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Quel Carreleur

Quel Carreleur

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Surely deserves a thread of its own now, especially if allowed to evolve into a discussion on all things police.

Another copper in "Mr Rapey" Couzens' unit has been charged with rape
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news...tan-police-officer-charged-rape-hertfordshire



How long until Boris U-Turns on not having a public enquiry? It's the least that needs to happen to start rebuilding trust.
Given that the unit in question is "parliamentary and diplomatic protection" - you'd have to wonder if they've got mates in high places - hence no enquiry to start with.


Would it be an over-reaction to suspend (on full pay) anyone who served in the same unit at the same time as those 2, pending an investigation? If rumours of their behaviour, and Couzens' nickname are true, but they weren't being reported, than surely any colleagues would be guilty of enabling their behaviour - at the least.
 
Talking of "Don't Trust a Copper" - current evidence locallly to me suggests that Vimes had the right of it - trust 'em with the big stuff, but not anything small that hasn't been nailed down (joking btw)
They've been parked up more-or-less outside my house for the last 3 days straight, cordoning off my driveway; where the press have parked up.
I've been bringing them a pot of tea and plate of biscuits 3-4 times a day as they get reasonable coffee and gods-awful tea.
This morning 1 of my mugs, and the milk jug have all gone AWOL!
A] Poor little me, and B] I'm sure it'll turn up

ETA: This one really takes the biscuit!
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-leeds-58842137
 
The_Blindside said:
https://www.theguardian.com/society...icking-plaster-that-reinforces-victim-blaming
Click to expand...
Yeah, it's a good thing in and of itself, but it's far from addressing the actual problem.

I'm not convinced that it reinforces victim blaming for anyone who doesn't victim blame already.
As for the actual issue - Violence by males - I really don't know what the answer is, or could be, or even if an answer is actually possible.

What I do think is important is that we don't let the perfect be the enemy of the achievable - so this app is a good thing and should be encouraged; but it's not (nor does it pretend to be) a solution.
 
Which Tyler said:
As for the actual issue - Violence by males - I really don't know what the answer is, or could be, or even if an answer is actually possible.
Click to expand...
Its the other thing people who hate these things don't like agreeing exists. Stop reinforcing toxic masculinity in young boys. Far easier said than done testosterone is one hell of a drug but also society reinforces a huge amount of behavioural patterns when very young are okay until you reach a certain age and suddenly their not.

I've partially seen it with someone else who's a woman. As a child their mother would never make them apologise or accept responsibility to their actions. As such it led to three years of my wife not talking to her sister and even though they speak now my wife had to grovelling and we've never had a whiff of an apology or acknowledgment they we at least partially responsible. Except in boys rather than one bad parent allowing it to fester they all get it by all of society.


One thing I do think will wane massively that was part of this case is reduction of workplace cultures allowing it or it called on. It'll take time (I'm talking 20-30 years) but you only have to look at what happening in the video games industry to know it will change.
 
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Jings, I'm positively pro-police compared to this forum it seems (and I used to have a job that was about helping ensure the police don't overstep the mark). A few random points I'd make:

i) anecdotally there is a perception in policing in the UK that the Met are culturally a bit more distinct and heavy handed. I heard at COP26, where officers came from all over the UK, that a disproportionate number of complaints about police conduct and attitude was aimed at Met Officers treating the public with borderline contempt.

ii) being a police officer who doesn't manage to escape into a cosy office job is not a job you'd want. They deal in close quarters with the worst of society when they are acting at their worse / are under the influence. Officers are assaulted verbally and physically almost as a matter of routine. Courts often do not pursue assaults against police.

iii) the rollout of body worn cameras for officers is now becoming commonplace. This should help curtail the behaviour of bad apple officers and help force courts to pursue folk that assault officers.

iv) there are increasing numbers of senior officers across the UK who are female and this can only help change culture.

v) as a society we seem to be developing a culture of shouting down simple, evidence based safety guidance that the number one thing anyone of either sex can do to avoid being a victim or culprit of a crime after dark is to moderate your alcohol consumption and keep control of your faculties. The police up here actually had to pull safety information due to suggestions it was victim blaming. This is not helpful.

vi) just because an offence is reported in the increasingly clickbait media, it doesn't mean it happened. It is always wise to wait until an offence has gone through the courts before getting irate. For example:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-60069229
 
The_Blindside said:
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news...oject-alpha-profiling-children-documents-show
Click to expand...
Would we rather 15-21 year olds had weaponry and feuds developed without police having any intelligence on the matter? Or to ignore potential admissions of criminality that are publicly available and might aid investigations? If a kid stabs someone that is potentially two lives ruined. Plus social media is open source. I have zero right to privacy if I start posting hate speech here. It's not my personal data if I'm sharing it on an unlocked social media account.

I have no idea if the Met would use this information in a proportionate and even handed manner (probably not), but the concept of getting a few folk employed to scour the internet to try and prevent and detect violent crime by the key demographic of 15-21 year old guys strikes me as pretty sound. As long as their is an evaluation built in to it so say after 3 months they can independently verify it's been worthwhile.
 
ncurd said:
What a surprise...

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-63478011
It doesn't shock me wife stories of the Ambulance Service are bad enough if the type of people who do it, why and what they get up to.
Click to expand...
Know/knew two people who are in the police - one an old school friend who is promoted to detective Sargent now. Family man and decent. But has found it stressful and got signed off with depression for a couple of months.

The other a BBC who worked for the Met and remember him telling us that he joined the police “to thump *****”. He no longer works for the police but got a nice cushty security consultant at job. Posts constant pictures of him flying first class to Dubai.
 
Bada-Bing! said:
The other a BBC who worked for the Met and remember him telling us that he joined the police “to thump *****”. He no longer works for the police but got a nice cushty security consultant at job. Posts constant pictures of him flying first class to Dubai.
Click to expand...
I'm a fan of the Peter Bleksley (ex undercover met officer and "celebrity policeman") episodes of JaackMate's Happy Hour. In one of them he is candied about the proportion of the Met who were abhorrent racists during his time there. He also mentions that he was thrown out of the former officers' association!
 
RedruthRFC said:
I'm a fan of the Peter Bleksley (ex undercover met officer and "celebrity policeman") episodes of JaackMate's Happy Hour. In one of them he is candied about the proportion of the Met who were abhorrent racists during his time there. He also mentions that he was thrown out of the former officers' association!
Click to expand...
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-62995926
And still prevalent.

Two of them have been jailed for 12 weeks but bailed pending an appeal. “Just banter” according to them.

No wonder the Met police get such a bad rep.
 
ncurd said:
What a surprise...

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-63478011
It doesn't shock me wife stories of the Ambulance Service are bad enough if the type of people who do it, why and what they get up to.
Click to expand...
I remember listening to a podcast about how the police/sheriff departments in the states work, basically they dont even talk to each other let alone have any oversight. So there are loads of stories where a cop is accused (and sometimes proven and fired for) of a crime...and they just go to the next town or county over and sign up with the next department...multiple times..so dodgy
 
Old Hooker said:
I’m a big supporter of the Police in general and still believe that the large majority are well meaning and try their best in difficult circumstances.

But this is just awful. The ‘minority’ of rotten officers is way too big. An absolute failure of leadership going back years.
Click to expand...
Part of the issue appears to be and certainly in the Met is the mentality in 70's got swept up and hidden rather than possibly other forces who did properly clean up their act.

I'm not saying other are better but does feel like the Met has a far bigger problem than others and complete lack of self awareness. I've said before part of the issue is the kind of people police forces want to recruit and do think unlikely the military their reluctance to provide a career track to university educated people is massive issue.

I know for one I would trust a met officer in my life I'd be incredibly sceptical of anything they told me.

Still as kid who never had a reason to worry about "The Law" I do think as I get older I get this song more and more.
 
Policing in the 70's in particular CID and regional crime squads were very much a cross between "life on mars" and the "Sweeney". The police operated under Judges rules and it was a very different ball game. Changing to PACE 1984 was a massive wake up call the Police needed then.

A number of forces now train along side universities so that probationary officers obtain a degree in policing. Most other degrees can't prepare people for front line policing at PC level. Communication skills are certainly the most required skill in policing. Especially as a beat cop or as response officer.

I'm not convinced that once you get past or near Chief Inspector level, you need to have been a PC and risen through the ranks. Hence why they had direct entry trials at Inspector - superintendent level. As these are more budget setting strategies based roles rather than day to day blue lighting it.
 
Saintjay said:
A number of forces now train along side universities so that probationary officers obtain a degree in policing.
Click to expand...
This is more what was getting at no different to paramedics or nursing. I just think there needs to be a direct route in conjunction with the force that is a potential 'fast track' through the earlier stages of an officer career.

There are plenty of smart people out there who would make excellent police officers (I would be terrible at it) but currently its not really a path open to them. They are far more likely to have adjacent careers rather than be part of the force itself.
 

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