• Help Support The Rugby Forum :

[2014 Super Rugby] All Blacks Watch - Preseason

TRF Mr Fish

Your Piscine Overlord
TRF Legend
Joined
May 29, 2007
Messages
4,120
Country Flag
New Zealand
It's that time of year again, with a new season of the most exciting rugby tournament in the world about to kick off.

We're two seasons away from the next World Cup, meaning that although there's still time to force your way into selection, you've leaving it quite late to make yourself a realistic competitor for a 2015 jersey.

With the retirement of Andrew Hore and the emigration of Rene Ranger the picture is not quite as clouded as it was last year - there are fewer places available and fewer proven players to take up spots in the squad, so there won't be as many new caps as there were in 2013.

I think there are a large number of players who can be assured selection this year, injury permitting, regardless of form.

Safe:
Hooker - Mealamu, Coles
Prop - Franks, Woodcock, Crockett, Faumuina
Lock - Whitelock, Retallick
Loose Forward - McCaw, Read, Messam, Cane
Halfback - Smith
First Five - Carter, Cruden, Barrett
Centre - Nonu, Smith
Outside Back - Dagg, Smith, Piutau, Savea

That's 22 players, leaving room for eight more in the standard sized squad (I'm sure there'll be a few extras on the end of year tour, given the fact that we're likely to see some sort of exhibition match in the USA). With all certainty there will be a third hooker in the squad, a third lock, a fifth loose forward and probably one more prop. Of the four remaining spots, one will likely be taken up by another outside back, at least one will go to a halfback (though more likely we'll see three halfbacks in a squad of 30), and the final spot will probably go to one more back (a centre, I'd imagine).

There are multiple competitors for each spot, and some are likely very close to being included within the 'safe' contingent.

Hooker - Coltman, Marshall
These two are the only realistic options for filling in the third hooking berth. Both will be starting for their respective teams in the foreseeable future and therefore have the inside running over guys like Parsons and Funnell. Coltman has the most experience of the two and will likely be selected to back up Mealamu and Coles.

Prop - Franks, Moody, Toomaga-Allen, Afeaki
The most contested position (due to no one putting their hand up last year and cementing a spot), the props will be watched very closely by the selectors this year. Moody would have toured with the team last year were it not for a late injury and will therefore likely be top of the props at least to begin with. Franks has had a lot of time with the All Blacks and has yet to really prove himself while Afeaki's progress has been spoiled by injury. Toomaga-Allen could be considered a bit of a dark horse, even given his selection last year, as he can supposedly cover both sides of the scrum.

Lock - Romano, Bird
Injuries permitting, the third locking spot will certainly go to one of the above. Romano has a bit more experience, but Bird is viewed as a better long term option by most and is a better physical specimen. There is definitely a chance that both will make the cut, but with Luatua's likely inclusion in the squad the selectors may see three locks as all that's required. Romano is arguably a better complement to Whitelock and Retallick, so may get the go ahead on those grounds.

Loose Forward - Luatua, Kaino
Luatua is one of the borderline 'safe' candidates. He showed enough promise last year to be included in the group, the only mitigating factor being the return of 2011's player of the year. Six loose forwards will likely be seen as a luxury the All Blacks can't afford, and with Luatua's greater utility value he will probably make the cut. At this point in time Kaino is a complete unknown - sure he was fantastic a couple of years ago, but who knows whether or not his time in Japan has done him any good. Some people will expect to see Savea in the squad, but given that McCaw and Cane are definites, I don't think there will be room for a third openside flanker.

Halfback - Perenara, Kerr-Barlow
Self explanatory, really.

Centre - Saili, Crotty
Whilst there are other candidates that may fill this position, given the fact that these two are already capped and have spent time with the squad I think they will be the two contesting the final back spot. Crotty is more reliable whilst Saili has greater promise and a better all round game, but is still rough around the edges. If Saili can form a strong partnership in the midfield with Nonu at the Blues I think he will be selected. If it falls apart then Crotty will get the tap on the shoulder.

Outside Backs - Jane, Halai, McNicholl, Marshall
Much will depend on whether or not Jane looks back to his normal self this season. He's an easy selection if that's the case, and would likely be in the 'safe' squad were it not for his lack of game time last year. I personally think Halai won't push on, and like the look of McNicholl for the Crusaders. His ability to play both wing and fullback is also in his favour. Marshall is a bit of a left field call, but like McNicholl has a wide range of skills and could be a great bench player for the All Blacks.

All that really remains then is to have a look at what the likely squad for the matches against England will look like.

Hooker - Mealamu, Coles, Coltman
Prop - Franks, Woodcock, Crockett, Faumuina, Moody
Lock - Whitelock, Retallick, Romano
Loose Forward - McCaw, Read, Messam, Cane, Luatua
Halfback - Smith, Kerr-Barlow, Perenara
First Five - Cruden, Barrett
Centre - Nonu, Smith, Saili, Taylor
Outside Back - Dagg, Smith, Piutau, Savea, Jane

During the season I'll do a catch up every few weeks to see how the possibles are tracking along - I think we're in for a very exciting year of Super Rugby.
 
I know I'm the only one - but I'd waaaay rather have Kaino, Luatua or even Vito as our blindsides and say goodbye to Messam..

Nice sum up! There is also a longshot chance Ardie Savea may get the call up...
 
I know I'm the only one - but I'd waaaay rather have Kaino, Luatua or even Vito as our blindsides and say goodbye to Messam..

Nice sum up! There is also a longshot chance Ardie Savea may get the call up...

I think Messam has finally proven himself as a test level player - something Vito hasn't achieved. Kaino I'm basically completely reserving judgment on until we see how he performs.
 
Good read, Mr Fish. Will be monitoring this thread.

Agree about Messam. He certainly was part of why we struggled against the ABs last year although it seems Barrett is our true cryptonite.
 
question..

by referring to centre, are you talking about 13? or both 12 and 13... in NZ you refer to centre as only 13 and 12 is 2nd 5-8

my biggest concern is on 12 (2nd 5-8) nonu is past his best so who else???

pitty about tamati Ellison, if not I guess Saili... but im not so sure... SBW maybe???
 
question..

by referring to centre, are you talking about 13? or both 12 and 13... in NZ you refer to centre as only 13 and 12 is 2nd 5-8

my biggest concern is on 12 (2nd 5-8) nonu is past his best so who else???

pitty about tamati Ellison, if not I guess Saili... but im not so sure... SBW maybe???

Probably should've run with midfield, my apologies! I'm referring to both 12 and 13. I'm hoping Saili will progress well this year, but as you've noted SBW will be back next year and will likely grab a spot in the World Cup squad.
 
Probably should've run with midfield, my apologies! I'm referring to both 12 and 13. I'm hoping Saili will progress well this year, but as you've noted SBW will be back next year and will likely grab a spot in the World Cup squad.


no its fine, I just wanted to be clear on the centres etc...

on SBW I don't think he is a 2nd 5-8, he is better as a centre (13) then as a inside centre. that is just my view

I've mentioned before that I would love to see more of tim na-nai on inside centre for a possible teamup with ben smith on centre (13)

some feel this combo will be too light...
 
I think Messam has finally proven himself as a test level player - something Vito hasn't achieved. Kaino I'm basically completely reserving judgment on until we see how he performs.

I argee. I thought he had a very good season last year, and had firmly established himself as the AB's 1st choice 6. His defensive line-speed is second to none among NZ loose-forwards, he is getting increasingly more physical on defense, his offloading skills are superb (and important part of the current AB's game-plan), and he is very effective at the breakdown. He is a very different style of 6 than we are used to (and I still wish he would run straight more often!), but (despite some reservations) I'm more than happy to see him in the AB's 6 jersey at the start of the season.

Luatua is an outstanding talent and it looked at the start of the last season as he may over-take Messam as NZ's premier 6, but he still has some work to do on his game. He plays very wide on attack - the AB's do like having a loose-forward wider out from the ruck, but Read performs that role. When Read and Luatua played together Read was forced to tighten up his game and do much more of the donkey work and was far less effective because of this. Luatua seems to be learning fast, and I'm sure he has been told to tighten up his game a little for test rugby. I do think Luatau and Read could form part of an outstanding combination in future, but at the moment I think Messam & Read are a better combination.

As Mr Fish states Vito has never proven himself at 6 at test level, and I do think he is far more effective at 8 (he is easily the 2nd best 8 in the country in my opinion). I too will reserve my judgement on Kaino. However if he gets back to his best I would have him starting at 6 for the AB's in a heartbeat (as at his best he is easily the best 6 in the world). Shields isn't too far behind either - the main thing he needs to (once he gets fit again) is improve his accuracy in defense. Luke Whitelock is an option too as his last name is Whitelock.....

Anyways onto the rest of the Mr Fish's post (which I agree with most of):

Hookers:

I think it is really a one-horse race for the 3rd hooker spot (barring injury), with Coltman the only horse. I'm a massive fan of Coltman, and I see no reason why he couldn't be the AB's number 1 hooker by the end of the season. He has a natural size advantage over the likes of Mealamu and Coles, is regarded as the best scrummaging hooker in the country, is an excellent defender, has a massive work-rate, is handy at the breakdown, and continues to show improvement in his running game. His only real weaknesses are his lineout throwing (which has improved so much that it is barely a weakness anymore) and the fact he gives away a few too many penalties (mainly from over-eagerness).

It is hard to know exactly what to expect from Marshall as he has barely played any Super Rugby (and didn't really standout for Taranaki during the ITM Cup). He will obviously get a big chance to impress for the Chiefs early season, so it will be interesting to see what he offers. Parsons played well for the Blues last season but doesn't seem to be on the AB's selectors radar. I actually feel that two of the Crusaders hookers may be still ahead of Marshall in the AB's pecking order. It will interesting to see who out of Funnell or Flynn starts for the Crusaders this season, as Funnell has started most of the pre-season matches. Funnell had some time with the AB's squad last season, and I'm sure Flynn is still on the AB's selectors radar. He may be getting a bit older (33), but he is probably playing the best rugby of his career, and the AB's selectors know he can do a job if required...

Locks:

I think Thrush is probably still on the AB's selectors radars. He has taken a long time to develop, but I thought he showed some good signs last season. He is clearly still behind Romano, but I don't think there is much between him and Bird at this stage (though Bird clearly has much more potential).

Loosies:
No room for Mr Whitelock? ;) I agree with the names mentioned, and I think Brad Shields is not far behind. Matt Todd played well last season, but would require an injury to Cane or McCaw to get a look in (assuming Savea hasn't overtake him). Luke Braid would look good in Black, but he is a fair way down the pecking order. I still believe Victor Vito is easily the 2nd best 8 in the country, but there doesn't seem to be any room for him (especially if Kaino plays well at 8 for the Blues).

Backs:
Who cares ;) Not much for me to add here - midfield is still a bit of an area of concern. I agree tend to agree that we won't see that much more of Halai - he is big and strong, but I think there are better options. I'm hoping to see a back three of 11. Savea, 14. Piutau, and 15. Smith, but I can't see the AB's selectors ever dropping Dagg....
 
Last edited:

Latest posts

Top