About the issue of Dupont, I would like the opinion of the forum

[penaltytry]

I´m 50/50, I can´t give an opinion, but I would like to know what people here thinks:

Were trying to injury deliberately Dupont?

 

[TW27BA]

No, just mindless off the feet rucking that should be addressed.
I don't believe Dupont was deliberately targetted.

 

[IT157]

The Ireland team should be banned and all their results in the 6 nations this year should be void. Meaning England just need to beat Wales to win the 6 nations...

 

[Ddanno]

Don't be a silly b0llocks

 

[OllyM97]

I don’t think they deliberately targeted Dupont but the way Ireland go into rucks is consistently illegal and referees should be harsher on them - to be blunt, it’s cheating.

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

Beirne hit the ruck on his feet and took two steps, Porter entered on his feet. Play on. It's a dynamic situation, anyone who steps on a pitch risks injury.

Edit: the rule change to take it out of the game is to remove jackling by the way. There's no way to get rid of a strong jackal currently without entering the ruck in a way that a player will not lose their feet soon after impact.

 

[AlRums]

Add this in

Six Nations 2025: Romain Ntamack anger over Garry Ringrose sanction

France fly-half Romain Ntamack feels it is "totally incomprehensible" that the terms of his suspension differed to the sanction handed to Ireland centre Garry Ringrose.

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[AlRums]

Andrew Porter: Ireland prop says no foul play in incident which led to Dupont injury

Ireland prop Andrew Porter denies he was involved in foul play that led to Antoine Dupont's serious knee injury in France's Six Nations win in Dublin.

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[Which Tyler]

Delberately? no
Recklessly? yes
Illegally? yes - but in a way that gets pinged about as frequently as feeding the scrum used to be

Ireland may be the worst/best at entering rucks like this; but A] all forwards from all teams also do it, and B] whilst ref.s aren't interested in it, there's no reason to stop. Cheating is literally the oldest tradition in the game

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

Delberately? no
Recklessly? yes
Illegally? yes - but in a way that gets pinged about as frequently as feeding the scrum used to be

Ireland may be the worst/best at entering rucks like this; but A] all forwards from all teams also do it, and B] whilst ref.s aren't interested in it, there's no reason to stop. Cheating is literally the oldest tradition in the game

I'm honestly failing to see what's illegal about this:



Hopefully you can see this. In the first angle you can see Beirne on his feet and driving, it's totally fine, Porter also enters on his feet, accelerating things and they trip over Sheehan but both are clearly endeavouring to stay on their feet and enter the ruck inncontrol of what they're doing.

If this is illegal, you need to get rid of jackling because they're very protected already and it would become impossible for them to be shifted off the ball. And the game becomes predominantly based on tight carries and territory.

 

[Which Tyler]

Beirne doesn't wrap (or attempt to) I disagree that either is in control.
I don't think there's a genuine attempt to stay on his feet - okay so he hasn't entered like an exocet, but he still hasn't attempted to stay on his feet.

If you're in control, you don't trip over things.
If you're attempting to stay on your feet, you don't fall over when no-one else is trying to make you fall over.

IMO, it's illegal, and entirely normal.

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

Beirne doesn't wrap (or attempt to) I disagree that either is in control.
I don't think there's a genuine attempt to stay on his feet - okay so he hasn't entered like an exocet, but he still hasn't attempted to stay on his feet.

If you're in control, you don't trip over things.
If you're attempting to stay on your feet, you don't fall over when no-one else is trying to make you fall over.

IMO, it's illegal, and entirely normal.

Kind of the answer I expected. I think you're asking for the impossible.

No requirement to wrap at a ruck, the word used is bind, Beirne is always in contact with Dupont.

"If you're in control you don't trip over things" - you do when you're objective is to shift a body that is behind another body on the floor.

If you want that to be illegal, that's fine, but the jackal has got to go.

 

[LIONSxv]

The reaction in France has been hysterical. Much the same as when they went out of their own WC. DP standing was not targeted. Although Ire are usually illegal at the breakdown this didn't affect the outcome this time.

 

[Saintjay]

Kind of the answer I expected. I think you're asking for the impossible.

No requirement to wrap at a ruck, the word used is bind, Beirne is always in contact with Dupont.

"If you're in control you don't trip over things" - you do when you're objective is to shift a body that is behind another body on the floor.

If you want that to be illegal, that's fine, but the jackal has got to go.

Beirne definitely didn't bind so is illegal

However nobody really binds at elite level at rucks so unless they enforce it can't see why people are now complaining.

Blame the refs for not enforcing it not the players.

 

[McTallshort]

It was reckless and wasn't the first time Ireland had gone, no arms off their feet in a ruck that game and POM did it at least twice in the tackle.

This has been a mess since rucking was banned

 

[McTallshort]

Beirne definitely didn't bind so is illegal

However nobody really binds at elite level at rucks so unless they enforce it can't see why people are now complaining.

Blame the refs for not enforcing it not the players.

Yeah that's kinda like blaming crime on the police. The players know the rules and knowledge what kinds of injuries happen if they stray outside them. Both players should have faced sanction.

 

[Saintjay]

Yet the ref and citing commissioner decided no further action.

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

The POM block attempts were fairly text book GAA blocks, get down on the kicking foot. Two of them and both play on. Saw no issue there at all.

Like I could be swayed that Beirne's rucking could be something that should be illegal but I don't like the wider effects it'd have on the game, clearing the player and the ball has to be the frame for which off feet is reffed for me. And an attempt to bind too (don't think it can be argued Beirne shoulder charged in their with the position of his upper arm). If foul play follows, of course ref that but this was an accident all day for me. It's the first case of Ireland or Leinster injuring a player through rucking that wasn't deemed illegal in as long as I can remember and these complaints have been around an age, loads of confirmation bias going on.

How France slowed the ball down wasn't perfectly legal either but again, don't want penalties everytime a player is the wrong side of the ruck after making a tackle, fix it with better carrying if you're the attacking team. Lots of clear outs from the side too but only one that I thought was properly material.

I think this is just a perfect storm because it's Dupont and Ireland and Leinster are on the wrong side of fans' perceptions on how the game shpuld be officiated. France escalated it because they're bitter at Ringrose, which is ridiculous but also an administrative oversight.

I feel like I'm rarely against the concensus when it comes to law talk (except maybe head contact where I go further the other way) but I've found this one weird for a long time. A solution looking for a problem imo.

Paris next year should be spicy anyway.

 

[dirty harry]

Let's be real for a second, if you are fighting for a 3rd record title, Frances best player and best player in the world spends half his time hanging out at the back of rucks, AND the coach decides a 7-1 is a good idea...

Your 200% trying to get to Dupont and rough the living hell out of him. Noone is doing anything malicious, but the breakdown strategy is maliciously putting reckless massive men in positions to make contact with him, that's obvious.

Irelands breakdown superiority is akin to NZ's of the late 2000s early 2010s, they get away with murder, so why would they change anything?

There will be a game where a ref gets annoyed by it, and that superiority will stutter as they are trying to withhold themselves, and it will be a catalyst for a cohesive Ireland struggling a bit, but who knows when that will happen.

 

[AlRums]

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Let's be honest a certain Irishman wasn't beyond "playing the game"