A Political Thread

[j'nuh]

Most polls are pointing to that Sanders would beat Trump by a bigger margin than Clinton would:
http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-m...-sanders-says-he-consistently-beats-donald-t/

(See the table halfway down the page.)

Commentary on why Sanders may do well against Republicans:
http://www.alternet.org/news-amp-po...icans-have-been-voting-bernie-sanders-vermont

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

Sanders seems alright.

I just can't stand Clinton, she has done herself zero favors over the last 4 years she isn't a leader.

At least Sanders is fairly likeable.

 

[ncurd]

Lets be honest here it doesn't matter which of them gets in if they elect a republican congress (in either house) again. Obama basically got stopped from doing anything useful because of it.

 

[Gavin]

The government's Help to Buy Scheme is a false flag (yes another one), and it keeps the money with the rich.

It is my intention to buy a house with the ball n' chain over the next 2-3 years and we looked specifically at the Help to Buy Scheme, but there is a lot of small print.

For example if you decide to move house you are NOT allowed to rent out your property - therefore meaning that is it only the rich who can buy their own house can rent it out and make more money

If you sell your house and lose out on the sale then you owe the government a substantial fee.

I would personally rather make sure the ownership of the property is mine, without any hidden ties.

Funnily enough we can afford the monthly mortgage repayments as they are cheaper than our current rent but we do not have £20,000 - £25,000 worth of savings for the deposit (taken as 10% of the cheapest properties in my city). Even then it means we cannot save money considering the high rental costs.

 

[ncurd]

So on the first point, can't you just take out a higher mortgage on the second home and pay back the goverment share (or mortgage the goverment share out of the original house) on the original opening it up to rent?

The whole point of that clause is to stop people renting out properties though and rightly so the goverment is helping you buy a home and get on the property ladder not helping you make additional income. I see absolutely no issue whilst the goverment has a stake in a property you own for you not to be allowed to make money of of it.

Selling and loosing out is exactly the same as selling and still owing a mortgage, difference is you're not screwed over by interest as well.


In terms of saving up get a help-to-buy ISA (switch to lifetime once avalible) small print is only you can use it buy your first home and you can't use it to buy to rent. However it pays out 25% towards the deposit of your first home honestly anyone looking to buy and not having one is a bit mad.

 

[Gavin]

The whole point of that clause is to stop people renting out properties though and rightly so the goverment is helping you buy a home and get on the property ladder not helping you make additional income. I see absolutely no issue whilst the goverment has a stake in a property you own for you not to be allowed to make money of of it.

Regarding this point -

The government should step and limit the amount of houses which can be rented by private landlords, but surely this clause is only affecting the poor, not the rich.

Most people will buy a small first home and probably move on to a larger property. The government is saying 'yes to may have your own property, but you cannot do what you want with it'. I for example may only be able to afford a property in Margate / Ramsgate - I surely do not want to stay there forever.

The government tells me I cannot rent out my property and make some extra income, though richer people who do not have to enter the scheme are more than welcome to buy properties and rent them out, therefore gaining extra income (most don't need). It feels like you are offered a ladder with the scheme, but some of the rungs are missing.

If the government really wants to sort out the renting crisis then it should bring in more rules concerning how much can be charged and the quality of the properties.

My current properties mortgage is £400 per month. There are 4 bedrooms with each resident paying £350 - £450 each!

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

Lol @ #resigncameron
And
The petition to have another general election in 2016

 

[Thingimubob]

Lol @ #resigncameron
And
The petition to have another general election in 2016

Ha. If only. Can't see it happening in a million years though! From what I've heard, it's likely Cameron hasn't done anything technichally illegal, just something that's considered by many to be highly immoral.

I mean, even if he's dodged the tax legally, it still sets a pretty sh*tty example as a Prime Minister.

If he's been dodging paying his taxes properly, despite being loaded and in a high paying job, it doesn't exactly inspire everyone else to stick to the rules does it?

Icelandic PM has already been brought down by the leak, though from what I understand he's in it a hell of a lot deeper than Cameron.

 

[j'nuh]

For example if you decide to move house you are NOT allowed to rent out your property - therefore meaning that is it only the rich who can buy their own house can rent it out and make more money

This is a good thing. People owning properties purely to rent it out shortens the supply of houses on the market, pushing up house prices, making it difficult for others to buy a property to live in. Buy-to-let = scummy.

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

This is a good thing. People owning properties purely to rent it out shortens the supply of houses on the market, pushing up house prices, making it difficult for others to buy a property to live in. Buy-to-let = scummy.

Nah nothing wrong with Buy to let I would do it if i wasn't already a billionaire space cowboy/pro golfer.

 

[j'nuh]

Daily Mail really does enjoy a bit of poo slinging.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...MP-pension-50-000-year-leaves-Parliament.html

Official records suggest the Labour leader has been paid £1.5million since he was elected as an MP in 1983.

£1.5m over 33 years = £45,500 a year. So outrageous.

Corbyn made, for me, a compelling point in his speech today. The EU is responsible for so many labour protections that would be stripped away if we left. Whilst we can enact those laws ourselves, does anyone trust the Tories "race to the bottom" ideology (e.g. corporation tax, high earner tax level) to do this? They would rig it for their rich friends so that companies pay less out to workers, offer less safe environments etc. all in the interest of "being competitive".

The advantage of the EU is that it's less competition; with labour laws covering the entirety of Europe, you can't have countries undercutting one another in a bid to win business at the expense of labour rights.

 

[Thingimubob]

Daily Mail really does enjoy a bit of poo slinging.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...MP-pension-50-000-year-leaves-Parliament.html


£1.5m over 33 years = £45,500 a year. So outrageous.

Corbyn made, for me, a compelling point in his speech today. The EU is responsible for so many labour protections that would be stripped away if we left. Whilst we can enact those laws ourselves, does anyone trust the Tories "race to the bottom" ideology (e.g. corporation tax, high earner tax level) to do this? They would rig it for their rich friends so that companies pay less out to workers, offer less safe environments etc. all in the interest of "being competitive".

The advantage of the EU is that it's less competition; with labour laws covering the entirety of Europe, you can't have countries undercutting one another in a bid to win business at the expense of labour rights.

Typical Daily Fail stretching and warping the truth as much as they can!

Corbyn got it spot on with the labour protection laws. I don't hold much faith that a Tory government would keep the laws in place if we do leave the EU, so certainly only of the biggest reasons I'm backing the Remain campaign!

 

[j'nuh]

Typical Daily Fail stretching and warping the truth as much as they can!

Corbyn got it spot on with the labour protection laws. I don't hold much faith that a Tory government would keep the laws in place if we do leave the EU, so certainly only of the biggest reasons I'm backing the Remain campaign!

Me too. I, for one, quite enjoy the ability to take time off of work outside of the weekend.

I'm actually quite worried that we are gonna amble out of the EU cuz the people who want to stay in the EU don't really give a crap and won't show up, and the people who want to leave are overtly one-minded about it and will be at stations with the first light of morning.

 

[Tony Manx]

Go on vote to stay in and accept more and more restrictive legislation over which you have no say, more and more corruption amongst the increasingly unelected Brussels cabal, more and more German control!!

And do bear in mind that the European model is mainly not to own your own house but to rent for life.....so no good news there for you!!

Good luck with that as hopefully, if we stay in, the ramifications will not be felt in what time is left for me but will increasingly find you young fellas under the yoke, with no democratic rights, that my parents and your grandparents fought to fight against!

Government will be entirely in the hands of the unelected Council of Ministers who's actions can be reviewed by the European Parliament but not over ruled.........

You should all practice the hand out in front of you as a salute........

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

I'm voting out now.

Apprently a Eurovision boss has bad mouthed Wogan saying he ruined Eurovision in UK and Ireland.

Which is ludicrous, he only said what everyone is thinking.

And judging by the comments from people I'm going to assume that swedes and Eastern Europeans take Eurovision too seriously and obvs lack a decent sense of humor

 

[Deleted member 53362]

Go on vote to stay in and accept more and more restrictive legislation over which you have no say, more and more corruption amongst the increasingly unelected Brussels cabal, more and more German control!!

And do bear in mind that the European model is mainly not to own your own house but to rent for life.....so no good news there for you!!

Good luck with that as hopefully, if we stay in, the ramifications will not be felt in what time is left for me but will increasingly find you young fellas under the yoke, with no democratic rights, that my parents and your grandparents fought to fight against!

Government will be entirely in the hands of the unelected Council of Ministers who's actions can be reviewed by the European Parliament but not over ruled.........

You should all practice the hand out in front of you as a salute........

Thats it Tony people forget what it was like to be in just a common market. People forget in the 80's people could go and work all over western europe (and Eastern Europe in some cases) mostly tax free. Travel was fairly unrestricted and had the added bonus of duty free and cheaper food and drink when you got to Spain and Greece. They also forget the amount of money poured into Spain, Portugal, Greece and Ireland to build roads and buildings that are largly empty now. They forget Cornish fishing rights being given to the Spanish, market store holders being prosucuted for refusing to use metric measurements, small dairies and Slaughter houses closed down because the owners couldnt afford the loan payments they had to take out to make their businesses EU complient (this happened all over Europe and hit Eastern Europe very hard).

We went from being a very loose group of trading states who all did things a bit differently to being steam rollered into a German federal system that everyone must comply with or else.

And please please spare me the crap about workers rights, wages in the lowest paid jobs have declined since 2005 and how are the likes of Poland supposed to grow their economy when their best and brightest are picking cabbages in Norfolk?

I will probably vote to stay in because we have sunk too much money into the German sorry EU project and we are not in a position to just cut our losses but we should have just kept everything as it was under the common market and enjoyed tax free German wages, Cheap holidays and the odd pre Xmas booze cruise but then my wife would not have travelled from Poland in 2005 to work and meet me 5 years later....come to think of it she voted UKIP last year.

 

[j'nuh]

And please please spare me the crap about workers rights, wages in the lowest paid jobs have declined since 2005 and how are the likes of Poland supposed to grow their economy when their best and brightest are picking cabbages in Norfolk?

Wages went down because of the Great Recession.

As for worker rights, a good example:

The EU’s Working Time Directive (2003/88/EC) requires EU countries to guarantee the following rights for all workers:

• a limit to weekly working hours, which must not exceed 48 hours on average, including any overtime
• a minimum daily rest period of 11 consecutive hours in every 24
• a rest break during working hours if the worker is on duty for longer than 6 hours
• a minimum weekly rest period of 24 uninterrupted hours for each 7-day period, in addition to the 11 hours' daily rest
• paid annual leave of at least 4 weeks per year
• extra protection for night work, e.g.
• average working hours must not exceed 8 hours per 24-hour period,
• night workers must not perform heavy or dangerous work for longer than 8 hours in any 24-hour period,
• night workers have the right to free health assessments and, under certain circumstances, to transfer to day work.

And do we really trust the Tories to be better than the EU at particularly guarding the wages and rights of the lower paid? For example, the EU tries to impose tariffs on Chinese steel and UK blocks it:
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...s-by-blocking-eu-plans-to-allow-a6962446.html

With the advent of globalisation, the effectiveness of nations regulating companies and taxing high-wealth individuals has fallen to pieces. Countries now have to be tax-competitive to win business and to stop the wealthy migrating for tax purposes. The rich are getting obscenely rich off of the perks of globalisation, and not paying much tax on it, which is leading to unprecedented income inequality. The only way countries have any prospect of trying to curb this is by collective legislation that stops the incessant tax and working conditions undercutting between countries. Breaking away from the EU would be a major step backwards from this ever happening. The world has changed since we joined the EU.

 

[Deleted member 53362]

Wages went down because of the Great Recession.

As for worker rights, a good example:

The EU’s Working Time Directive (2003/88/EC) requires EU countries to guarantee the following rights for all workers:

• a limit to weekly working hours, which must not exceed 48 hours on average, including any overtime
• a minimum daily rest period of 11 consecutive hours in every 24
• a rest break during working hours if the worker is on duty for longer than 6 hours
• a minimum weekly rest period of 24 uninterrupted hours for each 7-day period, in addition to the 11 hours' daily rest
• paid annual leave of at least 4 weeks per year
• extra protection for night work, e.g.
• average working hours must not exceed 8 hours per 24-hour period,
• night workers must not perform heavy or dangerous work for longer than 8 hours in any 24-hour period,
• night workers have the right to free health assessments and, under certain circumstances, to transfer to day work.

And do we really trust the Tories to be better than the EU at particularly guarding the wages and rights of the lower paid? For example, the EU tries to impose tariffs on Chinese steel and UK blocks it:
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...s-by-blocking-eu-plans-to-allow-a6962446.html

With the advent of globalisation, the effectiveness of nations regulating companies and taxing high-wealth individuals has fallen to pieces. Countries now have to be tax-competitive to win business and to stop the wealthy migrating for tax purposes. The rich are getting obscenely rich off of the perks of globalisation, and not paying much tax on it, which is leading to unprecedented income inequality. The only way countries have any prospect of trying to curb this is by collective legislation that stops the incessant tax and working conditions undercutting between countries. Breaking away from the EU would be a major step backwards from this ever happening. The world has changed since we joined the EU.

No wages stayed the same in most areas because of a lack of wages rises. The starting wages for the basic jobs in warehousing and distubution have dropped since 2005, places like that Sports Direct hell hole in Shirebrook would never have functioned before the influx of such a large amount of cheap labour.

All the directives you list were common place before the EU forced them on everyone and most people still have the option of signing an opt out clause in their contract.

Tax? Are you serious, its because Google can set up in Ireland and trade in the UK they get away with paying tax. Yes the world has changed, India and Brazil are now growing as are other world markets but we are stuck in the greater federal republic of Germany with its weak currency and massive debts, oh at least we have cheap car washes now.

 

[j'nuh]

No wages stayed the same in most areas because of a lack of wages rises. The starting wages for the basic jobs in warehousing and distubution have dropped since 2005, places like that Sports Direct hell hole in Shirebrook would never have functioned before the influx of such a large amount of cheap labour.

Yet the data contradicts this:

Average wages amongst the lowest 10% (as with any other financial group) have continuously risen in spite of migration:

Average household income was rising up until the financial crisis, in spite of immigration:

Unemployment rate was on a downward trend 1998-2007, then increased because of the recession in 2008. Clearly the recession and not migration was at fault here:

 

[Deleted member 53362]

OK, since leaving the Army nearly 20 years ago I have worked almost exclusively in Logistics. In 2002 I got a job as a loader/picker in a warehouse working for a large high street chain. My starting salary was the modest but not poor £15000pa. That included a final salary pension, xmas bonus, 37 hours with no enforced overtime (I took it anyway because Im a grabber). Fast forward 10 years and Im now a warehouse manager interviewing new starters for a job with a starting salary of......£11000, minimul pension, no bonus and enforced overtime when the operation required it.

This isnt a one off, Amazon, M&S, Sports direct etc have all got cheaper work forces on more flexible (for the employer) contracts. The amount of agency workers on pretty appalling contacts has increased by 10 fold since 2005. All the EU has done is allow the UK, Germany, France, Holland etc to exploit a young mainly eastern european work force and strip those countries of their best and brightest so we can get our Amazon order on the cheap. So again please dont tell me that the EU is good for workers rights because it really isnt.

Here is an idea: go and sign on to the agency currenty providing workers to the Sports direct DC in Shirebrook. You will find you are probably the only navite British worker, the picking targets are next to unacheivable and your paid enough to room share with another agency worker on the same contract. This would have been totally unthinkable in the late 90's early 00's whatever graphs you want to put up.