Are the All Blacks Chokers? Article By Tom Scott

[kiwi2]

Well the music genre is a whole new ball game, so we won’t go there.

Fcukernaut. :cheers: It’s great to see you moving onto senior rugby. We are losing too many of our young rugby players. You guys are our rugby future. Follow your dreams in rugby, as there is a good future in sport here or abroad. It can also set up lifetime friendships. :fb:
We NZer’s aren’t arrogant but we are and always have been pretty tough on ourselves and have high expectations. It’s being able to front-up to the challenges and also being able to eat humble pie. Some of these challenges for our country are huge and being the best or number 1 in the world (such as our All Blacks and Silver Ferns) can have it’s drawbacks. It can also be very difficult to hold or maintain that position. Compare our facilities, finances, and global position per population head we do bloody well. Look at the America’s Cup- the finances other syndicates have to our NZ challenge, many of our NZ athletes have to work as well as compete against the worlds best.
We are very much a “ David v Goliathâ€. For such a small global country with a diversity of ethnic groups (including Islander’s and Asians,) we are competitive and we should all be very proud. :Forum37: The world and we expect kiwis to be at the top all the time. But reality is we are only a small country with a big heart. Look at our Black Caps, Black Sticks, Tall Blacks, All Whites etc we have proved we can foot it at the top and at the end of the day it is a proud day for NZ when a kiwi does.

The high standard of World Rugby today is because of the benchmarks southern hemisphere rugby nations have set. This is the reason Graham Henry has spoken out regarding the French Team touring NZ. He’s coped a lot of flack over his stance. But he is only doing it for the betterment of international rugby and the people who support rugby.
People won’t hate NZer’s. What’s there to hate.
As for the TKB (Typical kiwi Behavior). If speaking out about how extraordinary our little country of 4 million (including our Pacific Island cousins, Asian whanau. and all the other ethnic groups that proudly align to our country) then yes I’m proud as punch to enlighten you all. As an X- Kiwi representative it is not an easy road to the top but when you do get there it is very proud moment. You can imagine the thoughts of many NZer’s, such as The Invincibles, The Silver Ferns, Black Socks, Sir Edmond Hilary, Peter Bock, Hamish Carter, and John Walker and many, many other kiwis as they raised our NZ flag in their time of triumph.
All kiwis have different interests, some don’t support the AB’s but when the AB’s do well then it must still be a proud moment for them as New Zealanders.
New Zealand will always be a humble and proud nation in rugby and whatever we do as long as you the future generation wants it to be. Good luck and Onward on your crusade.

 

[fredrick]

no way. they have so much talent this year, they cant loose

 

[esoj]

kiwi2 is like prestwick's brother on drugs

 

[Prestwick]

Originally posted by Kiwi2
We are very much a " David v Goliath". For such a small global country with a diversity of ethnic groups (including Islander's and Asians,) we are competitive and we should all be very proud. Forum37.gif The world and we expect kiwis to be at the top all the time. But reality is we are only a small country with a big heart. Look at our Black Caps, Black Sticks, Tall Blacks, All Whites etc we have proved we can foot it at the top and at the end of the day it is a proud day for NZ when a kiwi does.

But its not a "David vs Goliath" situation. Look at nations like Wales with smaller populations and yet a higher mix of ethnic groups of varying communities from across the world. Now that is a real nation that could be considered a "David" not a nation which has one of the most intensive training, development and playing regimes in the world (i.e. New Zealand).

Simply saying "David vs Goliath" and ignoring everyone doesn't exactly make it true. It is rather amusing that you continue on with this as it makes the rest of what you say look even more silly! :lol:

Hey now thats a stereotype. Not all hip hop music is like that your oppinion is obviously influenced by mainstream hip hop. Which is crap anyway. NOT ALL HIP HOP IS LIKE THAT. Sorry to go off topic but i had to clear that up.[/b]

Yes I know that, I listen to the original guys who started it all, to chaps like the Beastie Boys and Goldie Lookin' Chain and I enjoy their work.

The problem is now that like it or not, you have this, frankly criminal element, who since the early 1990s have hyjacked the whole genre and turned it into this racist and sexist pile of rubbish justified by this whole "we're just talkin' 'bout how it is on the streets yo!" Saying that if they do the odd song about drugs and how white police officers beat them up once in a while, it'll justify the hundreds of songs and videos they make with gold Bentleys and hundreds of scantily clad women.

 

[Dmx#1]

The problem is now that like it or not, you have this, frankly criminal element, who since the early 1990s have hyjacked the whole genre and turned it into this racist and sexist pile of rubbish justified by this whole "we're just talkin' 'bout how it is on the streets yo!"[/b]

Once again thats a streotype. Theres always been hip hop thats not about money, hoes and clothes. Hip Hop is very diverse. Even nowadays if you digg a lil deep past the mainstream (you wont have to look far) Also artists are expressing their oppinions and unfortunately its the sad reality of the streets, and to criticise someone without actually walking in their shoes or experiencing the enviroment they have been bought up in wouldnt be fair.Sure there might be rappers that glorify guns,hoes etc (50 cent) but theres a diffrence between gloryfying and painting a street picture.

Saying that if they do the odd song about drugs and how white police officers beat them up once in a while, it'll justify the hundreds of songs and videos they make with gold Bentleys and hundreds of scantily clad women.[/b]

If you could provide quotes about the white officer beating up rappers that would be great. Not that im saying your wrong i'd like to know who in particular. American cops arent exactly the cleanest people in their proffesion sure there are there are those who are out their doing their job but there are a lot of crooked cops. What about cop beatings on minorities? Fair enough if the offender attacked them, but what about the numerous cop beatings in which the offenders did not attack or resist? Like the old man who was intoxicated he didnt resist yet the cops beat the crap out of him and spilled his blood all over the place? Or the numerous times african americans have been shot because cops 'thought' they had a gun when in reality they were holding a wallet or remote etc. Maybe if the american goverment spent a few billion dollars improving the quality of life for the less fortunate instead of the trillions they spend on nuclear warheads there'd be a lot less "gangsters". Also blaming Hip Hop for what rappers are saying isnt right. Its the corporate people at the top who sign these rappers. Oh by the way i like those videos with ladies almost wearing things not necceserily the song just the women lol.

 

[shtove]

I'd just like to point out that although I have full confidence in the All Blacks and back them fully in their pursuit of the World Cup, the opinions and arrogance of Kiwi2 do not necessarily reflect that of the rest of the country.
[/b]

I was thinking kiwi2 was the NZ version of loratadine - but then I thought ... uhhhhh, no - he's got something to back up his claims.

 

[fordyfun]

<div class='quotemain'>
I'd just like to point out that although I have full confidence in the All Blacks and back them fully in their pursuit of the World Cup, the opinions and arrogance of Kiwi2 do not necessarily reflect that of the rest of the country.
[/b]

I was thinking kiwi2 was the NZ version of loratadine - but then I thought ... uhhhhh, no - he's got something to back up his claims.
[/b][/quote]
look there one simple answer to this new zealand question they depth is awsome they will win the world cup hands down.
1 they depth awsome they world cup is the most physical test a rugby player can take

2 they just going in to tri nation and they will win this but boks will push them close

3 most team have 2 star players and if they lose them they f***ed,this team has bucket loads

4 they got the most impressive coaching structure of all the world cup squads

5 this added together means one thing

world cup

 

[kbourke88]

Sorry didn't realise that school was still in! Maybe you better wait until you begin senior rugby or have your first shave or your first..._ before you START PLAYING WITH the BIG BOYS[/b]

School may be still in but only for another 3 weeks, yes thank god it will all be over soon. As for senior rugby, well I am going to be playing for my clubs 2nd XV in the coming weeks so yes I'm pretty pumped about that.

The reason why I don't necessarily agree with what you're saying is because of what has been said by other forum members. Look, I love the All Blacks to death and being an All Black supporter is like being part of a brotherhood and I'd never take back any of the experiences I have had from following the All Blacks. But I dont' want NZ to be the 'arogant' nation. Remember back before 2003 when England were king **** and their media were talking them up to the point where losing to them just wasn't an option because you didn't want to read or hear about the crap coming out of their mouths? I don't want people to hate NZ. I want to be confident(and I am), but quietly so, not imposing or over the edge. I want NZ to be everyones second favourite nation outside their own, and not rooting against them. NZ has always been a humble but powerful rugby nation and I want that to remain the same. It's the old addage: Talk softly but carry a big stick. [/b]

Yeah, i quite like that fcukernaut, thats good. I'm still feeling the hate from the 03 world cup against england, and it is so bad its spread in my heart to all northern hemisphere teams (however irrational that is). I will be holding my beloved Wallabies hopes highest above all, but in my mind a win for south africa or new zealand would do me just fine. In fact, i was really barracking for ABs most of the last world cup, because i was convinced they were the only team that could beat england and shut their stupid big mouths.



I have never been so soul destroyed in my life than when i had to walk out of Stadium Australia tail between my legs and shake hands with a Pom. I wanted to puke. So please Kiwi2, lay off a bit..

 

[kbourke88]

And back on topic...

So I went and got a dictionary definition of choke:

To fail to perform effectively because of nervous agitation or tension, especially in an athletic contest: choked by missing an easy putt on the final hole.

(I know, im a ********)



I've had this argument in another thread against a few Kiwis already, and the one thing that we end up turning this argument into is whether or not they were favourites heading into the cup. I think that detracts from the real point here, which is that in a cup crunch game the kiwis lose when they are expected to win, and for some reason cannot convert momentum and potential into a cup victory.



Now, 91, i can concede, Aust had an awesome team, and NZ lost out to some magic although i dont seem to remember them being expected to win.



95, sure NZ may not have been favourites heading into the cup, but who cares about that now. They dominated the cup, and may have just been the best world cup team to not win the cup. I suppose this could go to debate for all ages on whether it was a choke, but i think after the performance of the ABs during the cup, and their utter destruction of England in the semi, I certainly thought them favourites, and were surprised at them not being able to outclass a South African side who were playing on raw passion rather than actual talent (when compared with the ABs of course).



99, the French were sublime sure, Lamaison played an unbelievable game, Dominici had brilliant energy, but that was a choke nonetheless, ABs just let go of the game, and the French took it with both hands. I mean, the way the French were defending that day, especially against Lomu, you guys shoulda just given him the ball at every opportunity, but it didnt happen. He could have won the game himself. The fear that was in The French fullbacks eyes was like no other. This was a choke of epic proportions, so much so that i missed the game live cuz i went to bed to save my stamina for the expected aust vs nz final, and only watched the game on replay afterwards out of disbelief at the news report.



03, definately a choke against Australia. As already said, the ABs had our measure that year, they smashed us in the Bledisloe, and looked to be the dominant force in the cup after england stumbled against samoa and they put at least 50 points on every team in their pool. They were expected to dispatch with an Aussie team that was a shadow of its 99 winning team, a team that had only just made it through against Ireland earlier in the cup.



Thoughts?

 

[Dumbo]

Hey Kiwi2 can you just point out the arrogance that people are saying you have?

Sorry, read your post and feel a bit ripped off cause I couldn't see it, even checked again and still couldn't see it.

But if it's only 'A' UK supporter pointing it out I wouldn't worry to much about it, for some of them it's hard to see the trees through the forest when your head's so far up your rear end it's hard enough seeing daylight.

But that's just my opinion.

 

[TRUE LEGND]

I SUPPORT YOUR COMMENTS Kiwi2 someone give this guy a DB!

 

[Queenslander]

In my opinion, the All Blacks should be the world champions if the cup was played today, but anything can change in 3 months.

Don't right off the Aussies yet, however if their last matches against Fiji and Wales are anything to go by, they might be coming home early.

Ps. All Blacks will always choke.

 

[Ickon]

Ps. All Blacks will always choke. [/b]

Where else but Queensland !!



New Zealand will win the 2007 World Cup and if they don't, I will donate $250.00 aus. to the TRF. Oh im serious by the way

 

[timmyhoran]

For a small nation of 4 Million people...


It always funny NZ's who quote there small population as some sought of evidience that their supreme athletes. Your not comparing apples with apples. NZ is obsessed with rugby. Its the countries most iconic thing. Apart from Wales and South Africa there are no other true rugby nations.NZ have 1 pro Rugby League team who get smashed, a **** cricket team and some sailors. Australia may have 20 milllion people but probably have half the Rugby playing popluation of NZ. 16 pro AFL teams, 14 pro Rugby League teams. and only 4 pro rugby teams If we used our resourses to play rugby we'd dominate rugby as we dominate cricket.



Calling NZ chokers can be fun but its just to easy to get a rise.

 

[Dumbo]

Mate those comments aren't going to make you to many friends... although does it make you feel better?

 

[timmyhoran]

The truth isn't always popular.

 

[Dumbo]

What Truths that?



That NZ has 4 mil, thats a fact, that we have a league team that gets 'smashed' - I'm not into the game but lets face it - that's not a fact, it's like remedial maths - one and one makes two... check out how many games they've won... it's not a bad stat.

The Cricket team, well it's 50/50 but they managed to get a couple over Australia from time to time.

On the sailor side, most teams that are in the cup have Kiwi's on board and I'd say they'd be more Kiwi's there than Aussies.



I could turn around and say that in 20 Million people there's always one idiot.

 

[mimic]

If the Australians didn't poach all the kiwi league talent, the kiwis would be far superior!

Didn't they beat Australia 24-0? Surely that was a choke.

 

[Dumbo]

It's a fair comment that Aus. has got it all over the rest of the world in league, hands down.
Poaching Kiwi players wouldn't really put NZ in the top position, league is organised and big here, even bigger than Union, also if the Skips dropped League AND AFL... they'd truly be miles ahead, but thats not going to happen so therefore they'll still be in the top 5 of Union nations.
Even if they ****** of AFL they'd be closer to a no.1 spot.
They amount of talent they have playing the game has to be seen to be believed.

Have no problem with where Aus could be, just sometimes people should think before acting, but if it's for a good bit of fishing, well must admit... cool with me.

With the way the moon and tides are at the mo, me thinks there's better fishing in the Northern part of the world