London Scottish teams up with Scottish Rugby

Discussion in 'RFU Championship / British-Irish Cup' started by LSFC C49, Jan 11, 2016.

  1. LSFC C49

    LSFC C49 Academy Player

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  3. Tony Manx

    Tony Manx TRF Season Ticket Holder

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    Has to be fantastic news for both parties but will it impact on the two professional clubs up there?
     
  4. TRF_Peat

    TRF_Peat Super Moderator

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    To the positive I'd have thought. There's too much talent in Scotland to go solely into two pro clubs; an extra proving ground, one that may help provide a step between the domestic clubs and the Pro 12, won't be robbing them of resources, but should polish up the up and comers they need. There's a reason there's been talk of a new Scottish Pro 12 franchise after all - this is a much more achievable halfway house that doesn't compete with them.
     
  5. Tony Manx

    Tony Manx TRF Season Ticket Holder

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    If that is the case then all good!!maybe the Welsh and lesser extent Irish should follow suit and give their younger players some real rugby experience!!!!!
     
  6. LSFC C49

    LSFC C49 Academy Player

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    Looks like the SRU might have dumped London Scottish in a bit of a mire for next season, having parted company with over half their squad in preparation for the now not incoming SRU funded players.

    SRU PULLS OUT OF PARTNERSHIP


    "The Scottish Rugby Union (SRU) Board has ended the Development Partnership we had been operating since January.


    However, Chairman Sir David Reid has reacted swiftly to claims in the Scottish Sunday Times that the SRU's decision was motivated by concerns "about the business model and commercial viability” of London Scottish.

    "The SRU can have no concerns whatsoever about our finances,” said Sir David. "The SRU Board has known all along that our model, as for most Championship clubs, requires investors to step up and support the operational costs of running the club,” he told the LSFC website, "and since 2008 our great group of over 140 investors has contributed over £5m to the cause. They will be bridging the gap as usual next season, though we have been closing the gap and need to raise much raise less than in previous years.”

    "Remember, this partnership was the SRU's idea in the first place, and they offered to second 14 players as well as coaching and support staff. We therefore budgeted accordingly to fund fewer players and instead to cover the extra costs of accommodation and better training facilities. When, only last month, the SRU revised the offer to only ten players, and none of them senior players, London Scottish had to find extra players at extra cost. With pre-season a few weeks away, our budget and planning were suddenly blown off course.”

    "We therefore questioned the support costs we were due to cover, and sought to negotiate this point. However we agreed last week to find the additional funds, only to be told the SRU felt they could not justify their own expenditure on the project."

    President Rod Lynch said "To have something like this dropped in our lap one week before pre-season training starts has an obvious financial and operational impact on us. We will now have to scramble in the market for replacements.

    "It would be an understatement to say we are disappointed. The Club has worked tirelessly for more than a year since we reached agreement, to bring this Partnership to fruition. We were committed to playing our part in full over the next three seasons, which included providing finance to support the Partnership.

    "We maintain that the English RFU Championship is the right place to introduce Scotland's talented young players to the rigours of professional rugby, within the exile Scottish family.

    "We believe the Partnership, which had effectively been in operation since the SRU announced it to the press in January, was the way forward for Scottish Rugby. The increasing co-operation, with coaching support from Sean Lineen and Roddy Grant, and young players on loan from Scotland, seemed an exciting foretaste of what was to come. Instead, Scottish Rugby, and the talented young Scots who want to play for their country will be the poorer.”"
     
  7. ratsapprentice

    ratsapprentice Hall of Fame

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    It was always a ****ing retarded idea.
     
  8. Tigs Man

    Tigs Man Hall of Fame

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    Yep always going to go to poop, the SRU struggle with funding as it is let alone having a Championship team down south on the books.
     
  9. TRF_Cymro

    TRF_Cymro Cymro The White

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    How much support did they offer anyway?
     
  10. LSFC C49

    LSFC C49 Academy Player

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    Well the "****ing retarded idea", as ratsapprentice puts it, seemed to be in developing a mutually beneficial relationship where young Scottish playing and coaching talent, not currently getting their chances from the Scottish Pro12 teams, would have the opportunity to develop in the far more competitive & professional environment of the English Championship rather than the Scottish Premiership. The deal finally brokered in January looked like the SRU were seeing some sense but, as can be seen from the statement put out today, have been gradually reneging on the agreement. This is a firm kick in groin for the club that has provided more Scottish internationals than any other. LSFC are a reasonably well funded professional club and didn't necessarily need the deal, but wanted it. The timing of the SRU in pulling out of the deal during the close season when the annual game of musical chairs is all but over is quite atrocious, but hopefully just a case of bruised pride (or gonads)
     
    Last edited: May 30, 2016
  11. RedruthRFC

    RedruthRFC First XV

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    Funny that we've only been told what a terrible idea this was (for whatever reason) by posters with the benefit hindsight!

    I have no idea how the deal was working and how well it could have worked in the future, but I would agree strongly that the SRU's timing of the announcement is appalling and that they should honour it for the season.
     
  12. ratsapprentice

    ratsapprentice Hall of Fame

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    I've been pretty adamant that any attempts by Scotland, Ireland or Wales to try and establish links with any of the "exiles" teams is a stupid idea, and one that the RFU should be aggressively shutting down.
     
  13. RedruthRFC

    RedruthRFC First XV

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    IMO the whole player registration system needs a rethink to close as many potential loopholes as possible. I'm sure it's handy for the team sending players down en masse to give their fringe players game time, but it doesn't do a lot for the integrity of the league receiving those players. I can make my peace with it if it is bringing EQPs through, but why should RFU leagues be used as a tool to develop other union's players?

    I have no idea about the standard of the BT Premiership / Principality Premiership / All Ireland League (other than the Welsh sides in the B&I who seemed decent but may have been giving a false impression), but if they don't offer a sufficient standard to bring fringe Pro12 players on what options do the sides have? I can see the appeal of sending player to The Championship, although it must be an expensive way of getting game time. I'm not so sure that a deal like the above is the way forward though, I don't see why players couldn't be sent to any Championship club (or possibly even N1 club) with a particular need for a player in the position of the one who needs game time.
     
  14. Tony Manx

    Tony Manx TRF Season Ticket Holder

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    Sounds very NIMBYish to me?

    What is the problem if it strengthens the Championship?

    Personally I would love to see closer ties between AP teams and the championship teams whereby it is used to give promising players more game time!

    It would assist those players and the level of the Championship and bring some welcome money into the latter's teams and their players!
     
  15. TRF_Peat

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    Stupid enough to pick a fight with the RFU's strongest commercial partners and potential allies inside World Rugby over?
     
  16. ratsapprentice

    ratsapprentice Hall of Fame

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    ****ing right.

    It's an English competition, of which one of it's primary roles is to develop English players.
     
  17. j'nuh

    j'nuh First XV

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    Right, but there are approx 360-480 players in the Championship (12 teams, 30-40 players for average squad). Or if by starting lineups, 180 players.

    If a player isn't talented enough to find a place in the Championship because 10 Scottish youngsters joined the league, they're probably not going to play for England. On the other hand, a stronger league presents stronger challenges for the youngsters that are on loan.
     
  18. Tony Manx

    Tony Manx TRF Season Ticket Holder

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    +1

    It is also the way one sees rugby - for instance, I have more the French attitude which is that club rugby is the more important and let the international aspect take care of itself.

    I do not follow the argument that club rugby should be seen only as a feeder system for internationals!

    To many thousands and thousands of rugby supporters, club rugby is the more important and they can have a view too.......
     
  19. welshglory

    welshglory First XV

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    Problem is if you have a situation where London Scottish interests are so inextricably linked to the SRU then they have no need to develop or play young English players. It will be senior journeymen English players, Scottish professional prospects and young Scot's from the Academies.

    So are those thousands of club supporters in France happy to see their national team die then? It takes two to tango, the LNR needs to work with the FFR just as much as the FFR needs to sort themselves out. Sorting out an EPS sort of agreement with the LNR is of the utmost importance for the FFR.

    Look at the German Football model as an excellent example to follow in a private club league system to have a good balance between a thriving club game and competitive national team.
     
  20. TRF_Peat

    TRF_Peat Super Moderator

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    There was an article complaining about the lack of game time for England U20 players not that long ago, with it being noted many weren't even hitting Championship teams. And some of those guys are, if not going to play for England, are at least capable of providing a strong Premiership.

    If both London Scottish and London Welsh had strong loan contingents from Scotland/Wales, it would severely impinge Quins' and LI's ability to send players on DR. Possibly Wasps too. LS can't really take on 10 young Scottish players and still have room for any Quins players. I know the best tend to be going straight to Premiership game time, but it would still be a serious blow for a significant catchment area of English rugby. They're basically relying on Ealing being a Championship club to get anything at all.

    I still think Rats is wrong here, but he's not without a point.
     
  21. RedruthRFC

    RedruthRFC First XV

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    I disagree with this, players develop at different rates and are well served by playing the highest level of rugby possible as early as possible (IMO). Off the top of my head, Jack Nowell, Joe Marler, Joe Launchbury and Ross Moriarty (albeit going on to play for Wales) have played at level three or below and gone on to win international honours, I imagine there are plenty more examples if you dig around. While National League rugby undoubtedly contributed to their development, wouldn't they have been better served being part of a professional environment and playing at a higher level than being part of a team that trains twice a week?

    Ironically, I believe that a slightly weaker Championship serves as a better development tool - the gap between level 2 and 3 is too great.
     
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