United Rugby Championship 2021/22

[Leonormous Boozer]

Just a general discussion thread.

I was reading on twitter that one of the SA coaches, possibly Jake White, revealed that current indications are that the tournament will commence the weekend starting 24 September and that the first few weeks will be home derbies to facilitate organising travel later in the season.

Also that if SA remains on the red lists of the UK and Ireland they will find European bases to play from. Hopefully it doesn't come to that.

All a bit up in the air right now and news is hard enough to come by so post anything you come across in here!

 

[big ginger 8]

Munster face tough two-match trip to South Africa ahead of European campaign

Proposed URC fixture list would see champions Leinster open at home to the Bulls

www.irishtimes.com

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

Do lions have to have a rest period?
I think English Lions won't be able to play till October.

 

[big ginger 8]

Do lions have to have a rest period?
I think English Lions won't be able to play till October.

They will yeah as will players involved in the summer games most likely so probably only have the option of going full strength coming up to the end of October at the earliest.

 

[Groundhog]

Munster face tough two-match trip to South Africa ahead of European campaign

Proposed URC fixture list would see champions Leinster open at home to the Bulls

www.irishtimes.com

Could see us sending a pretty young/mixed squad there to be honest. Whatever about the strength of the league we will still go guns blazing at Europe.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

the first few weeks will be home derbies

Thank God, we've not had enough of those recently

 

[TRF_stormer2010]

Will be keeping an eye out for the start of this comp but the Currie Cup has highlighted that from SA we will have the wooden spooner in the Lions. They are propping up the Currie Cup. Current standings:

Bulls 44 (6W/2L)
Sharks 40 (5/2)
Griquas 33
Pumas 32
Western Province 30 (5/5)
Cheetahs 26
Golden Lions 24 (2/7)

Lions also had the benefit of a few points from ties for cancelled games. Not that the Cheetahs are faring much better mind you. WP.. I might be biased but we have a lot of test players that will come into the fold which the likes of the Lions and Cheetahs don't at least not as many. Though I have heard we've lost Kitshoff.

I just hope our top 3 teams don't disgrace themselves. We don't have the depth I think to realistically push for a ***le but at least lets hope we make the first year respectful although the Lions will probably ship a ton of points.

Our structures don't allow for something in the form of a draft but hopefully we (and the Lions) can loan players from the likes of Cheetahs, Pumas and Griquas though I would prefer WP put John Dobson in the cooler and get Stonehouse into the mix. Honestly, I know the backroom will have its impact but Dobson has had more than enough time at the helm and all we've seen is a steady decline from the Coetzee days where the cupboard was bare but at least we were near the tops of tables.

 

[ajwffc]

Free to air partners in the UK have been announced. With BBC Cymru Wales, BBC Sport NI and S4C showing games

 

[ajwffc]

fixtures are out https://www.unitedrugby.com/latest/news/urc-fixtures-202122

 

[TRF_stormer2010]

fixtures are out https://www.unitedrugby.com/latest/news/urc-fixtures-202122

I see Stormers travel vs Munster, Benetton, Edinburgh and Dragons. We will be doing so without our test players sadly as the RC will still be on in Aussie. We'll see how the boys go. Excited regardless.

 

[big ginger 8]

I see Stormers travel vs Munster, Benetton, Edinburgh and Dragons. We will be doing so without our test players sadly as the RC will still be on in Aussie. We'll see how the boys go. Excited regardless.

I'm worried the opening rounds will be a bit of a let down for SA fans. Obviously the Bulls and Stormers have been given Leinster and Munster as big name fixtures but on top of the SA Internationals missing, so too will the home teams be missing their big name players do to mandated rests.

So while the novelty and young players etc may hold the attention of the more hard-core fans, the intensity and standard will likely be a disappointment for the more casual viewer. At least for the first few rounds.

 

[unrated]

Bulls play Leinster
And Sharks play Munster in the first round.

That's the two biggest fixtures to watch out for.
I had hoped our Springboks could play but it seems we are still playing the All Blacks on the same weekend as the first round of fixtures as well as the next weekend. So that guarantees we are down on 14 Springboks. But it's a long season and we need to develop depth and this group of players are developing nicely. There's not much between them and their Springbok counterparts.

However, if both teams were at full strength it would have given the URC a sparkling introduction to the world.

 

[TRF_stormer2010]

I'm worried the opening rounds will be a bit of a let down for SA fans. Obviously the Bulls and Stormers have been given Leinster and Munster as big name fixtures but on top of the SA Internationals missing, so too will the home teams be missing their big name players do to mandated rests.

So while the novelty and young players etc may hold the attention of the more hard-core fans, the intensity and standard will likely be a disappointment for the more casual viewer. At least for the first few rounds.

Ag, from a SAn POV I think we have become accustomed to compromise. It will be exciting enough for our teams just to face off against non Currie Cup teams although I have to say that the current Currie Cup has been a great product to date. I expect a bit of a soft launch to the URC though not ideal will be fine.

Bulls play Leinster
And Sharks play Munster in the first round.

That's the two biggest fixtures to watch out for.
I had hoped our Springboks could play but it seems we are still playing the All Blacks on the same weekend as the first round of fixtures as well as the next weekend. So that guarantees we are down on 14 Springboks. But it's a long season and we need to develop depth and this group of players are developing nicely. There's not much between them and their Springbok counterparts.

However, if both teams were at full strength it would have given the URC a sparkling introduction to the world.

Shucks, I know we are missing a lot of Bokke but didn't know the Sharks are missing 14! Roc nation has been busy. Tdt Nche kolisi Hendricks fassi mapimpi am Nkosi.. Who am I missing?

For us though I hear everyone isn't staying on its Kitshoff Mbonambi Malherbe Orie for some reason PSDT Jantjies and Willemse. Not sure if Specman and Gelant are staying put.

 

[unrated]

Shucks, I know we are missing a lot of Bokke but didn't know the Sharks are missing 14! Roc nation has been busy. Tdt Nche kolisi Hendricks fassi mapimpi am Nkosi.. Who am I missing?

For us though I hear everyone isn't staying on its Kitshoff Mbonambi Malherbe Orie for some reason PSDT Jantjies and Willemse. Not sure if Specman and Gelant are staying put.

It would be cheeky counting Mbonambi as a Sharks player that we are missing to the Springboks. I understand this. So I will tread carefully.

The only reason why I would count Mbonambi is that if he was not selected for the Springboks then he would be starting for the Sharks against Munster on the weekend of 25 September, instead, he will be running out against the All Blacks.

But the list as I have it that would be missing for the first game because they are on Springbok duty or is a capped Springbok that is injured:

1. Thomas du Toit
2. Ox Nche
3. Bongi Mbonambi
4. Siya Kolisi
5. Grant Williams
6. Jaden Hendrikse
7. Lukhanyo Am
8. Aphelele Fassi
9. Makazole Mapimpi
10. Sbu Nkosi
11. Sikumbuzo Notshe

You are right it seems the information I was spreading was incorrect.

I incorrectly counted Yaw Penxe and Sanele Nohamba too, and they were released back to the Shark early on in the Lions tour. That would have made it 13.

Notshe who is out with injury was being billed as a sure pick at 8 with Vermeulen out before his injury.

If Roc Nation and the New York lawyers club can just help us keep the players we produce then I think every Sharks fan would be happy with that as we don't need to buy if the talent is kept in Durban.
Its when we cant keep them that we have to buy some older players to keep the balance.

Under The new ownership, we signed Kolisi (30) , Mbonambi (30 ), Diaz Bonilla (33, Argentina), Ben Taupai (32, Australia), Gerbrand Grobler (29) a South African French veteran and Eduan Keyter (25) a wing from the Griquas who they say is very prolific.
For now, they have also stopped the bleeding of players, so from me, it's a thumbs up so far.



It's sad to see what's happening at the Stormers which is one of the proudest rugby teams SA has produced. They need to get the management of the team out of all these politically charged clubs. Its just pure politics at the moment causing their downfall, the clubs have way too much power and too many of those clubs has been infiltrated by ANC politicians, that's the only reason I can see why WP would put Ebrahim Rasoon in a top management position. What rugby background does he have?
For WP and the Stormers brand to flourish again they need to do the following in my mind.

1. Cut loose from the club system. If they refuse, liquidate the Franchise and reestablish another one private from the clubs. Or take the clubs to court to force their buy out if a private investor is found.
2. Get in private equity, invest in their HPI and make sure they consolidate all the talent in the Western Cape catchment area. Which contains most of the elite rugby Schools in South Africa.
3. With private equity make sure to keep the star players. Don't even need to buy.

Ironically in South Africa, the better the team performs the harder it will be to keep the best players as their good performances push up their value to the point where South African teams cant compete for them Financially anymore. A player scores a hat trick of tries and suddenly French scouts implement ideas of large salaries in their mindsets.

At least now if the players leave for overseas, we will play them in the same leagues again (Especially when we join the Champions Cup) so we will see them on our tv screens much more, and have a better understanding of their form.
[h3][/h3]

 

[unrated]

I'm worried the opening rounds will be a bit of a let down for SA fans. Obviously the Bulls and Stormers have been given Leinster and Munster as big name fixtures but on top of the SA Internationals missing, so too will the home teams be missing their big name players do to mandated rests.

So while the novelty and young players etc may hold the attention of the more hard-core fans, the intensity and standard will likely be a disappointment for the more casual viewer. At least for the first few rounds.

At the moment I think that The Sharks and Bulls will get beatings in the first round. I think at home we will turn the tables, but I consider Munster and Leinster heavy favourites. After one season, the away factor should be less of a concern for Both South African teams as well as the traditional Pro 12 teams. By that point, our young players will have experienced the beating they got in the heavy underfoot conditions and the Europeans would learn to appreciate the rock hard surfaces in the South African Spring to Summer. Also, travelling puts the touring team in the opposite season for a few weeks, which will be a huge adjustment I reckon.

While both sets of teams will have to deal with player losses, I think the Irish have better depth than the South African ones.

I have no concerns for the casual viewer. They are water off ducks feathers. The duck will keep on dipping in new waters.

 

[TRF_stormer2010]

It would be cheeky counting Mbonambi as a Sharks player that we are missing to the Springboks. I understand this. So I will tread carefully.

The only reason why I would count Mbonambi is that if he was not selected for the Springboks then he would be starting for the Sharks against Munster on the weekend of 25 September, instead, he will be running out against the All Blacks.

But the list as I have it that would be missing for the first game because they are on Springbok duty or is a capped Springbok that is injured:

1. Thomas du Toit
2. Ox Nche
3. Bongi Mbonambi
4. Siya Kolisi
5. Grant Williams
6. Jaden Hendrikse
7. Lukhanyo Am
8. Aphelele Fassi
9. Makazole Mapimpi
10. Sbu Nkosi
11. Sikumbuzo Notshe

You are right it seems the information I was spreading was incorrect.

I incorrectly counted Yaw Penxe and Sanele Nohamba too, and they were released back to the Shark early on in the Lions tour. That would have made it 13.

Notshe who is out with injury was being billed as a sure pick at 8 with Vermeulen out before his injury.

If Roc Nation and the New York lawyers club can just help us keep the players we produce then I think every Sharks fan would be happy with that as we don't need to buy if the talent is kept in Durban.
Its when we cant keep them that we have to buy some older players to keep the balance.

Under The new ownership, we signed Kolisi (30) , Mbonambi (30 ), Diaz Bonilla (33, Argentina), Ben Taupai (32, Australia), Gerbrand Grobler (29) a South African French veteran and Eduan Keyter (25) a wing from the Griquas who they say is very prolific.
For now, they have also stopped the bleeding of players, so from me, it's a thumbs up so far.



It's sad to see what's happening at the Stormers which is one of the proudest rugby teams SA has produced. They need to get the management of the team out of all these politically charged clubs. Its just pure politics at the moment causing their downfall, the clubs have way too much power and too many of those clubs has been infiltrated by ANC politicians, that's the only reason I can see why WP would put Ebrahim Rasoon in a top management position. What rugby background does he have?
For WP and the Stormers brand to flourish again they need to do the following in my mind.

1. Cut loose from the club system. If they refuse, liquidate the Franchise and reestablish another one private from the clubs. Or take the clubs to court to force their buy out if a private investor is found.
2. Get in private equity, invest in their HPI and make sure they consolidate all the talent in the Western Cape catchment area. Which contains most of the elite rugby Schools in South Africa.
3. With private equity make sure to keep the star players. Don't even need to buy.

Ironically in South Africa, the better the team performs the harder it will be to keep the best players as their good performances push up their value to the point where South African teams cant compete for them Financially anymore. A player scores a hat trick of tries and suddenly French scouts implement ideas of large salaries in their mindsets.

At least now if the players leave for overseas, we will play them in the same leagues again (Especially when we join the Champions Cup) so we will see them on our tv screens much more, and have a better understanding of their form.
[h3][/h3]

Oy vey that is bad news. I had heard we are losing Kitshoff. Mbonambi is news to me. We have some up and comers but I am not so enthused with our depth in the front row without those two as I am say with our backrow. On top of that you need a few experienced campaigners.

Yeah, the rot starts at the top. It would have been grand if SARU could intervene but I think the WPRU situation is so politically charged they daren't touch it. For me a quick death and then something new springing up would be acceptable but its been a very slow death she is dying and selling off Newlands means the dead duck will float a few more years I am sad to say before we can finally say its dead and lets put in place something streamlined and free of the traditional fetters WP has had to date.

What would a preferred Sharks XV look like then? How close would this be?
1Nche, 2Mbonambi, 3Du Toit, 4Roets, 5Andrews, 6Kolisi, 7Bhutelezi, 8Notshe, 9Hendrikse, 10Bonilla, 11Mapimpi, 12Louw, 13Am, 14Nkosi, 15Fassi
16Adriaanse, 17Van Vuuren, 18?, 19VdMescht, 20Venter, 21Nohamba, 22Bosch, 23?

 

[Al Bangor]

I'm looking forward to the new season. We Are Warriors!

 

[TRF_stormer2010]

The ***le of this thread seems open enough for me to poast what I believe a Stormers 23 could look like. Would appreciate other fans to post something similar if only to get an idea of what teams might take the field. As a Stormers supporter I can't say I am overly optimistic of our chances particularly as I feel we have too young a squad or rather too much movement and little settled combinations on top of not a whole lot of depth. Despite tmy misgivings, what I'd like to see:

1 Leon Lyons
2 Scarra Ntubeni
3 Frans Malherbe
4 Marvin Orie
5 JD Shickerling
6 Deon Fourie
7 PS Du Toit
8 Evan Roos
9 Herschell Jantjies
10 Kade Wolhuter
11 Edwill van der Merwe
12 Damian Willemse
13 Dan du Plessis
14 Seabelo Senatla
15 Warrick Gelant

16 AH Venter
17 JJ Kotze
18 Neethling Fouche
19 Dawid Meihuizen
20 Ernst Van Rhyn
21 Godlin Masimla
22 Tim Swiel
23 Rikus Pretorius

Not too shabby but a very green pack and untested combinations if you consider not too long ago our pack could've read Kitshoff, Mbonambi, Malherbe/Koch/Louw, Etzebeth, PS Du Toit, Kolisi, Elstadt, Vermeulen.

 

[unrated]

Oy vey that is bad news. I had heard we are losing Kitshoff. Mbonambi is news to me. We have some up and comers but I am not so enthused with our depth in the front row without those two as I am say with our backrow. On top of that you need a few experienced campaigners.

Yeah, the rot starts at the top. It would have been grand if SARU could intervene but I think the WPRU situation is so politically charged they daren't touch it. For me a quick death and then something new springing up would be acceptable but its been a very slow death she is dying and selling off Newlands means the dead duck will float a few more years I am sad to say before we can finally say its dead and lets put in place something streamlined and free of the traditional fetters WP has had to date.

What would a preferred Sharks XV look like then? How close would this be?
1Nche, 2Mbonambi, 3Du Toit, 4Roets, 5Andrews, 6Kolisi, 7Bhutelezi, 8Notshe, 9Hendrikse, 10Bonilla, 11Mapimpi, 12Louw, 13Am, 14Nkosi, 15Fassi
16Adriaanse, 17Van Vuuren, 18?, 19VdMescht, 20Venter, 21Nohamba, 22Bosch, 23?

Its been public for a while, Sharks had an Instagram post about welcoming Mbonambi and then he joined Roc Nation.
Did not about Kitshoff.

Your 15 is close, But I don't think Roets will be picked as the first choice, although I think he should. And I don't think Andrews should be the first choice but I think he would be, however, Gerbrand Grobler will probably overtake him soon.

I would have James Venter above Buthelezi at 7. For me, he is more of an 8.

Bosch to keep his place at 10. Bonilla to be a rotational player.
It seems that Marius Louw has lost his spot to the new kid, Marnus Potgieter. The rest is good,

We lost Van der Mescht to the French already. He's gone. They say he is being eyed for their National team. Sharks let him go, said he could never meet his fitness targets. Now he goes to a league that is notorious for not caring about conditioning.

 

[TRF_stormer2010]

Its been public for a while, Sharks had an Instagram post about welcoming Mbonambi and then he joined Roc Nation.
Did not about Kitshoff.

Your 15 is close, But I don't think Roets will be picked as the first choice, although I think he should. And I don't think Andrews should be the first choice but I think he would be, however, Gerbrand Grobler will probably overtake him soon.

I would have James Venter above Buthelezi at 7. For me, he is more of an 8.

Bosch to keep his place at 10. Bonilla to be a rotational player.
It seems that Marius Louw has lost his spot to the new kid, Marnus Potgieter. The rest is good,

We lost Van der Mescht to the French already. He's gone. They say he is being eyed for their National team. Sharks let him go, said he could never meet his fitness targets. Now he goes to a league that is notorious for not caring about conditioning.

Ah, okay, tx! I don't really follow specific teams' social media or even the likes of S24 even so I missed the Mbonambi signing. Kitshoff's news I got from one of our NH posters in the Lions threads.

Agreed on Venter. Kolisi mainly tackles and counter rucks and has a run every so often. You have enough ball carriers in general.

I have a lot of time for Roets. Thinks he adds so much to a scrum in particular. Not sure if he can play a full 80- you havn't used him as such so my assumption is he doesn't have the legs. For such a big boy I can understand that. Pity on VdMescht. I think he has the frame to play test rugby and will fair best in tighter games which is actually what I am expecting in the URC as opposed to CC or Super Rugby. Oh, well its not as if French clubs pinching our up and commers is anything new.

I'll keep an eye on Potgieter. I did like the look of Louw for the Sharks. Thinks he fits your game well. I suppose its only a good thing if there is competition for spots within your squad.