A Political Thread

[Vladimir12]

The radioactive killing of at least 2 Russians opposed to Putin. They were also reponsible for the 'plane crash' that killed the Polish Premier and the shooting down of a Dutch airliner flying over the Ukraine.

The Crimea was overrun by Russian Regular and irregular soldiers that much was obvious to everyone.

I do agree about the west given the mess in the middle east but Putin makes GW Bush look like a sandel wearing, Guardian reading, tofu munching hippie.

Russia not to shoot down planes Polish and Dutch, and we probably killed Litvinenko, but who?

In Russia, a lot of rich people of the former KGB, so that someone could kill the rat.

And Politkovskaya was killed just as Putin's birthday.

It is clear to all that this is it!

Tell me, have you read Conan Doyle?

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With the greatest of respect what are you on about?

About the German offensive in May 1940 of course!

You had neither Stalin nor communist repression, but you sailed to his island, and France capitulated!

 

[McTallshort]

][/B]Russia not to shoot down planes Polish and Dutch, and we probably killed Litvinenko, but who?

In Russia, a lot of rich people of the former KGB, so that someone could kill the rat.

And Politkovskaya was killed just as Putin's birthday.

It is clear to all that this is it!

Tell me, have you read Conan Doyle?

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About the German offensive in May 1940 of course!

You had neither Stalin nor communist repression, but you sailed to his island, and France capitulated!

So is the point you are trying to make is that Stalin was not a brutal, repressive dictator who didnt order the death of millions of people?

Who did shoot down the dutch airliner then?

 

[Vladimir12]

Or is out view of Russia, and Communism, distorted by Western press and ideals? When we consider that it was hopeful in the 90s that Russia would move closer to Europe and ultimately Capitalism, but this has not happened as hoped it is possible that things have been fabricated.

There has been an increased press of Russian planes and boats close to UK territory, but this has occurred for decades. This is an attempt to scare the public, and it cannot be a coincidence that it concedes with a pro-Russia leader (elected) of Ukraine being 'ousted'.

In the late 80s youth in Russia by 99% has been adjusted pro-Western, fracture occurred after the US with friends attack on Yugoslavia .

Now the west no one believes ...

I can recommend a book by Steven Cohen "Failed Crusade: America and the Tragedy of Post-Communist Russia" ...

 

[McTallshort]

In the late 80s youth in Russia by 99% has been adjusted pro-Western, fracture occurred after the US with friends attack on Yugoslavia .

Now the west no one believes ...

I can recommend a book by Steven Cohen "Failed Crusade: America and the Tragedy of Post-Communist Russia" ...

Explain?

 

[Vladimir12]

So is the point you are trying to make is that Stalin was not a brutal, repressive dictator who didnt order the death of millions of people?

Who did shoot down the dutch airliner then?

Stalin was a dictator, but a totalitarian USSR could resist Hitler.

When the Germans were outside Moscow any call for peace was punished by execution.

No democratic country would not stand the fact that the Soviet Union broke down in 41 year.

Poles crashed out of the fact that Kaczynski has ordered the plane to land in the fog when he was sent to the alternate.

Someone knocked on the Boeing Ukraine, I do not know, I think it was either the militia or the Ukrainian Army ...

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Explain?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NATO_bombing_of_Yugoslavia



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In the late 80s we thought that the Soviet Union creates the greatest injustice in the world.

Not West won the USSR, citizens themselves have decided that they are mostly the world's evil.

The illegal actions of the US and NATO cure us of this error, because the Serbs - a "Balkan Russian."

We realized that if we continue like Yeltsin, we end up like the Serbs ...

 

[Jbobo]

Stalin was so paranoid and psychotic that even on the day of his death, when he didn't leave his room for about 18 hours due to a cerebral hemorrhage, his guards and house keepers were too scared to go inside and check on him.

Sorry if not relevant to what you were talking about, I only saw the bit about his paranoia. I love the karma of it though. Terrible man.

 

[Vladimir12]

Stalin was so paranoid and psychotic that even on the day of his death, when he didn't leave his room for about 18 hours due to a cerebral hemorrhage, his guards and house keepers were too scared to go inside and check on him.

Sorry if not relevant to what you were talking about, I only saw the bit about his paranoia. I love the karma of it though. Terrible man.

Stalin was convinced that Europe will be a great war. Not necessarily with Germany, and he feared attack by England and France.

"We are 50-100 years behind. Must cover this distance in 10 years. Either do it, or they crush us." (IV Stalin, Works, Vol. 13, pp. 38 -39)

This was said in 1931.

All of Stalin's actions were subordinated to it that the Soviet Union would have survived.

By the way do you know that the summer of 1940, Britain and France were going to bomb the oil fields in Baku?

This was prevented only defeat in May and the surrender of France.

And the idea was that if the blow yet struck?

The Soviet Union, Germany and Japan would become allies and history would have taken a completely different ...

 

[McTallshort]

Stalin was a dictator, but a totalitarian USSR could resist Hitler.

When the Germans were outside Moscow any call for peace was punished by execution.

No democratic country would not stand the fact that the Soviet Union broke down in 41 year.

Poles crashed out of the fact that Kaczynski has ordered the plane to land in the fog when he was sent to the alternate.

Someone knocked on the Boeing Ukraine, I do not know, I think it was either the militia or the Ukrainian Army ...

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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NATO_bombing_of_Yugoslavia

And who armed the militia with Surface to Air missiles of the type that can take high altitude targets down like a jet liner?

Lets just say your point about a totalitarian USSR is correct, at the start of operation Barbarossa the Red army had vastly more men, more tanks and more planes that the invading Germans. What they didnt have was leadership because in the late 30's Stalin had ordered a purging of the red army that had almost wiped out its entire command structure, what officers were left were too terrified of the commisars do react when things didnt go to plan.

Stalin continually ignored warnings from Britain that the Germans were about to invade thinking it was just a ruse to drag the USSR into the war with its then ally Nazi Germany.

When the invasion did happen Stalin took command of the red army and ordered its armies to fight were they stood despite the likes of Kukov warning him not to. 1 million red army soldiers were captured in the fall of Kiev because the germans simply went round the static russians and surrounded them.

By the time the Germans reached Moscow they were spent, most of there armour was broken down or destroyed in battle and 33% of their army was dead or frozen. The soviet counter offensive out side Moscow very nearly destroyed the German army in 1941 but because of the vast casualties in the earlier battles they didnt have the reserves to make it count.

Did it take a totalitian USSR to defeat Nazi Germany? Yes I agree but had the Red army had its orginal command structure in place the Germans would and should have been defeated well before reaching Moscow. Had Stalin not killed so many of his generals, prepared better for the invasion everyone else knew was coming and let his commanders retreat when surrounded the USSR would have won the war a lot earlier and would have done it without such cost in lives.

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Stalin was convinced that Europe will be a great war. Not necessarily with Germany, and he feared attack by England and France.

"We are 50-100 years behind. Must cover this distance in 10 years. Either do it, or they crush us." (IV Stalin, Works, Vol. 13, pp. 38 -39)

This was said in 1931.

All of Stalin's actions were subordinated to it that the Soviet Union would have survived.

By the way do you know that the summer of 1940, Britain and France were going to bomb the oil fields in Baku?

This was prevented only defeat in May and the surrender of France.

And the idea was that if the blow yet struck?

The Soviet Union, Germany and Japan would become allies and history would have taken a completely different ...

They were allies in 1940

 

[Vladimir12]

And who armed the militia with Surface to Air missiles of the type that can take high altitude targets down like a jet liner?

Lets just say your point about a totalitarian USSR is correct, at the start of operation Barbarossa the Red army had vastly more men, more tanks and more planes that the invading Germans. What they didnt have was leadership because in the late 30's Stalin had ordered a purging of the red army that had almost wiped out its entire command structure, what officers were left were too terrified of the commisars do react when things didnt go to plan.

According to the Dutch shot by professionals, the calculation "Buk" of about 10-15 people.

Donbass Miners do it would not be able.

The plane was shot down a Ukrainian military or volunteers from Russia.

I am surprised by one missile launch seen from afar, it is a huge column of smoke, but for some reason there are no witnesses ...

Maybe Boeing fighter shot down, I do not know.

 

[McTallshort]

https://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&r...d3iwFAqSh1dTd0d9x3lOF_Q&bvm=bv.96783405,d.ZGU

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According to the Dutch shot by professionals, the calculation "Buk" of about 10-15 people.

Donbass Miners do it would not be able.

The plane was shot down a Ukrainian military or volunteers from Russia.

I am surprised by one missile launch seen from afar, it is a huge column of smoke, but for some reason there are no witnesses ...

Maybe Boeing fighter shot down, I do not know.

Thats right, Russian Professional soldiers operating a state of the art SAM glad we agree at last!

 

[Vladimir12]

They were allies in 1940

Would the Allies and Rommel's tanks Zhukov would meet in Cairo.

Stalin wanted to avoid the war and did not try to fight with Germany for the triumph of democracy throughout the world.

This is called armed neutrality ...

Neither England nor France declared war on the Soviet Union in 1940.


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Thats right, Russian Professional ...nnocence" or do you always blame Russian? :)

 

[Jbobo]

Do you know what a "presumption of innocence" or do you always blame Russian?

Putin certainly knows what it is.

 

[Vladimir12]

And who armed the militia with Surface to Air missiles of the type that can take high altitude targets down like a jet liner?

Lets just say your point about a totalitarian USSR is correct, at the start of operation Barbarossa the Red army had vastly more men, more tanks and more planes that the invading Germans. What they didnt have was leadership because in the late 30's Stalin had ordered a purging of the red army that had almost wiped out its entire command structure, what officers were left were too terrified of the commisars do react when things didnt go to plan.

Stalin continually ignored warnings from Britain that the Germans were about to invade thinking it was just a ruse to drag the USSR into the war with its then ally Nazi Germany.

When the invasion did happen Stalin took command of the red army and ordered its armies to fight were they stood despite the likes of Kukov warning him not to. 1 million red army soldiers were captured in the fall of Kiev because the germans simply went round the static russians and surrounded them.

By the time the Germans reached Moscow they were spent, most of there armour was broken down or destroyed in battle and 33% of their army was dead or frozen. The soviet counter offensive out side Moscow very nearly destroyed the German army in 1941 but because of the vast casualties in the earlier battles they didnt have the reserves to make it count.

Did it take a totalitian USSR to defeat Nazi Germany? Yes I agree but had the Red army had its orginal command structure in place the Germans would and should have been defeated well before reaching Moscow. Had Stalin not killed so many of his generals, prepared better for the invasion everyone else knew was coming and let his commanders retreat when surrounded the USSR would have won the war a lot earlier and would have done it without such cost in lives.

You know that the Russian Empire did not carry out any major successful offensive against Germany in World War I?

And only a third of the Kaiser troops fought in the East!

The country has not produced engines for airplanes, no tanks. Not even the army could provide small arms!

20 years have passed under the leadership of Stalin and what happened?

I could do it just paranoid?

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Putin certainly knows what it is.

But the West knows what it is?

 

[McTallshort]

Would the Allies and Rommel's tanks Zhukov would meet in Cairo.

Stalin wanted to avoid the war and did not try to fight with Germany for the triumph of democracy throughout the world.

This is called armed neutrality ...

Neither England nor France declared war on the Soviet Union in 1940.


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Do you know what a "presumption of innocence" or do you always blame Russian?

I blame the side with the capability to shoot down a high altitude airliner, the Ukrainan army doesnt have that capability and as you said nither do Donbass miners so it kind of points to Russia.

Stalin signed a pact with Nazi Germany in 1940 and invaded Poland 2 weeks after the Germans did carving the country in half.

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You know that the Russian Empire did not carry out any major successful offensive against Germany in World War I?

And only a third of the Kaiser troops fought in the East!

The country has not produced engines for airplanes, no tanks. Not even the army could provide small arms!

20 years have passed under the leadership of Stalin and what happened?

I could do it just paranoid?

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But the West knows what it is?

WTF are you going on about?

Reply if you want but I wont be replying to you its like talking to the village idiot whos been at the vodka all day.

 

[Vladimir12]

I blame the side with the capability to shoot down a high altitude airliner, the Ukrainan army doesnt have that capability and as you said nither do Donbass miners so it kind of points to Russia.

Do you think that the Ukrainians could not bring down the plane?

Why?

Ukrainian army has shot down a passenger plane in 2001, why can not she do it again?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Siberia_Airlines_Flight_1812

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Stalin signed a pact with Nazi Germany in 1940 and invaded Poland 2 weeks after the Germans did carving the country in half.

This happened in 1939.

Since early August, there were negotiations in Moscow with Britain and France on the Union, but they ended without result, since England had sent to negotiate a person without the right to sign any documents.

After this Stalin signed a pact with Germany.

He took the fact that Poland was taken from a weakened Russia in 1920 because of the revolution and civil war.

Russian always come for their money.

Why, then, neither Britain nor France declared war on the Soviet Union?

 

[Jbobo]

But the West knows what it is?

I don't think you're grasping my point. The point is that Putin was and is well aware that the burden of proof would be on Ukraine and the West, thus thinks he can deny his way to innocence and more widely, victory in his objectives. Haven't read much of what you guys are debating and am not too interested in doing so with a dude who I think is probably indoctrinated by his Tsar.

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

What I don't like is the fact that Cadbury in particular can charge a huge amount for a fredo when it is in fact smaller than it previous cheaper version.

 

[McTallshort]

What I don't like is the fact that Cadbury in particular can charge a huge amount for a fredo when it is in fact smaller than it previous cheaper version.

I blame Putin

 

[ZeroTwo]

What I don't like is the fact that Cadbury in particular can charge a huge amount for a fredo when it is in fact smaller than it previous cheaper version.

Tait for CEO.

 

[Jbobo]

I blame Putin