Argentina invited to the 3 nations

[candybum]

they should play in the 6 nations, i think... unless they get a team in the s14 or something, most of their players play up north so the 6 nations should be a better option. By all means i thinks its a great idea! either all,

 

[Steve-o]

<div class='quotemain'>
but we wont play in Argentina
[/b]

That would be a temporary thing I would imagine, once Argentina realise the money making potential it is concievable that they would play thier home games in Argentina...although South Africa is a fairly nice place anyway, mad about thier rugby there so would be a cash cow for your Argentinian Rugby Union.
[/b][/quote]
There are definitely positives to this. I just wish for the public of Argentina to have home games. These are very important to create a sense of wholeness with the team. I'm sure if you've watched a team you support strongly live you'll get what i'm saying. But at least talks have began to invest in thier rugby

 

[Prestwick]

I don't agree with Argentina joining the Six Nations, for a start, there just isn't room for an expanded Six Nations in the seasons. This has been cemented thanks to the new deal signed between the English Clubs and the RFU which has no provision for extra internationals in an expanded Six Nations.

Also, on a humanitarian point of view, rugby in Argentina has to profesionalise. They are already committed to this but to help they need to have big games and big competitions on their doorstep to help develop the game in Argentina. Simply sucking more players out of Argentina to Europe won't help either them or us.

 

[An Tarbh]

Here's the link - http://www.ole.clarin.com/notas/2007/11/28/um/01551955.html

Billy don't tar us all with the same brush

 

[dullonien]

Agree there Pres, Argentina need to develop rugby in Argentina, not have all their players playing in France/England and playing their home games in Spain. I think they'd struggle to attract supporters from Argentina and it won't help them as much in the long term.

Playing in the 3 nations (4 nations) makes more sense. They can base themselves from SA for the time being. Then when the times right, move to where they should be playing from, Argentina!

I know this would cause problems with freeing players from clubs etc. all the more reason to create an international calendar though!

 

[Steve-o]

Agree there Pres, Argentina need to develop rugby in Argentina, not have all their players playing in France/England and playing their home games in Spain. I think they'd struggle to attract supporters from Argentina and it won't help them as much in the long term.

Playing in the 3 nations (4 nations) makes more sense. They can base themselves from SA for the time being. Then when the times right, move to where they should be playing from, Argentina!

I know this would cause problems with freeing players from clubs etc. all the more reason to create an international calendar though!
[/b]

Lets deal with the reality of the situation. So far an international calender is a TRF pipe dream. Most these guys play in europe, and thier national team is at the level it is due to that fact. If they joined the 3N they're gonna burn out from rugby all year round. European rugby needs to take responsibility here

 

[Prestwick]

Yes but seve, you've just contradicted yourself. You talk about facing reality and then go on to name a distinct fantasy by saying that there is somehow room for an extended six nations.

by joining the tri nations they will undergo short term pain but as their system adjusts to playing in the south rather than being at the beck and call of the north they will get better.

this argument is irrelevant anyway, it would have to take at least 2 and a half years me protracted and bitter arguments between the unions, the irb and the clubs before this would be even agreed. That is why they will be joining the tri nations.

 

[Steve-o]

Yes but seve, you've just contradicted yourself. You talk about facing reality and then go on to name a distinct fantasy by saying that there is somehow room for an extended six nations.
this argument is irrelevant anyway, it would have to take at least 2 and a half years me protracted and bitter arguments between the unions, the irb and the clubs before this would be even agreed. That is why they will be joining the tri nations.
[/b]

It always seems like the european clubs bully the national teams up there. And i believe that it won't change when/if Argentina join the 3N. We'll probably face a depleted Puma's side most of the time.
BTW Prestwick pull your head out of where ever your sticking it and quit with these fetish eastern european names. Have some respect. Doos.

 

[DonBilly]

<div class='quotemain'>
Yes but seve, you've just contradicted yourself. You talk about facing reality and then go on to name a distinct fantasy by saying that there is somehow room for an extended six nations.
this argument is irrelevant anyway, it would have to take at least 2 and a half years me protracted and bitter arguments between the unions, the irb and the clubs before this would be even agreed. That is why they will be joining the tri nations.
[/b]

It always seems like the european clubs bully the national teams up there. And i believe that it won't change when/if Argentina join the 3N. We'll probably face a depleted Puma's side most of the time.
BTW Prestwick pull your head out of where ever your sticking it and quit with these fetish eastern european names. Have some respect. Doos. [/b][/quote]



That's why the real issue is not actually addressed with this invitation. What needs to be addressed is the creation of professional clubs/provinces in Argentina. From this platform the argies could be involved in the SH competitions.

 

[Steve-o]

Yeah, i agree with you DonBilly. That's why I think joining the 3N would be "jumping the shark" at the moment. Cause at this moment the Puma's player platform is europe. Does anybody know what is currently the situation of domestic rugby there? Any significant tournaments?

 

[Prestwick]

It always seems like the european clubs bully the national teams up there. And i believe that it won't change when/if Argentina join the 3N. We'll probably face a depleted Puma's side most of the time.
BTW Prestwick pull your head out of where ever your sticking it and quit with these fetish eastern european names. Have some respect. Doos. [/b]

And going through yet another two or three years of butthurt between club and union is worth it just to see Argentina for a couple of years only for them to move down south again?



Having Argentina in the tri nations won't solve everything overnight but it is a start as regular home internationals in their own time zone would ignite interest in the sport on a whole new level. Remember that Argentina still managed to put together strong sides against Ireland in the Summer internationals last year and consistently for the summer internationals of the last few years and the level of support there already is phenominal.



Effectively, by doing this, you are creating a firm platform precisely for a professional league structure.



Waiting an extra few years for Argentina to spend a few years in an expanded Six Nations will only compound the problem of no exposure in Argentina itself and all its best players being cherry picked by the Northern Hemisphere.



In the end its a case of chicken and the egg. In this case, the chicken must arrive before the egg can be laid!



Finally, for your information:

1. I am current sticking my head into a Poweredge 860 and
2. Seve is actually a Spanish name which is distinctly Western European.

:bana:

 

[dullonien]

Are you so sure that an international calendar is 'just a TRF pipe dream'. The IRB are meeting this week to discuss creating that exact same thing. Fine it may take a while for it to be implemented, don't expect it any sooner than 3-5 years, but it's in the works supposedly.

Now the inclusion of Argentina in the 3/4 Nations may just mean the IRB have to take this idea more seriously than they currently are, stop talking and start acting.

The future (long term) for Argentina is in an expanded 3 nations, I have no doubt about that. It's just unhealthy for a national team to play home games in another country (long term) imo, hence why an expanded 6 nations is a no starter.

Argentina need to get into a majour competition (4 nations) asap, they are in the limelight at the moment, already proving that they deserve it during the world cup. Leave it a few years while they build their domestic leagues in Argentina and I'm worried the chance will have been lost.

Something needs to be figured out, there must be a way this can work. Argentinian and waorld rugby needs it.

 

[Incredible Schalk]

i ll prefer to play in 6nations

Argentina will play in Ciudad de Cabo south africa
[/b]

Because they would win it?

 

[O'Rothlain]

I hope with this comes some sort of scheme to add at least 1 Super 14 franchise team out of Arg. But, I'm probably looking to far off in the future, so don't post that as a response...I'm just mumbling out loud.

 

[el_tk]

Long term Argentina have to play in the 3N. But the UAR have to sort themselves out and get a professional structure in place. They already have the clubs and they need to ride the wave of positive publicity from the RWC.
It's simply not feasible for them to have their top players playing a full NH season and then spending the summer playing 3N

 

[Cirdo]

This blog (http://www.periodismo-rugby.com.ar/) is reporting that Argentina has received a proposal to participate in next year's Currie Cup (presumably with the Argentina A team). It also says that in the future two teams from Argentina will be invited.

Again, this has not been confirmed. But that's not just some fan's blog, it's a blog by a long-time journalist from Argentina who's been involved with rugby for many years.

 

[Steve-o]

Oh ye of little faith. Dullonien i'm not sure that grabbing the bull by the horns "while they can" is the right mentality. Argentina have produced quality players for YEARS and I have no doubt they will again. Argentina IMO have a quality starting XV but thier squad lacks depth. They need to sort out thier domestic rugby before they try and conquer the SH.

Can i have a link as evidence for this meeting about a world calender? Sounds like an interesting read.

Also I just wanna say that I'm in anyway angry about a 4N tournament, change is good. But my major concern is the players. Thier endurance is gonna be tested to the MAX.

 

[dullonien]

They mentioned the IRB meeting on Scrum V last week.

Here's a link to an article on the IRB website. Unfortunately they came to the conclusion that the current calendar is the best way foreward. Idiots!

 

[stormmaster1]

IMO the 6N for Argentina couldn't work for the home nations, so it won't happen whether Argentina could play in spain or not.





For regular international games the 3N is a better choice. The problem is the players playing a NH domestic season and SH internationals.



Long term the best solution is either a global season, or to play domestic rugby in the SH. S14 sides probably won't want too many foreigners in the sides as they primarily exist to provide for the national team, so Argentina needs it's own proffesional side. Setting up a proffesional side in Argentina won't be easy however, as the Argies are proud of their amateur status.



I suspect the way forward wil be plughing into the 3N with tired players, trying to make the best of it, suffering in the short term whilst trying to iron out how to work it in the Long run.

 

[Steve-o]

They mentioned the IRB meeting on Scrum V last week.

Here's a link to an article on the IRB website. Unfortunately they came to the conclusion that the current calendar is the best way foreward. Idiots!
[/b]

Thanks for the link mate, it was very interesting. They made some good points, and i'm happy to see they gonna steadily intregrate Argentina into regular international rugby. As long as there is summer and winter, there won't be an international calender IMO.