Americas Pacific Asia Championship (APAC) aka TRC 2nd Division?

[Bruce_ma gooshvili]

World Rugby CEO indicates a new international tournament on the horizon:

"Gilpin says the Americas Rugby Championship, in which the US beat Chile between 2016 and 2019, is not due to return but plans are "quite advanced" for an "Asia Pacific Americas competition that will see USA, Canada, Chile, Uruguay, Argentina etc playing regularly". Lower-tier nations are also due to get more meaningful games as part of the long-gestating reorganisation of the Test year."

Alan Gilpin: ‘The US plan will benefit from the Eagles being in France’

World Rugby CEO doesn’t think ‘the game needs the US in France next year’ but knows Chile’s win on Saturday underlined the need for serious work before the World Cup comes to America

www.theguardian.com

I assume this will be Americas plus PIs plus possibly Japan? That would be great.

There have been noises of this from Sudamerica but now we have something from the horses mouth I think it is worth its own thread.

 

[die_mole]

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According to Uruguayan news outlet El Observador, the proposed competition will see the top four tier-two sides in the Americas – USA, Canada, Chile and Uruguay – take on the likes of Fiji, Samoa, Japan and Tonga during the mid-year test window at the same time the Rugby Championship takes place.*

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Report: New international competition set to pit Asia-Pacific against Americas

A new international rugby competition lined up for 2024 could see the best tier-two teams from Asia-Pacific take on their counterparts from the Americas.

www.rugbypass.com

 

[Bruce_ma gooshvili]

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According to Uruguayan news outlet El Observador, the proposed competition will see the top four tier-two sides in the Americas – USA, Canada, Chile and Uruguay – take on the likes of Fiji, Samoa, Japan and Tonga during the mid-year test window at the same time the Rugby Championship takes place.*

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Report: New international competition set to pit Asia-Pacific against Americas

A new international rugby competition lined up for 2024 could see the best tier-two teams from Asia-Pacific take on their counterparts from the Americas.

www.rugbypass.com

I think this is far better for Japan than their existing predicament of being excluded. I also think it is a good format and gives good fixtures for Sudamerica in the knockouts. It should also be marketable and it'll be interesting if we see decent revenue for Japan.

As the article suggests it seems no Rugby Championship for Japan any time soon (boo!) and it's a little sad there is no Argentina XV. But overall, if I was drawing up a format this would be it.

Fit this in with SLAR, MLR, the two Super Rugby side and the JRLO and the pieces are in place for a further step up for countries around the Pacific rim in my opinion. Assuming this is all full test matches.

If qualification is based on top 4 ranked in Americas (and hopefully the same criteria in Asia-Pacific) then you have meaningful steps for the likes of Brazil and Korea to aspire to with their own moves into professionalism.

 

[Bruce_ma gooshvili]

In the El Salvador article (which I'd overlooked) the suggestion is the plan is for this to be a second division for the Rugby Championship (with promotion and relegation), which would be fantastic but seems unlikely unless Argentina get outmanouvered politically. That would be a thing of beauty if it came to pass. A genuine pathway for places like Brazil and Korea to ultimately have an opportunity to be involved in an annual competition with world champions (admittedly hypothetical).

 

[die_mole]

for now it looks like Brazil is on the outside of this tournament but they do have the South American tri nations coming up with Colombia and Paraguay. Hopefully that continues and more countries will have ambitions of joining. It's just so tough to organize tournaments with amateur players.

The Uruguayan article talks a bit about lacking of competition for the second half of the season. Not going to the U23 tournament in PIs but will play in the America U23 tournament. Hopefully SLAR expansion can increase the player pool in the better SA countries.

I think having consistent schedules for tier 2 and tier 3 teams would go a huge way to improving the level of play.

 

[Bruce_ma gooshvili]

Yes, Brazil are on the outside but it is based on merit/ranking. Not self interest of other parties. Plus Brazil will effectively be playing their higher ranked neighbours via SLAR so their level shouldn't suffer. Sudamerica playing hardball over Canada may ironically create a higher level competion for Canada and the US to be involved in. I honestly think everyone is a winner with this proposal and it should help all participants close the gap on Tier1s.

The Rugby Championship 2nd division seems entirely specualtive at this stage. If it came to pass this would possibly be the single greatest development in global rugby history but I can't see it happening until Japan, US or Canada start emphatically spanking the PIs in this tournament and routinely picking up lower ranked Tier1 scalps in the friendly Test windows (or the game exploded with the public and TV rights in one of those countries).

About once a decade I get this enthusiastic about rugby. With it not due to start until August 2024 I'm conscious that is a lot of time for something to go horribly wrong and destroy my dreams.

 

[Bruce_ma gooshvili]

Beaumont confirms this will be happening in 2024 but literally says "lets forget about promotion or relegation for now". He applies zero pressure on any union to embrace new territories into their competitions even though there are reasonable economic (and overwhelming sporting) arguments to do so.

Beaumont, presidente de World Rugby, sobre la nueva competencia para Uruguay, Chile y el resto del Tier 2: “Si nos quedamos donde estamos el juego va a morir”

El presidente de World Rugby habló con El Observador sobre los planes para crear una competencia de selecciones para 2024, y para ampliar la Slar con equipos de EEUU y Canadá: “Si nos quedamos donde estamos el juego va a morir”

www.elobservador.com.uy

 

[Bruce_ma gooshvili]

Apparently the US coach has said this tournament is to be voted on in September. If even this baby step cannot be approved then I think any remainging trace of optimism will die inside me.

 

[Booboobang]

Argentina makes me sad, progressing, and super rugby was just kicking in for them, then all ripped away and excluded without any real domestic rugby to back up since they put all their eggs in SR.

I fail to see how this helps long term though, all you end up with is 6 nations and sanza still being on a pedestal above all others ring fenced for quality, but slight improvement on the tier down over time. Good for fans they get to see their team compete for something, but its still ring fenced.

If rugby wanted actual progressive change rather than keeping the game small and for the elite nations they wouldnt have reelected beumont, or soon to elect his deputy scot.

Cant help but feel the next world cup is going to be a state, USA rugby has been neglected by WR, game hasnt grown at nearly the rate it needs to to support a world cup and union is a financial mess, this is late in the day to avoid that. They were to focused on how to avoid losing power to gus pichot than growing the game.

 

[Bruce_ma gooshvili]

The lukewarm mood music from World Rugby to this seems to be getting cooler. Of the points listed in the article the uncertainty over whether Japan and Fiji will join TRC around the same time as the World League appears to be the biggest issue.

Después del Mundial: las dos competencias que están arriba de la mesa para Los Teros en 2024

Después del Mundial: las dos competencias que están arriba de la mesa para Los Teros en 2024

www.elobservador.com.uy

 

[Booboobang]

Never expected world rugby to follow through. Real shame, rugby is in such a strong position in SA and needs the chance to grow.

 

[Bruce_ma gooshvili]

Uruguay and Chile confirming they are no longer interested in this tournament as Japan and Fiji will be in the World League. But it seems it may still happen for NA, PI and Japan for 2024 & 2025 before the World League starts in 2026.

Explosiva entrevista a Sebastián Piñeyrúa: “bastantes chances” de un Mundial de Rugby 24 equipos en 2027 y la posibilidad de que Pichot sea candidato

Sebastián Piñeyrúa, presidente de Sudamérica Rugby: “Bastantes chances” de un Mundial de Rugby 24 equipos en 2027 y la posibilidad de que Pichot sea candidato a las elecciones. Por @ignaciochans desde Francia

www.elobservador.com.uy

The World League is June and Nov windows. This position only makes sense if there is confirmation of Japan and Fiji joining the Rugby Championship (and therefore being unable to play in APAC which presumably would not be played in these windows). EDIT: At least Fiji and Japan in TRC would be a silver lining.

Otherwise it is Uruguay and Chile embracing a decade of playing only low ranked teams that will do nothing to raise their level and possibly some meaningless non-tests against some 'A' teams. Terrible news for the Americas.

Just watch the stunted development of this crop of Uruguayan u20s compared to the Scottish u20s they have just beaten.

 

[Bruce_ma gooshvili]

https://www.world.rugby/news/885602/world-rugby-confirms-new-international-mens-competition-to-launch-in-2024

Confirmed South America have opted out of this. I think that is a mistake given the PIs and Japan should field strong sides with it being played in their release window. I also think they are frankly off their rockers to isolate themselves from North American and Japanese markets.

With 2 groups of 3 it is inefficient as 2 sides will not play each weekend. A bit of a missed opportunity but potentially very beneficial for the US and Canada.

 

[Bruce_ma gooshvili]

Also worth clarifying there is zero mention of this revised PNC being a feeder competition into TRC.

 

[Brigantine]

South America to Japan is 18,300 km, and takes a minimum of 28.5 hours of travel
For comparison, Fiji to Georgia is "only" 14,800 km.

What is it with trying to squeeze the entirety of non-Europe into a single competition?

 

[Lucas R]

The thing that needs to come back is the americas rugby championship, people actually care a whatched it a bit (at least in Argentina and Uruguay), It was on tv, and on 2020 there was gonna be a second division (with promotion and relegation). Teams like Brazil were showing progress, and it was were Uruguay really started showing something. Slar was going to be the "clubs" side at the beguining of the year, even linking all countries together with the final agaisnt the MLR winner, and the ARC the countries side at the end of the year.

Its a real shame it never came back