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Super 15 Conference logs and the Combined log

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Okay so the first 5 weeks are done for the 2012 Super 15 Season and there's a couple of things that has grabbed my attention which are reflecting on the logs:

1. The Bulls have the second most points of all the teams and are 1 point behind the Stormers, but can only end up 4th if the logs remain the same.

2. The NZ log are the most competitive log so far and IMO will remain that way throughout, unless the Sharks start to show some grit and something horrible like an earthquake hit NZ again.

3. The 2 teams I thought would run away with this year's tournament, the Crusaders and the Blues, are not doing so well, even though one team has toured already and the other are going to tour now, I have reason to believe this will change for the better for them.

4. The Aussie log is being dominated by a South African coach, while the Reds are in serious trouble with their backs all with major injuries (who would've seen that one coming??)

5. The Sharks, Lions, Cheetahs, Waratahs and Rebels all show a lot of promise but seem to lack that final killer blow, with all of them staging great fightbacks but then come up short at the end.

My biggest concern at the moment is that the Combined Log doesn't show a fair reflection of how individual teams are doing and that their Conference log a predetermined factor is as to where they will end up.

For instance, if the Bulls and Stormers keep on going like they are as well as the top 3 NZ teams and the Crusaders starts winning more games, and then in the Aussie Conference they keep on beating each other with no clear team pulling away from the others, we could have the situation that based on points accumulated by the end of the Round Robin phase, that there should be 2 South African sides and 4 New Zealand sides as the top 6, but an Aussie team has to go through based on the points system. How fair is that??
 
We're looking at a situation where, at the end of the round, it's quite possible that Brumbies will be the top ranked Oz team, and only have 17 points. They could be seeded third overall and have fewer points than six teams!! (Bulls, Stormers, Chiefs, Highlanders, Hurricanes, Crusaders). I don't see why the top teams from each conference need to get the top seedings - why not just guarantee them a top six spot but base top six seeding purely on points?
 
I wish they would do away with the conference crap and let every team play each other once.
 
We're looking at a situation where, at the end of the round, it's quite possible that Brumbies will be the top ranked Oz team, and only have 17 points. They could be seeded third overall and have fewer points than six teams!! (Bulls, Stormers, Chiefs, Highlanders, Hurricanes, Crusaders). I don't see why the top teams from each conference need to get the top seedings - why not just guarantee them a top six spot but base top six seeding purely on points?

Exactly!!

Everyone in South Africa and New Zealand know this! and how John O'neill got SANZAR to approve this stupid idea, will only they know!
 
The system isn't the fairest (the conference system is designed around revenue). But I don't think it's going to change the end result, the best 4 teams will probably make the semi finals again, then it's up to the teams to prove they are the best from there.
 
I'm sure in the long run it will even up more, when the NZ teams play each other again, and the Reds get back some players from injury - but it's still a bit weak.
 
the fcking conference system is bullsh!t!!! all about money!!!

the AUS conference are the easiest... so the teams winning there will have home semi en finals... just like laste year

cuz you play you own conference teams twice!!! so if you have easy games.. the points roll in!!!

why not a combined log of 15... each one play the others twice.... then top 4 have semi's and finals etc...

2 games... 1 home and 1 away... you can maybe play all the clubs in that country while on tour... less money spend than traveling to AUS now and only play 2 games, fly to SA only to return later again etc...

done klaar...
 
You can blame SARU for what we have now. To get Super 15 where everyone played everyone else at least once, we needed an extra two weeks in the competition window. SARU refused to move the Currie Cup back the required two weeks, and threatened to pull out of SANZAR if they were out-voted by the NZRU and ARU, so this less than satisfactory compromise is what they had to settle for.

The conference system is here to stay, for a while at least anyway. All three Unions wanted a guarantee of having at least one home playoff game, so having the conference winners seeded 1, 2 and 3 is the only way to achieve that.

Ultimately, I think the farcical arrangement of not playing one team in each cross conference series on a rotation basis has to go. The Reds picked up a significant advantage last year, not only being in the easiest conference (two games against the easy-beat Rebels) and not having to play the Sharks at all, while the Crusaders had to play both the Stormers and Bulls, and didn't play the easy-beat Lions or Rebels,
 
There is no way that come the end of the season the top Australian team won't be in the top 6. I just don't think it's realistically possible. But, yeah, I agree that every team should play every other team at least once.
 
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There is no way that come the end of the season the top Australian team won't be in the top 6. I just don't think it's realistically possible. But, yeah, I agree that every team should play every other team at least once.

I have just updated and posted the complete table above for Week 6, and there are a couple of points to note about the Australian Conference.

1. The Brumbies are seeded third, but the order of merit puts them sixth behind the Crusaders, so the competition regulations are protecting their third position.

2. Also, but for their bonus point, they would be out of the top six (in seventh behind the Sharks) were it not for the competition regulations.

3. No team in the Aussie Conference has a plus for/against. The Brumbies are on zero, and the rest are minus.
 
Why are the chiefs ahead if us? Is point for etc rather than the games wOn?


Under the old rules (before conference) table points ties were broken by who won the match between them, and only if it was a draw, would points difference some into it

They can't do that now, because the teams within conferences play each other twice, and outside the conferences, they don't play everybody.

So they have gone back to points difference... Chiefs have a F/A of 40, Highlanders have only 34.

In the Aussie Conference, Waratahs rank ahead of the Reds for the same reason.
 
Belay my last post

I have just found out that the competition rules have changed this year. This is how they work now

[TEXTAREA]DETERMINING TABLE POSITION IN THE EVENT OF TWO OR MORE TEAMS TIED
The following steps will be taken until the tie between the two
or more teams is broken. If two or more teams are equal on points in any position on either the Conference or overall Super Rugby standings at any time during the regular season their ranking will be determined by the following steps:
* Most wins from all matches
* Highest aggregate points difference from all matches
* Most tries from all matches
* Highest aggregate difference in tries for and against from all matches
* Coin toss (only used to determine Finalists)[/TEXTAREA]

I will adjust the tables in the next hour or so.


EDIT: Done. '
The only difference it made was swapping the Highlanders to 1st over the Chiefs, and the Reds to 2nd over the Waratahs.
 
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I actually thought you were right the first time and was just curious on the rules

The official super rugby site has the chiefs first and highlanders second....so some confusion on the rules?
 
I actually thought you were right the first time and was just curious on the rules

The official super rugby site has the chiefs first and highlanders second....so some confusion on the rules?

On "One News" tonight, Andrew Saville stated that the Highlanders lead because they have more wins.

Here is the lowdown on Rugby 365
 
Yeah, there's a lot of discrepancy amongst the media. The Herald had an article today where the whole first paragraph talked about how the Chiefs moved ahead of the Highlanders because of PD...
 
as i said, i would have thought the offical Super rugby wesite would be right...

right now it doesn't mean much but can be pretty important come the end of the season
 

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