All Black EOYT North named .....

[Juggernaut]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (jawmalawm24 @ Oct 20 2009, 12:46 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

Hosea Gear is a awesome finisher but that's about it. He's rarely seen around the field and isn't busy enough to warrant selection. I'm a fan of his no doubt but even when I went to the stadium to watch the Lions play Otago earlier this season I didn't realise he was playing until the 2nd half when he came onto our side.

Zac's gonna be awesome hopefully he can sniff out the tryline and finish off some good backline plays. He's busy around the park and doesn't just sit there like some Wingers do. Hope he gets a start or at least comes off the bench for the first game at Tokyo against the Wallabies.[/b]

Smack bang on the head there.

I think the major reason for picking Zac ahead of Gear was his workrate, i.e going in looking for the ball, helping out in the rucks and is always present when he's needed to finish off.

Honestly, the dropping of Rokocoko is no surprise. His form earlier in the season and during the tri-nations was way below average. I just hope this gives him the bloody wake-up call he needed to get back in shape and recover lost form.
Now, he's got no excuse of burnout as he has a hell of a lot of time to prepare for next seasons' S14.

 

[wjd23104]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Nickdnz @ Oct 18 2009, 02:35 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

...The fact that there is no Hosea Gear or Joe Rokocoko ****** me off. Oh I know, let's put in Ben Smith, a player who while versatile and reliable, hardly adds anything new to the side at all. Instead of Hosea Gear, who has scored more tries on average over the ast two seasons then Zac Guilford. Zac, while young, wasn't even considered for the Hurricanes starting position over David Smith and Hosea Gear.

Joe Rokocoko seemingly looks like he is refinding his form, so Henry and co thinks, let's leave him out...

Mike Delany's inclusion in some ways is fair, however as pointed out before, we all ready have 2 First Five specialists in Carter and Donald, as well as McAlister if need be, so why does he need to be included. Meh, Grahm Henry is really beginning to get my vote of no confidence.[/b]

Really? Did Zac Guilford only start games that Gear was injured? I thought he Started five or Six games in this years Super 14 (admittedly i think he started ahead of David Smith who has really gone down hill this year). Joe had one good game for the Allblacks this year and the coaches deciding that wasn't enough seems fair to me. Delany has been selected because Mccalister doesn't look or feel confident at 10 and the Coaches clearly have doubts about Donald. I think they are hoping Delany puts his had up at international level and claims Donalds role as Carters Deputy. They probably feel theres depth at hooker and not at ten. Ben Smith is a young up and comer and at Npc level has shown pace and composure under the high ball.

Frankly i'm disappointed Gear didn't make it. Even though its only because i wanted people to see that at international level he'd be average.

 

[Nickdnz]

Gears work rate during the Pacific Six Nations was extraudinary, he set up as many tries as he scored, no joke. And to be fair, it really is a wingers job to finish tries, not create them, but Gear did both.

 

[darwin_23]

A couple of points:

Props: As expected

Hookers: I'm not surprised that de Malmanche was not selected - the All Blacks selectors have been very unwilling to give him any game time this year (even when Hore was having a nightmare at lineout time). de Malmanche's throwing even at provincial level is shocking (he literally has 2-3 throws a game blown up for not being straight). He really needs game time to work on his throwing, and really shot himself in the foot by choosing to take the two weeks off after the end of the All Blacks season (which was optional for all All Blacks) rather than play for Waikato. By all reports the non-selection of Hika Elliot has more to do with his off field attitude than his lack of on field performance (as he largely outplayed Corey Flynn in their matchup last week).

Locks: Once they announced that Ross was being left at home to bulk up the 4 locks selected were predictable. With the likes of Ali Williams, Chris Jack, Bryn Evans, and bulked up Isaac Ross all back next year there is pressure on the locks selected to prove they are up to it.

Loosies: Largely predictable - only contentious issue was who would back up Richie, with Latimer just edging out the likes of George Whitelock and Karl Lowe. I have a feeling if Scott Waldrom is ever not injured he will be preferred back-up 7 unless Latimer really takes his chances this tour.

Halfbacks:With Weepu ruled out with injury (strange as he has been named to start for Wellington this week!) Andy Ellis was the obvious 3rd choice halfback.

First-Five: Surprised they took three given that MacAlister can adequately cover there if needed. Happy they have given Delany a chance, he has looked very classy this year. Unlike other posters I feel that if they were going to take a young first-five (Cruden, Robinson, Slade, Brett) it should have been at the expense of Donald rather than Delany, as Donald has been tried and found wanted at test level numerous times.

Mid-field: Predictable

Outsides backs: Selection of Ben Smith a surprise, however he has been outstanding in recent games for Otago and has the skills the AB selectors are after (Good under the high ball, exceptional counter attacking skills). He had a very solid season for the Highlanders (was second in the voting for back of the year) and had the third most line-breaks among all wings in the competition - he is much more that just a safe winger that many posters here seem to think (though I suspect they may not have actually watched him play). He has more than a little of Jeff Wilson about him. The Guilford selection was largely predictable as he has been exceptional for Hawkes Bay - very much a Doug Howlett type wing all ways in position to take that last pass to score.

 

[stormer2010]

Gear and Masaga are lethal in S14, especially against teams like the Cheetahs, Lions etc. But I think you should be glad Guildford and especially Jane made the cut ahead of them as there is much, much more to being a sucessful wing at international level than being able to receive a ball out wide and beat one or two defenders. NZ aren't short of wings that impress at S14 level but test rugby is a step up and I would look at those wingers' performances against quality opposition where I found someone like Gear and Masaga with undoubted finishing ability go quiet at times if simply because they should have gone looking for work rather than waiting for ball in space.

The squad looks pretty solid, though and I think Henry got selections right towards the end considering the injury situation but I think NZ lacks class at lock and the back row (McCaw aside). Read, Thorn, Ross, Soio'alo, Thompson etc are good players but not as intimidating as All Blacks a few years back. Petty about Lauaki. He falls into the same category of player as Gear IMO; goes missing in big games.

That said Chris Jack returning to NZ is an immediate boost; he featured as the best lock in the Currie cup week in and out while playing for the Stormers. Look for him to help raise the level of play of Isaac Ross as he did for Anton van Zyl at the Stormers camp. I predict those two, with Jack taking the lead and helping develop Ross, will be great for NZ next year.

Just my two cents.

 

[wayner]

I don't know how you locals feel but I would love to see Thomas the Tank Engine picked for the ABs. I love to see #8s with the body type of a prop and I love how he runs over people.

Why is better for Isaac Ross to stay home and bulk up rather than get more experience in test matches? Sure there are several other options but guys like Ali Williams and Chris Jack are not spring chickens and they may not be physically able to compete in RWC 2011.

 

[jawmalawm24]

I agree 110% with you stormer2010 Gear and Masaga are awesome at Super14 but are left founding when it comes to international thou they haven't really got a huge amount of chances at that level there are others like Zac Guildford and plenty more that I think will take the chance when given to them.

I watched a few Western Province games during the Currie Cup and yeah Chris Jack is still a awesome lock and it'll be a humungeous boost to Rugby of New Zealand when he comes back.

@wayner I feel Thomas Waldrom should be given a chane too I actually picked him as my bolter for the black jersey but it'll probably never eventuate unfortunately. He's been a awesome player for the Wellington Lions and Hurricanes and he is very consistant and is unstoppable with ball in hand. I put him in the same category as Marty Holah was always behind a player like Richie McCaw and hardly never got a chance. It's the same thing with Thomas Waldrom he's always been behind Rodney So'oialo and will always find it hard to get in because of it.

 

[Nickdnz]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (wayner @ Oct 26 2009, 09:15 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

I don't know how you locals feel but I would love to see Thomas the Tank Engine picked for the ABs. I love to see #8s with the body type of a prop and I love how he runs over people.

Why is better for Isaac Ross to stay home and bulk up rather than get more experience in test matches? Sure there are several other options but guys like Ali Williams and Chris Jack are not spring chickens and they may not be physically able to compete in RWC 2011.[/b]

...Exactly, Ross's exclusion in order to bulk up, was so the he can be ready to compete at top international level against stronger locks. You sort of anwsered your own question there. While Ross was very impressive this year, both his lineout work and his physicality at the breakdown are important reasons why he needed to have time to bulk up.

 

[danger]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (jawmalawm24 @ Oct 26 2009, 02:30 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

I agree 110% with you stormer2010 Gear and Masaga are awesome at Super14 but are left founding when it comes to international thou they haven't really got a huge amount of chances at that level there are others like Zac Guildford and plenty more that I think will take the chance when given to them.

I watched a few Western Province games during the Currie Cup and yeah Chris Jack is still a awesome lock and it'll be a humungeous boost to Rugby of New Zealand when he comes back.

@wayner I feel Thomas Waldrom should be given a chane too I actually picked him as my bolter for the black jersey but it'll probably never eventuate unfortunately. He's been a awesome player for the Wellington Lions and Hurricanes and he is very consistant and is unstoppable with ball in hand. I put him in the same category as Marty Holah was always behind a player like Richie McCaw and hardly never got a chance. It's the same thing with Thomas Waldrom he's always been behind Rodney So'oialo and will always find it hard to get in because of it.[/b]

It is quite harsh to say Gear has been "left founding" at international level.. May as well say that Guildford, Cruden and Robinson have all been shown up at international level aswell.. seen as they have all had the same amount of test experience to judge them on give or take a few minutes..

Gear is not a flat track bully, his best performances havnt been against the cheetahs and that lot, he can show up any defender. He ticks all the boxes for a winger, its only now the coaches have decided that they dont want wingers anymore, just extra full backs.

He got dropped because he didnt have the skills of a fullback, i think thats bullshit.

I remember in 2003 Anton Oliver was dropped because the trend of the day was to have hookers that were great ball runners, more like an extra loose forward. it backfired and Anton was rushed back into the team after that. This situation looks quite similar.

 

[Ripper]

Bit of a difference though for living out a veteran proven (At test level) hooker for a Crusaders back up with a broken arm (Flynn) in 2003 and leaving out Hosea Gear for Zac Guildford.

 

[Nickdnz]

Ahh, but he is right that Hosea hasn't been found watning at test level, he hasn't had enough time on the field to be judged. Hosea has actully been pretty consistant to who he beats on the field to prove himself, and the same can be said for Masaga. You can argue they had the chance, they should have looked for work, however if the ball had be spread wide, and they needed a winger to finish off the try, who would look pretty stupid? The fact that Henry has been trying to promote running rugby, and then picks players with a totally different skill set seems a little bit unfair, and it hardly promotes his cause.

 

[bates]

The squad doesn't look that bad, I reckon that if the boys are motivated they can achieve some nice things.

 

[danger]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Ripper @ Oct 26 2009, 09:54 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

Bit of a difference though for living out a veteran proven (At test level) hooker for a Crusaders back up with a broken arm (Flynn) in 2003 and leaving out Hosea Gear for Zac Guildford.[/b]

Theres the obvious difference in age, but there is a similarity in the reason they were dropped.

Anton was a top notch hooker, but was dropped because he didnt have the skills of a loose forward.

Hosea is a top notch winger, but has been dropped because he doesnt have the skills of a fullback.

I think both decisions were ridiculous.

My problem isn't really with Guildford over Gear either, i rate Guildford even if it might be a tad early. My problem is with Ben Smith over Gear.

There is already Mills and Jane who are specialist fullbacks, plus Ellison who plays his best football from the back, then Sivi and Delaney who have played at 15 and could cover the position incase of injury.

Thats more then enough guys to cover one spot, Ben Smith is obviously in the squad primarily as a winger and has been rated ahead of Gear because of his fullback skills. I dont like that at all.

 

[Nickdnz]

On the bright side, Henry has stated that he still has alotof time for both Rokocoko and Gear, both of which could still be in the WC squad for 2011, and both are young enough to still be good (from memory both are 26) which I realise they will be quite old for wingers, but I believe they can still be very good, especially with a aspect of strength being prefered with many of Henry's wingers. That being said, I can't see either Rokocoko or Gear being included in the AB's, untill the game changes, and untill then we will see more boring, safe and predictable style of winger continue.

On another note, yes I do believe Thomas Waldrum should be in the AB's, it is terrible he wasn't even in the JR AB's and I would also like to see Scott Waldrum be McCaw's backup from now on as well.

 

[ChiefsFan]

Gear did nothing in his couple of games for the All Blacks. At least Masaga looked dangerous.

 

[Nickdnz]

He has spent about 25 minutes on the field...not to mention in his game against Australia he got the ball twice, and it was bad ball, what did you expect him to do?

 

[ChiefsFan]

The same thing he does at NPC level.

 

[danger]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ChiefsFan @ Oct 27 2009, 04:10 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

Gear did nothing in his couple of games for the All Blacks. At least Masaga looked dangerous.[/b]

You don't know what you're talking about mate

 

[danger]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ChiefsFan @ Oct 27 2009, 06:08 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

The same thing he does at NPC level.[/b]

Easy to say isn't it. He an outstanding rugby player, not jesus.

You expect so much from two poor opportunities, how old are you?

 

[jawmalawm24]

Both Masaga and Gear are very exciting players. I'm sure Henry will give them another chance soon and I'm sure they'll make the most of it. Out of the 2 I like watching Masaga because he's really exciting to watch and because he plays for Counties in the Npc he's being fed scraps and still manages to makes something out of nothing. Hosea Gear needs a bit of space before he can really work his magic but he has players around him that help get the ball in good situations for him whereas Masaga has to do most of it himself.