Nadolo receives racist tweets

[Feicarsinn]

I think the police cautioning or charging someone is far preferable to a bit of social justice with someones name posted on the internet, there is only one way those things end.

Regardless if someone is posting racist comments on social media (and i know he's not, but at the the time that's how it was portrayed) then they are inciting racial hatred. Certainly in the UK it's a chargable offence.

And anyone should be allowed to say anything they want no matter how derogatory? really?

Yep, Absolutely. As long as it doesn't fall under the jurisdiction of slander (ie. straight up lies) I don't think there's any other way to go about it than be laissez faire as ****. It's all well and good trying to protect people's feelings, but it's a very dangerous game introducing limits on free speech. It's not too big a step from banning a word to banning expression of opinions the state can deem offensive to some and then you're in the ****ter. It's how you end up in a country where pornography is banned because some Helen Lovejoy in the Tories cries "think of the children!"

 

[goodNumber10]

mate it's not often i disagree with a man as sexy as you, but there is a difference between allowing and promoting free speech and turning a blind eye to hatred and bigotry.

Like i said one person calling someone the N word leads to another, and another, and another... small seeds etc... social policing isn't enough.

 

[Sam Owen]

mate it's not often i disagree with a man as sexy as you, but there is a difference between allowing and promoting free speech and turning a blind eye to hatred and bigotry.

Like i said one person calling someone the N word leads to another, and another, and another... small seeds etc... social policing isn't enough.

Totally agree with you 10. It needs to be stamped right out. The more racism gets accepted, the closer to world war 3 IMO.

Racism saw the deaths of many black people, it also saw the deaths of many jews and for what? I aint going to listen to anyone that tries to justify that.

 

[donmcdazzle]

mate it's not often i disagree with a man as sexy as you, but there is a difference between allowing and promoting free speech and turning a blind eye to hatred and bigotry.

Like i said one person calling someone the N word leads to another, and another, and another... small seeds etc... social policing isn't enough.

Does it? If I heard someone call another person that I'm not about to start doing it myself, in fact I'd tell the person to pull their head in real quick.

 

[goodNumber10]

Does it?

Yes. very much so

If I heard someone call another person that I'm not about to start doing it myself, in fact I'd tell the person to pull their head in real quick.

That's not the point.

I'm not referring to you, but it's a fact that ignorance perpetuates. Because you wouldn't condone it doesn't mean the guys mates, or someone else wouldn't condone it and think yeah, why not and say the same thing or the fact that someone can abuse someone on twitter/facebook et al without fear of consequences doesn't bring the other idiots out or encourage those on the edge of the idea.

 

[Feicarsinn]

Well, I'm not going to be won around on this tbh, and I do see where you're coming from gn10. I just think it's incredibly dangerous to go messing around with civil liberties in the interests of not trying to offend, as any controversial statement, view or belief will invariably offend someone and there will always be groups who will see it in their interests to appear offended if the law can harm the original speaker.

I understand that racist statements are abhorrent, absolutely so. However my attitude is that these people should be free to spew their ignorant waffle and I in turn should be free to treat them like idiots.

 

[TheCrossover]

That's pretty sad. I attended school in Arkansas on a American Football scholarship and you guys wouldn't even believe some of the ugly things I've heard at away games and away trips. I hear in Footy, racism is even worse. I always found it alarming how sports can bring out the best and, in this case, the worst of people.

 

[nickdnz]

I agree with Feic.

Hate speech of any kind is ugly, but you either let everyone voice their opinions (as disgusting and abhorrent as they may be) or eventually risk losing the right to talk on topics which may offend others (which could well be genuine opinions on moral, religious or political issues). Of course if the guy was following Nadolo around and hurling abuse - then there are laws to prevent harassment - however saying something ignorant and racist is not against the law.

I'm not sold GN10 that racism is perpetuated as simply as that. I certainly don't believe that getting the police involved would eradicate it anyway. In my opinion it seems people know how to respond correctly, by either ignoring it and not giving the guy the time of day, or by commenting on it as an ugly and pathetic act. I doubt the guy who made those comments is feeling like a winner right now.

 

[RoosTah]

That's pretty sad. I attended school in Arkansas on a American Football scholarship and you guys wouldn't even believe some of the ugly things I've heard at away games and away trips. I hear in Footy, racism is even worse. I always found it alarming how sports can bring out the best and, in this case, the worst of people.

Canterbury fans are apparently pretty famous for being pretty feral according to my Kiwi mates (all from Auckland). Pretty deplorable really, and in Australia he'd be in breach of the discrimination act for it.

 

[William18]

*facepalm*

I interpreted your comment "Hopefully the police will pull the IP and pay the little oik a visit" to mean that the police should pay this person a visit and rough them up. As it is, I have no clue what an oik is. Either way, that's not how police operate in New Zealand.

Regardless, I strongly disagree with your point that because one person calls someone else a ****** then other people will start doing it. If I go into work and start calling every black person a ****** I will pretty soon be fired. Do you really think people will follow my lead if they see that I have been fired and my friends won't talk to me? Calling someone a ****** will only spread if people are allowed to call someone that with impunity. I think the social judgement passed on this person would far exceed any fine.

I don't believe that the police or law makers are the best judges of acceptable behavior. Rather it is better off if different individuals decide for themselves what behaviour is or isn't acceptable and then society as a whole will aggregate those views and form beliefs. I don't see how a law will stop anyone from being racist when racism is a state of mind.

Regardless, even if this person could be charged any court case would just be he said versus she said.

 

[Thingimubob]

This thread brings back memories of Liam Stacey, a Welsh student at Swansea Uni who got sent to prison for tweeting racial slurs after Fabrice Muamba's heart attack. Still a bit of controversy surrounding him actually doing prison time, partly because the judge clearly wanted to make an example and threw the book at him. I'm still not sure where I stand about that one, having seen what he tweeted I can see the justification for the response, in particular from society, but as nickdnz and others have said, there is an element of dangerous regulation of free speech there. Hard to find a middle ground there.

 

[goodNumber10]

I interpreted your comment "Hopefully the police will pull the IP and pay the little oik a visit" to mean that the police should pay this person a visit and rough them up. As it is, I have no clue what an oik is. Either way, that's not how police operate in New Zealand.

No, i meant pay him a visit, caution him and or arrest him. the police giving him a"visit" as you suggest would be no better than his name being posted on the internet and social justice being dealt out as people above have suggested.

Regardless, I strongly disagree with your point that because one person calls someone else a ****** then other people will start doing it. If I go into work and start calling every black person a ****** I will pretty soon be fired. Do you really think people will follow my lead if they see that I have been fired and my friends won't talk to me? Calling someone a ****** will only spread if people are allowed to call someone that with impunity. I think the social judgement passed on this person would far exceed any fine.

I don't believe that the police or law makers are the best judges of acceptable behavior. Rather it is better off if different individuals decide for themselves what behaviour is or isn't acceptable and then society as a whole will aggregate those views and form beliefs. I don't see how a law will stop anyone from being racist when racism is a state of mind.

Regardless, even if this person could be charged any court case would just be he said versus she said.

Why would you be sacked? You're just voicing your right to freedom of speech no?

Besides you are a rational sensible person though (at least i presume you are ) bigots generally aren't.

Just to explain i'm not saying every person who hears him saying it will start saying it, that's just daft. But if someone voices this kind of sentiment and nothing is done about it, then that gives someone else with the same thought process the justification to say what they want without fear of cencorship.

Freedom of speech within a normal social situation is not what you guys are defending. There is no discussion, no reason, just an intent to offend and harm - we're not talking about someone within a broader context on racial equality we're talking about people who are saying something with nothing but hatred in the comments.

There is a big difference.

 

[LittleGuy]

No, i meant pay him a visit, caution him and or arrest him. the police giving him a"visit" as you suggest would be no better than his name being posted on the internet and social justice being dealt out as people above have suggested.



Why would you be sacked? You're just voicing your right to freedom of speech no?

Besides you are a rational sensible person though (at least i presume you are ) bigots generally aren't.

Just to explain i'm not saying every person who hears him saying it will start saying it, that's just daft. But if someone voices this kind of sentiment and nothing is done about it, then that gives someone else with the same thought process the justification to say what they want without fear of cencorship.

Freedom of speech within a normal social situation is not what you guys are defending. There is no discussion, no reason, just an intent to offend and harm - we're not talking about someone within a broader context on racial equality we're talking about people who are saying something with nothing but hatred in the comments.

There is a big difference.

No one here is saying that these kinds of remarks don't require some sort of punishment, there is a massive difference between a private enitity sacking/firing you for views that don't reflect their company and being imprisoned for insulting someone in a bar.

You keep going on about how "nothing has been done about it" I think action has been taken, Nadolo told us of this moron, many showed their support to him and most likely those that know aforementioned moron are embarrassed by him, revolted by his comments or irratated that he's tried to provoke a reaction of someone just enjoying a night out for no apparent reason.

I don't see how it's a worthwhile use of limited police resources to go chasing this guy around to his house, he hasn't been advocating for the death of Polynesians or their exclusions from vital parts of the countries institutions. He's just been a glorified internet troll, if he disturbs the peace or gets to the point of libelling/stalking Nadolo than fine, or if he starts a pub fight with his ignorance than fine get him on those things.

 

[goodNumber10]

No one here is saying that these kinds of remarks don't require some sort of punishment,

That's EXACTLY what they are saying.

there is a massive difference between a private enitity sacking/firing you for views that don't reflect their company and being imprisoned for insulting someone in a bar.

There zero difference.

Besides i've not said anyone should be imprisoned.

You keep going on about how "nothing has been done about it" I think action has been taken, Nadolo told us of this moron, many showed their support to him and most likely those that know aforementioned moron are embarrassed by him, revolted by his comments or irratated that he's tried to provoke a reaction of someone just enjoying a night out for no apparent reason.

where have i said nothings been done? I'm saying that the guys here who say just ignore it are wrong as it's akin to turning a blind eye.

Maybe read the thread and take my comments in context, there are two discussion threads going on here.

I don't see how it's a worthwhile use of limited police resources to go chasing this guy around to his house, he hasn't been advocating for the death of Polynesians or their exclusions from vital parts of the countries institutions. He's just been a glorified internet troll, if he disturbs the peace or gets to the point of libelling/stalking Nadolo than fine, or if he starts a pub fight with his ignorance than fine get him on those things.

The original comment was when we thought it was on twitter, the discussion has expanded from there.

 

[LittleGuy]

That's EXACTLY what they are saying.



There zero difference.

Besides i've not said anyone should be imprisoned.

Maybe read the thread?

1) No it isn't what they are saying, they are saying that society as a whole is more effective at stamping these things out than legal institutions/power of the state.

2) If you belive there is zero difference between the powers/obligations of a private company and the state I really have no idea how to begin logically disscussing this with you.

3) Fair enough on the imprisonment, though I would assume that is a logical extension of your views should this indivdual repeatedly engage in this behaviour, or at least the imposition of fines/community service or the like.

4) Odd to tell someone to read the thread in this case when the entire implication of the thread came from someone who hadn't even read the article(the OP) before blowing their gasket. I should have known better than to engage with you once again on here, you are completely incapable of reasoned debate and act like a prat when anyone disagrees.

 

[goodNumber10]

1) No it isn't what they are saying, they are saying that society as a whole is more effective at stamping these things out than legal institutions/power of the state.

utter garbage! they are saying "leave it mate it's not worth it", which is not true. Institutionalised racism comes from those very foundations, casual racism is the start - what if that guy in the bar is an off duty copper, or a person in a position of responsibility?

Is it ok to turn a blind eye then because "you know they were drunk and just being a bit racist, not completely racist".

3) Fair enough on the imprisonment, though I would assume that is a logical extension of your views should this indivdual repeatedly engage in this behaviour, or at least the imposition of fines/community service or the like.

oh, you are assuming? makes sense now.

Like i said read the thread, I've clearly said if he should be cautioned - and that was said in the context of him potentially saying it on twitter.

Regardless there are two points at discussion here, you need to separate them out - the first, is the if the comments were made on twitter (where my comment about the police comes in).

Should they track down some drunkard in the bar, no of course not and at no point have i said they should.

But the second strand of the discussion which is "let people say what they want" is important because casual racism is where it all starts. And just ignoring it, doesn't work.

4) Odd to tell someone to read the threads in this case when the entire implication of the thread came from someone who hadn't even read the article before blowing their gasket. I should have known better than to engage with you once again on here, you are completely incapable of reasoned debate and act like a prat when anyone disagrees.

Odd that you would criticise me and then end it all by calling me childish names (even more ironic after your previous comments to me about insults on here).

If you don't' like me don't reply to my post or block me, it'll genuinely be no great loss to me if i never read another of your posts.

 

[squirrel]

Not too fussed on the whole racism issue, I've been called a white c*nt many times by Māori(in nz) and aboriginal Australians, people will say the most hateful things when their angry and will try to hurt feelings ,so I don't necessarily consider people racist on the back of some racist remarks. Actions speak louder than words.

 

[Big Ewis]

Not too fussed on the whole racism issue, I've been called a white c*nt many times by Māori(in nz) and aboriginal Australians, people will say the most hateful things when their angry and will try to hurt feelings ,so I don't necessarily consider people racist on the back of some racist remarks. Actions speak louder than words.

+1.

 

[goodNumber10]

So I've been told that apparently i'm calling or "insinuating" the good people of the forum are Racists.

I just want to say that is absolutely NOT the case. If anyone here thinks i'm calling them a racist then you are misunderstanding my point, which has been throughout this discussion that ignoring racist comments as free speech is not an effective means of dealing with casual racism, nor is social policing.

That is a far cry from saying people are racist.

 

[TRF_stormer2010]

So I've been told that apparently i'm calling or "insinuating" the good people of the forum are Racists.

I just want to say that is absolutely NOT the case. If anyone here thinks i'm calling them a racist then you are misunderstanding my point, which has been throughout this discussion that ignoring racist comments as free speech is not an effective means of dealing with casual racism, nor is social policing.

That is a far cry from saying people are racist.

I can't say that is the impression I was getting. I disagree over what I see you as promoting ITO the 'extent of power/mandate granted to official institutions' and I would rather go for a 'trust society' type of solution to social issues but that is a discussion with too many variables to actually effectively discuss in a forum type of set up but I never got the impression of you calling me a racist.