of global emissions but not including carbon imported. And doesn't take into account carbon emissions to get to where we are (Industrial Revolution). Who can blame other developing countries for wanting to
Better their economy and people? And now all Reeves is concentrated on is Growth!

Population of planet 8 billion and counting. We're not going to get there are we?

dirty harry said:
It's interesting, some of the reasons given for governments not taking climate change seriously is lack of public awareness hahaha like what, that's all anyone has heard in the west since the 80s, we need were constantly told we are on the cliff edge. I think those who ring the bell have catastrophised too much and have essentially had a 100% failure rate in predictions, its not about awareness, its about a bad reputation problem, and organisations like JSO just seem to compound that problem.
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Or lack of anyone giving monkeys anymore. We live in a consumer society.
 
I think generally speaking politicians have no appetite for long term policies because firstly they don't know they'll be in government anyway (unlikely any government will be in charge for 20-30 consecutive years) but secondly, and more importantly, they're like that because we don't give a ****. People don't want to vote on things that will benefit us in 50 years time. They want money in their pocket and a good quality of life now. Selfish I know but reality at the end of the day. They'll only be change when people see the negatives before their very eyes but by that point obviously it's a present problem and not something that's going to **** us in the next hundred years or so.
 
Bada-Bing! said:
Not just China - although biggest polluters; USA, India, Russia together emitting well over half of the carbon missions.

The issue is no country wants to give up emitting carbon for greater good. All moving in different directions and targets - 2050, 2070 …. And no enforcement if ever they reach it.

UK 1% of global emissions but not including carbon imported. And doesn't take into account carbon emissions to get to where we are (Industrial Revolution). Who can blame other developing countries for wanting to
Better their economy and people? And now all Reeves is concentrated on is Growth!

Population of planet 8 billion and counting. We're not going to get there are we?


Or lack of anyone giving monkeys anymore. We live in a consumer society.
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Don't disagree with this, i think it's probably easy to single out China being their a third of the problem, and they're outspoken about growth. Ultimately it will all be for nothing though...

8 billion and counting... so far, population is a weird thing, we've been concerned about over population for decades, now its population collapse that's the real issue, and may be part of the reason western government's have opened the floodgates (well most lol).

Your right, I still find the idea that people in the UK import cheap nonsense absolute crap from China for a 15% discount wild.

Consumerism is crazy when you think of it, i argue constantly with my other half, we do not need 7 gomret style varied world cuisine dinners every week. I could make a cheap nutritious cawl on a Monday, and it would feed the family of 4 Monday Wednesday and Friday, but no... we are too spoilt in the west!
 
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Welsh Exile said:
I think generally speaking politicians have no appetite for long term policies because firstly they don't know they'll be in government anyway (unlikely any government will be in charge for 20-30 consecutive years) but secondly, and more importantly, they're like that because we don't give a ****. People don't want to vote on things that will benefit us in 50 years time. They want money in their pocket and a good quality of life now. Selfish I know but reality at the end of the day. They'll only be change when people see the negatives before their very eyes but by that point obviously it's a present problem and not something that's going to **** us in the next hundred years or so.
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I think this is why parties like reform have such an edge as opposition. Their base is only growing, and well when you work 40 hours a week, and can't afford to eat and pay your mortgage this month, you have to prioritise.

Way down the list comes long term environmentalism. It's why JSO are made of retired, and middle class students who have the privilege of thinking that far ahead.

We've probably all tasted poverty, I spent my childhood hiding behind sofas from the local loan shark lol. I've been in the position where I've been scrambling for shifts to cover the water bill, and a friday night chip shop (no not fish) was a treat. I never once spent a second considering CO2, because frankly I couldn't have cared less, and what could I actually do.

I think to add to your point though, most people are helpless to consider it, we have been trained by global news and Internet to be concerned about these huge, and hugely complex global issues, and very few of us can comprehend the problem, let alone the solution. All most people want to do is afford their bills, and be able to play with their kids in the park on the weekends.
 
dirty harry said:
Your right, I still find the idea that people in the UK import cheap nonsense absolute crap from China for a 15% discount wild.
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You say that but that is a major factor why inflation was so low pre-Covid. Consumers are driven by price and continue to be and why Trump with his whole tariffs policy won't work in the long run.
 
Bada-Bing! said:
You say that but that is a major factor why inflation was so low pre-Covid. Consumers are driven by price and continue to be and why Trump with his whole tariffs policy won't work in the long run.
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I mean you say that, bit if China receives a high Tarriff, the consumers who are driven by price will buy local no?

I mean, Temu, Wish, Shein, and co are literally only in business due to their prices. Let's say Starmer say there will be a 50% tarriff on those websites, British companies sales would increase?
 
dirty harry said:
I mean you say that, bit if China receives a high Tarriff, the consumers who are driven by price will buy local no?

I mean, Temu, Wish, Shein, and co are literally only in business due to their prices. Let's say Starmer say there will be a 50% tarriff on those websites, British companies sales would increase?
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British companies making cheap goods? Which planet do you live on? That's the whole point why these goods are made in China because of the current cheap labour and abundance of it. British workers cost too much when you factor in min wage, pension conts, NI. Tariffs still wouldn't magically make this go away and level the playing field and just fuel inflation again.

Starmer would be a fool if he starts adopting Tariffs on China given his Govt's obsession with Growth and requiring investment from China.
 
Bada-Bing! said:
British companies making cheap goods? Which planet do you live on? That's the whole point why these goods are made in China because of the current cheap labour and abundance of it. British workers cost too much when you factor in min wage, pension conts, NI. Tariffs still wouldn't magically make this go away and level the playing field and just fuel inflation again.

Starmer would be a fool if he starts adopting Tariffs on China given his Govt's obsession with Growth and requiring investment from China.
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That's my point though, British companies don't make cheap goods, but if tarriffs on cheap Chinese goods, or build quality standards were higher the British products would be more competitive.

There are 250k deliver drivers on the roads in the UK, vocalising production, and reducing importa would be a good step environmentally no?
 
dirty harry said:
That's my point though, British companies don't make cheap goods, but if tarriffs on cheap Chinese goods, or build quality standards were higher the British products would be more competitive.
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The problem is that it takes a long time to suddenly create industries for these so called cheap goods. There is no value to British companies who would then need to take into account global supply chains, raw materials on top of labour costs. This is one of the reasons why manufacturing in the country has died and we're predominantly a service economy - the financial services being the biggest contributor to GDP. Such industries don't come out of thin air.
dirty harry said:
There are 250k deliver drivers on the roads in the UK, vocalising production, and reducing importa would be a good step environmentally no?
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eh?

We're coming back to the whole cost of the product produced. Even if you reduce imports it will just back up prices for imports and then it'll just take time for British companies to replace those goods, and then they would put up their prices fueling inflation as supply doesn't meet demand. It's a distortion of existing market forces.

The whole environmental impact would just be negated through importation of the raw materials to factories to be put together etc.
 
Bada-Bing! said:
The problem is that it takes a long time to suddenly create industries for these so called cheap goods. There is no value to British companies who would then need to take into account global supply chains, raw materials on top of labour costs. This is one of the reasons why manufacturing in the country has died and we're predominantly a service economy - the financial services being the biggest contributor to GDP. Such industries don't come out of thin air.

eh?

We're coming back to the whole cost of the product produced. Even if you reduce imports it will just back up prices for imports and then it'll just take time for British companies to replace those goods, and then they would put up their prices fueling inflation as supply doesn't meet demand. It's a distortion of existing market forces.

The whole environmental impact would just be negated through importation of the raw materials to factories to be put together etc.
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Of course i agree with this, and I'm not claiming it is easy... what I'm saying is we should not be offered 95p strawberries in the middle of January.

If we are talking long term climate fixes, we can't be short term thinking with regards to industry no?
 

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