Aotearoa New Zealand v France 4/7/26

[dirty harry]

You can't win with a referee like that. Ruben Love's high tackle on Max Spring was a red card. Otherwise, and let's not be hypocritical, the Frenchman would have received a red card.

The try was disallowed for a French knock-on; the play wasn't very clear. If the match had been played in Paris, the try would have been awarded to the All Blacks.

I'll just point out one thing, and this is my personal opinion: there's a blatant bias among Anglo-Saxon referees towards Anglo-Saxon nations.

Third World mentality. There is a large element of truth in what I'm saying.

Identical action and foul: All Blacks - Lions
Red card for Sonny Bill Williams

Vunipola high tacle = red card

Interesting theory, but missing 2 key points.

1. France isnt Anglo saxon

2. I love watching the French lose.

My opinion is based on referee trend, he wasnt bad around the park, didny over react and throw a French and NZ red card around, he just allowed NZ too much leeway at the breakdown, specifically in attack.

But that isnt a criticism of NZ, as i said, they play to what the ref allows.

NZ could win 100- 0 and Kiwi forums would be complaining they were cheated, they really are that set of fans known worldwide lets be honest.

 

[mackerzz]

Interesting theory, but missing 2 key points.

1. France isnt Anglo saxon

2. I love watching the French lose.

My opinion is based on referee trend, he wasnt bad around the park, didny over react and throw a French and NZ red card around, he just allowed NZ too much leeway at the breakdown, specifically in attack.

But that isnt a criticism of NZ, as i said, they play to what the ref allows.

NZ could win 100- 0 and Kiwi forums would be complaining they were cheated, they really are that set of fans known worldwide lets be honest.

Are you saying we (aka new zealanders) are sore winners?

 

[Kiwiwomble]

Interesting theory, but missing 2 key points.

1. France isnt Anglo saxon

2. I love watching the French lose.

My opinion is based on referee trend, he wasnt bad around the park, didny over react and throw a French and NZ red card around, he just allowed NZ too much leeway at the breakdown, specifically in attack.

But that isnt a criticism of NZ, as i said, they play to what the ref allows.

NZ could win 100- 0 and Kiwi forums would be complaining they were cheated, they really are that set of fans known worldwide lets be honest.

so other countries are allowed to critique the ref but NZ isn't...and even when one of us tries to just go down the middle and say everything was probable fair in the end and everyone should probably stop bagging the ref...nope...the ref favoured NZ...and theyre bad fans...cool

 

[Stade Rochelais]

Are you saying we (aka new zealanders) are sore winners?

You didn't deserve the victory. I have always been impartial when it came to making a decision.
The facts of the match seem to bear me out; the referee heavily favored you, especially at the rucks where Savea should have been penalized.
I insist once again, you absolutely did not deserve this victory.

It was your cousin Luke Pearce who largely contributed to France's defeat; you should be ashamed. You cousins must be in cahoots; it's ridiculous to do that.

 

[Kiwiwomble]

You didn't deserve the victory. I have always been impartial when it came to making a decision.
The facts of the match seem to bear me out; the referee heavily favored you, especially at the rucks where Savea should have been penalized.
I insist once again, you absolutely did not deserve this victory.

It was your cousin Luke Pearce who largely contributed to France's defeat; you should be ashamed. You cousins must be in cahoots; it's ridiculous to do that.

kiwis generally = that was close! damn France played well and that was a bloody entertaining game

French fans on the internet = they didnt deserve to win! the ref's a cheat and favoured them!

so called neutral fans = Kiwis a bad winners!!!!

the internet is a wonderful place, i might go back to the real world where there are far fewer *****

 

[dirty harry]

Are you saying we (aka new zealanders) are sore winners?

No not at all.. just entitled fans who are never happy.

I would liken NZ rugby fans attitudes to England football fans.

 

[dirty harry]

kiwis generally = that was close! damn France played well and that was a bloody entertaining game

French fans on the internet = they didnt deserve to win! the ref's a cheat and favoured them!

so called neutral fans = Kiwis a bad winners!!!!

the internet is a wonderful place, i might go back to the real world where there are far fewer *****

Exhibit A.

 

[dirty harry]

so other countries are allowed to critique the ref but NZ isn't...and even when one of us tries to just go down the middle and say everything was probable fair in the end and everyone should probably stop bagging the ref...nope...the ref favoured NZ...and theyre bad fans...cool

Exhibit B.

 

[Welsh Exile]

The Anglo Saxon thing is hilarious. One good way to get punched in the face is calling Welsh, Irish or anyone other than English, “Anglo Saxon”

 

[TRF_Olyy]

SR and DH chip away at someone until they bite and then start crying about a whole nation being bad fans, it's pathetic

 

[Welsh Exile]

kiwis generally = that was close! damn France played well and that was a bloody entertaining game

French fans on the internet = they didnt deserve to win! the ref's a cheat and favoured them!

so called neutral fans = Kiwis a bad winners!!!!

the internet is a wonderful place, i might go back to the real world where there are far fewer *****

I haven’t got round to watching this game yet. Think I’ll put it on now. NZ fans, and the kiwis I’ve met in general, are great.

The comparison to England football fans is ridiculous. Even if you conceded that they have similar behaviours or what have you NZ were the best rugby nation for like a ******* century I think you could forgive some of their fans being, shall we say, confident. You can’t say the same about English football fans.

You’re a good bloke. Very reasonable and if Harry is having a pop then it means you’re on the right track.

 

[dirty harry]

SR and DH chip away at someone until they bite and then start crying about a whole nation being bad fans, it's pathetic

Wait... i didnt slate the fans initially, i just made the claim NZ played the ref at the breakdown better than France, i think thats a very genuine point. Who would deny that point?

Also, England football and NZ rugby fans having a similar entitlement is absolutely accurate, i would love to have that level of entitlement in any sport, unfortunately Welsh rugby hasnt provided me that.

England football fans have the air of 'we own football' similar to NZ fans, thats not a massive insult, its an observation shared by many, kiwis alike.

 

[Saintjay]

Wait... i didnt slate the fans initially, i just made the claim NZ played the ref at the breakdown better than France, i think thats a very genuine point. Who would deny that point?

Also, England football and NZ rugby fans having a similar entitlement is absolutely accurate, i would love to have that level of entitlement in any sport, unfortunately Welsh rugby hasnt provided me that.

England football fans have the air of 'we own football' similar to NZ fans, thats not a massive insult, its an observation shared by many, kiwis alike.

You could also argued it's fueled by petty nationalism and jealousy. I know far more Welsh and Scots who are ABE. Where's the English tend not to care what the Welsh and Scots do

Some fans are entitled but with money and resources comes expectation. Which in football and rugby England rarely deliver on.

 

[mackerzz]

Wait... i didnt slate the fans initially, i just made the claim NZ played the ref at the breakdown better than France, i think thats a very genuine point. Who would deny that point?

Also, England football and NZ rugby fans having a similar entitlement is absolutely accurate, i would love to have that level of entitlement in any sport, unfortunately Welsh rugby hasnt provided me that.

England football fans have the air of 'we own football' similar to NZ fans, thats not a massive insult, its an observation shared by many, kiwis alike.

I absolutely am not saying New Zealand fans are not entitled. just interesting to get an outside perspective

 

[dirty harry]

You could also argued it's fueled by petty nationalism and jealousy. I know far more Welsh and Scots who are ABE. Where's the English tend not to care what the Welsh and Scots do

Some fans are entitled but with money and resources comes expectation. Which in football and rugby England rarely deliver on.

Whats ABE?

 

[mackerzz]

Whats ABE?

Auto Body Equipment according to Google

 

[Saintjay]

Whats ABE?

Anyone but England

 

[Stade Rochelais]

I'm going to give you the full scoop because the facts seem to bear me out.

The last ten French rugby internationals have been refereed by Anglo-Saxons against Anglo-Saxon nations. Between cousins, you have to make arrangements somehow: a foul here, a try disallowed there, a gratuitous yellow card, or even a red card left unchecked!

I don't like it !

The French XV's defeat against the New Zealand still sticks in my craw, and the person responsible is Luke Pearce, just like a certain Ben O'keeffee against South Africa.

2025: Karl Dickson - Paul Williams - Angus Gardner - Matthew Carley - Hollie Davidson - Nic Berry - Christophe Ridley - Luke Pearce - Ben O'keeffe = Commonwealth

And let's not forget the worst scumbag on earth: referee Craig Joubert, who unjustly turned a blind eye to the countless fouls committed by the All Blacks against France in the 2011 World Cup final, fouls that would have given us a significant advantage against the host nation.

Dirty cheat! I hate thieves and corrupt people.

This is a moral lesson for all of you.

2011 and 2023, these two flights will remain in the annals of international rugby as indelible stains.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

I don't like it !

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

I agree to be honest.

Being outside the Commonwealth looking in is a massive advantage in rugby. Even moreso when you're not Britain's closest neighbour - just have to look at Wayne Barnes making up a penalty on the poor, innocent and loved Michael Ala'alatoa in the 2022 Heineken Cup final to gift it to La Rochelle or Steve Walsh blowing his whistle for no reason to gift France victory in Croke Park in 2007 to show how much geography alone gifts teams advantages.

 

[Demfad]

I'll just point out one thing, and this is my personal opinion: there's a blatant bias among Anglo-Saxon referees towards Anglo-Saxon nations.

Do you mean "English speaking nations"?

Even England itself might not be accurately described as an Anglo-Saxon nation. Does that mean we use "Frankish" or "Gaulish" to describe France and French speaking nations? Many SA rugby players are primarily of Dutch rather than English colonial descent/

In the amateur era of the 5 nations the hierarchy of referee bia was pro:
1: England
2: Wales
3: Scotland
4: Ireland
5: France

Regarding the claim that a try would be awarded in Paris I'd point you to the Video Director performance in France v Ireland in 2026 to dispute that.

If Rugby is to grow anomalies such as British refs refereeing other British teams must cease. The Wales-Fiji match in the 2023 World Cup refereed by an English man was in particular scandalous.

 

[Welsh Exile]

Do you mean "English speaking nations"?

Even England itself might not be accurately described as an Anglo-Saxon nation. Does that mean we use "Frankish" or "Gaulish" to describe France and French speaking nations? Many SA rugby players are primarily of Dutch rather than English colonial descent/

In the amateur era of the 5 nations the hierarchy of referee bia was pro:
1: England
2: Wales
3: Scotland
4: Ireland
5: France

Regarding the claim that a try would be awarded in Paris I'd point you to the Video Director performance in France v Ireland in 2026 to dispute that.

If Rugby is to grow anomalies such as British refs refereeing other British teams must cease. The Wales-Fiji match in the 2023 World Cup refereed by an English man was in particular scandalous.

I think he’s on to something. Let’s call France The Normans. Italy The Romans. England the Anglo Saxons the Welsh The Island Gauls. The Irish The Celts and The Scots the Gingers.

 

[Saintjay]

Do you mean "English speaking nations"?

Even England itself might not be accurately described as an Anglo-Saxon nation. Does that mean we use "Frankish" or "Gaulish" to describe France and French speaking nations? Many SA rugby players are primarily of Dutch rather than English colonial descent/

In the amateur era of the 5 nations the hierarchy of referee bia was pro:
1: England
2: Wales
3: Scotland
4: Ireland
5: France

Regarding the claim that a try would be awarded in Paris I'd point you to the Video Director performance in France v Ireland in 2026 to dispute that.

If Rugby is to grow anomalies such as British refs refereeing other British teams must cease. The Wales-Fiji match in the 2023 World Cup refereed by an English man was in particular scandalous.

What's the source for the hierarchy of referee bias?

The only study I could find indicates ref tendency to make decisions favouring teams from there own country

 

[Demfad]

What's the source for the hierarchy of referee bias?

The only study I could find indicates ref tendency to make decisions favouring teams from there own country

No source, its my subjective opinion from matches played in the 70s 80s and 90s.
Wales and England would get some parity as they were the proper contenders.
Scotland next even though they were not seen as a proper rugby country. Then Ireland.
France were bottom of the pack as the outsiders.

British refs coaching other British teams is because of history and because the 6 nations have a problem otherwise.
But for world cups etc British refs should not be reffing matches where other British teams are allowed. Imagine how that would look in soccer?

 

[Kiwiwomble]

What's the source for the hierarchy of referee bias?

The only study I could find indicates ref tendency to make decisions favouring teams from there own country

point me towards the study? would be interested in reading

we have a ref who use to be affiliated with our club, all the other clubs think he favours us....we think we is extra harsh on use because be know he'll be judged more harshly...the truth is he one of the best and fairest refs in the comp

...and im more and more convinced most refs are the same...when it all comes out in the wash theyre probably pretty fair

 

[Saintjay]

point me towards the study? would be interested in reading

we have a ref who use to be affiliated with our club, all the other clubs think he favours us....we think we is extra harsh on use because be know he'll be judged more harshly...the truth is he one of the best and fairest refs in the comp

...and im more and more convinced most refs are the same...when it all comes out in the wash theyre probably pretty fair

It's relatively old 2010. Covers league and Super 14 up to 2009.

This is the best short version I could find.

https://sportingintelligence832.sub...es-hand-big-advantage-to-own-countries-290702