Toulon: more, more, MOARRRRR RARRR !!

[Big Ewis]

Boudjellal's insatiable. His unquenchable thirst for moaaaarrrrrrrrr is just shocking, although it shouldn't be. When you have the money, you're going to spend it...and seeing how a lot of the Top 14 works, if you don't do it somebody else will...and anybody in his shoes would do the same...although he is particularly trigger-happy....

Vosloo leaving Clermont at the end of the season. Bam. Already solicited by Toulon. Some weeks ago, de Marchi already solicited by Toulon because he's starting to play a bit well at loosehead. Immediate interest, absolutely stunning. He refused of course...

I mean wtf would Gerhard Vosloo even do in Toulon ? seriously. What. The. Fk. Would. He. Even do in Toulon ?!
- Steffon Armittage is fetching ball like a beast there
- they've got Fernandez Lobbe (i.e. the best player on the Argentinian national squad)
- Juan Smith is a big ball carrier and doing a good job there, very powerful
- and they've even got Danie Rossouw (old now), Virgil Bruni (who's leaving though...), and Pierrick Gunther who's seldom given a chance but is a solid flanker.

At no. 8 they've got Masoe and Van Niekerk.

It's just amazing.
Moneh moneh moneh mohhhhnehhhh.....
MOHHHNEHHH !!

 

[gaston le gaff]

yes but you have to remember Toulon as they say themselves are now Auto financed and Boudjellal does no longer put his hands in his pockets (so they say)!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Bruni is now staying, Smith could be leaving and Roussouw is leaving as well, but with so many changes every season hard to keep up withit all.!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Big Ewis]

yeah I heard about Bruni after all. A 3 year contract with Toulon, and scratch that pre-contract with the USAP (who will get indemnities apparently, and they themselves say they have no idea about that deal !)...

 

[Draggs]

Not everyone is attracted to Toulon. Delve and now Kockott have turned their backs even after precontracts.

 

[Big Ewis]

yeah I know. Personally I'm rather criticizing Toulon's "indecency" of just having no "self esteem" (yes, my words, I know this is business) and literally going after eeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeevery motherfukking good player around, even from abroad the Top 14. Just no reluctance whatsoever. Everything goes, no issue.

But you're right. Kockott turned em down for sure, and Bruni was one tough guy to hold onto he was almost certainly leaving (before MONEY spoke again, louder the second time...).

It sucks too because if not for a few too many good players, I'd really have respected Toulon a lot. They have a trademark ability to put 60 on teams, Top 14 AND HC alike, and really play very well. They've been the best defense in the league two straight years now, and sure can attack and score tries-o-rama. Big scrum, big forwards strong in the rucks, excellent flyhalf, great backs....but just too loaded.
Like I said, if they had just a little less great players I'd really like this side, but they're too loaded to be fully respected.
However, again, gotta respect that they play well together. Not just any superteam would work de facto...

 

[gaston le gaff]

You forgot to mention one thing "The Bouclier de Brennus" even Jonny is desperate for this one achievment that he has not got his hands on yet, They won the H Cup last season job done, now they want the Bouclier came close to the double last season but Castres did thier homework and beat them!!! I have no problem with Toulon signing the great ex international players as i get to see it at least 2 games every season live, and the rest on tv, Boudjellal is now saying he does not need to invest his own money in Toulon anymore, as they auto finance themselves they have enlarged the capacity of the ground to over 15,000 which is more or less full capacity every home game and they intent to grow to 20,000 in the next couple of years. Although under extreme criticism Boudjellal actually moves the game forward in a weird sort of way, he should curb his press releases or quiet then down a little but guys like this are good for the game. Often front page headlines, good or bad he keeps the game in the lime light and all the players that are developed at Toulon in the Academy still have the chance to go elswhere if they are not good enough for Toulon, and they have produced many excellent players.

 

[Big Ewis]

hey monehh is monehh, and if you don't buy the players others will and where you wouldn't put up the most ridiculously loaded team somebody else would've. It's the rules of the game, it's just the game now is so ridiculous. Some teams can semi-survive, but what team can you call a genuine, old-school all-French side right now in the Top 14 ?

Even league worst Biarritz has 16 foreigners, just about as many Frenchmen (17).
Grenoble often recognized as one of the few "classic" teams in the league has 21 foreigners.
20 foreigners in Oyonnax, a team that's just made it to the Top 14 this season from the Pro D2.

As I keep saying, Boudjellal might as well, literally, buy the AB's piece by piece. What's stopping him in theory ? Technical aspects, that's all.

Anyways, yes Jonny's got everything, even a RWC trophy. Got the H Cup. The Grand Slam. He beat the AB's a couple of times. Now he wants a Bouclier de Brennus. But I have a feeling Clermont may have something to say about that this year.

 

[gaston le gaff]

Knowing Toulon they may well focus on the Bouclier this season instead of the H Cup, they desperately want another one, and it's something that even Boudjellal can't buy!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Big Ewis]

Knowing Toulon they may well focus on the Bouclier this season instead of the H Cup, they desperately want another one, and it's something that even Boudjellal can't buy!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

can't he ? We'll see about that in a few months, gaston.

 

[gaston le gaff]

Bernie la Porte allowed into changing rooms for the Toulon v Leinster H Cup he is banned till the 13th May from pitchside, changing rooms, and all corridors in all TOP 14 games, he has appealed this will be heard on the 13th March but i think it will fall on deaf ears, he was banned for his remaks against French ref Cardona he called him a pipeuse, (dick sucker) he is exactly right but chose the wrong words, probably the worst ref in the TOP 14.

 

[CAB_for_ever]

It's funny to see Toulouse, one of the best "stealers" of french youngs team, crying about the vilain Toulon !

Whatever you think and say, Boudjellal has brought a big toulon in french top 14 without truly making the other top 14 teams worse... in fact, a great toulon is one of the reasons top 14 has become the best championship...

I would worry more on the professionalism many have wished at any cost ! It has made defense far more important and stronger than attack...

 

[Big Ewis]

well Toulouse has a huge budget too, but obviously Toulon are just ridiculous. When I log onto the French Rugby news on my phone or my computer or whatever I'll see some transfer rumor or story that involves Toulon. It's just out of this world and ridiculous at this point.
I understand it's all a business, and money is the only thing that matters and speaks, but I can't help but wonder if Boudjellal ever stops and thinks, at least once every full moon: "hmmm...man, I really have literally zero decency do I ?...I'll just about do anything to win..."
He'd literally buy out the entire current AB side if he could. Keep a small herd of French players for the quota. No problem whatsoever.

 

[CAB_for_ever]

well Toulouse has a huge budget too, but obviously Toulon are just ridiculous. When I log onto the French Rugby news on my phone or my computer or whatever I'll see some transfer rumor or story that involves Toulon. It's just out of this world and ridiculous at this point.
I understand it's all a business, and money is the only thing that matters and speaks, but I can't help but wonder if Boudjellal ever stops and thinks, at least once every full moon: "hmmm...man, I really have literally zero decency do I ?...I'll just about do anything to win..."
He'd literally buy out the entire current AB side if he could. Keep a small herd of French players for the quota. No problem whatsoever.

I think it's a bit exagerating... He has "revolutionned" the thing, I agree. He has surprised the "dinosaurs" of the french top 14. I dislike the man, but I have a profound respect for what he has done with Toulon.

It's not a problem of budget then... the style and the Policy are the points where boudjellal is far Superior to many presidents of top 14. I am pretty sure Toulouse could have bought many foreigners Toulon did... and believe it or not, if ST had wished them, most would have surely chosen ST more than Toulon.

 

[CAB_for_ever]

oh and I forgot. personnally, I am for a quota, but a clever one... we need to force top 14 team to have at least one french in each position. if you don't put this condition, you will have what is the worst for french national squad : a lack of choices in certain positions. (10, 9, 8, 12, 13 for example)

 

[Big Ewis]

they wouldn't use them still. Even if you have a French flyhalf in each of the 14 teams, a lot of those may never ever see playing time with Wilko, MacAllister and co.
But it's still an idea...

The truth is: as good as it is in some aspects, we still have too many foreigners. They're going to eat up all the slots, a lot of the big roles; roles that could've been filled by French developing talents. There are no two ways about it: we just have far too many foreigners.
Every single tighthead prop in France is either a Georgian or a Pacific Islander. Having one French TH in each team won't make the Georgians/Pac Islanders play less.

With the Top 14 league we have in France, we should be absolutely swarming with talented choices at 10. We've got: FTD, Michalak, Talès, Lopez, Plisson basically, and lots of those have major flaws in their game. Michalak is unusable for e.g.

At the TH (pilier droit): we've got a tiring Mas and Slimani. Behind that, we've got a fat Ducalcon who can't play, Clément Ric from Clermont but he isn't nearly ready for the int'l level. We've got a bunch of Looseheads but no true TH threat.

 

[CAB_for_ever]

they wouldn't use them still. Even if you have a French flyhalf in each of the 14 teams, a lot of those may never ever see playing time with Wilko, MacAllister and co.
But it's still an idea...

The truth is: as good as it is in some aspects, we still have too many foreigners. They're going to eat up all the slots, a lot of the big roles; roles that could've been filled by French developing talents. There are no two ways about it: we just have far too many foreigners.
Every single tighthead prop in France is either a Georgian or a Pacific Islander. Having one French TH in each team won't make the Georgians/Pac Islanders play less.

With the Top 14 league we have in France, we should be absolutely swarming with talented choices at 10. We've got: FTD, Michalak, Talès, Lopez, Plisson basically, and lots of those have major flaws in their game. Michalak is unusable for e.g.

At the TH (pilier droit): we've got a tiring Mas and Slimani. Behind that, we've got a fat Ducalcon who can't play, Clément Ric from Clermont but he isn't nearly ready for the int'l level. We've got a bunch of Looseheads but no true TH threat.

It's exactely what I was meaning, about some key positions where we haven't any french, or at least not enough... It explains I put quota PLUS the obligation to have at least one french in each position or even 2... But I considere we need also great foreigners. French players need to meet regularly foreign cultures, and not only in tests or in european cups.

lets put a quota of 65% of French in the club and it should permit to have a sufficient "reservoir" (tank ? ) of french players in each position.

 

[Tony Manx]

It's exactely what I was meaning, about some key positions where we haven't any french, or at least not enough... It explains I put quota PLUS the obligation to have at least one french in each position or even 2... But I considere we need also great foreigners. French players need to meet regularly foreign cultures, and not only in tests or in european cups.

lets put a quota of 65% of French in the club and it should permit to have a sufficient "reservoir" (tank ? ) of french players in each position.

There are in existence percentages of qualified players who MUST make up the French Top 14 squad (not teams) but match squads. I do believe that this is in the region of some 55% and that Toulon had the most French qualified players in their squad on average over the whole of last season...believe it or not!

Furthermore..............................

Daily Telegraph
Gavin Mairs
10:22PM BST 17 Oct 2013

The row over the future of European club rugby appeared to take a dramatic twist on Thursday night when the owner of Heineken Cup holders Toulon declared that his club would boycott the rival Rugby Champions’ Cup tournament being set up by the English and French clubs.

Mourad Boudjellal, the president of Toulon, said his club would instead continue to participate in the existing European Rugby Cup tournament as a reaction to attempts by the Ligue Nationale de Rugby to limit the number of foreign-trained players eligible to play for Top 14 clubs.

The LNR has revealed plans to give financial incentives to clubs who maintain a squad of more than 55 per cent French-qualified players by 2017, which would result in Toulon facing a reduction in TV rights and marketing money given the high number of overseas players in their squad.

Boudjellal reacted angrily to these proposals by telling French newspapers on Thursday that if the LNR continued with its plans, his club would pull out of the new Anglo-French tournament next season.

“In the face of these despicable practices, which are racist and conservative, the club will take part in the H Cup [Heineken Cup] next season since the ERC does not have quotas on foreign players, contrary to the LNR’s ruling,” Boudjellal told French newspaper La Provence.

 

[CAB_for_ever]

Yes Tony... and then : what is so surprising ? I am not surprised about what has said Boudjellal, he is in his logic...

Then what will that change ? All French clubs will play ERC. English are alone there.

 

[Tony Manx]

Yes Tony... and then : what is so surprising ? I am not surprised about what has said Boudjellal, he is in his logic...

Then what will that change ? All French clubs will play ERC. English are alone there.

I showed this article only as an example that quotas are being used/considered in France and Europe......the content of the article as regards the ERC has been long overtaken by events since October 2013!!

 

[CAB_for_ever]

Once again, I think that like salary cap, we will have a strong quota. I don't say it will be easy... Anglo-speaking countries will force us and as usual, we will follow.