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danny
Guest
It looks as though Cipriani will be 3rd choice behind Wilko and Hodgeson. That looks like a backward step to me.
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dundeesmiffy
Guest
IMHO 'Johnny' is one of the worst things to happen to rugby in a long time.
Sure, at the start of his career he was good, good hard hits and exciting rugby. Then the era of kicking for goal every time you get the chance came and ruined the game. I'm happy the new rules will limit this and I hope they are implimented by the time the next RWC rolls around so we can see how high over the shark Johnny has jumped.
Cipriani might make some defensive faux pas and his control of the game maybe isn't the best, but I'm sure that will come with experience. Let's not throw the lad into the deep end and ruin his career just yet, eh?
To sum up therefor, Hodgson is Englands best bet at 10 the way I see it. The Sale games I've caught, he's been clinical, good with the boot and put his outside backs into space. I firmly recommend that he should be starting in the 10 shirt or move into the 10 shirt later on in the game at any given point.
What's likely to happen is, Wilko will re-injure himself, take no part in any 6 nations except for the one before the RWC and then recieve all the glory he can before he ducks out and befalls scrutiny for being the star of the boring age of rugby.
Basically, MORE TRIES PLZ!
Sure, at the start of his career he was good, good hard hits and exciting rugby. Then the era of kicking for goal every time you get the chance came and ruined the game. I'm happy the new rules will limit this and I hope they are implimented by the time the next RWC rolls around so we can see how high over the shark Johnny has jumped.
Cipriani might make some defensive faux pas and his control of the game maybe isn't the best, but I'm sure that will come with experience. Let's not throw the lad into the deep end and ruin his career just yet, eh?
To sum up therefor, Hodgson is Englands best bet at 10 the way I see it. The Sale games I've caught, he's been clinical, good with the boot and put his outside backs into space. I firmly recommend that he should be starting in the 10 shirt or move into the 10 shirt later on in the game at any given point.
What's likely to happen is, Wilko will re-injure himself, take no part in any 6 nations except for the one before the RWC and then recieve all the glory he can before he ducks out and befalls scrutiny for being the star of the boring age of rugby.
Basically, MORE TRIES PLZ!
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SaintsFan_Webby
Guest
If you really think Wilkinson at his peak was simply a boot, you really can't have watched him properly. More organised defences have made it harder to score tries, not one player who happens to be able to kick straight enough to punish any opposition infringements.
And Hodgson can't play at international level. We've tried that several times - it just doesn't work.
And Hodgson can't play at international level. We've tried that several times - it just doesn't work.
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Incredible Schalk
Guest
What happened to Glen Jackson being Englands answer at 10?
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I thought he was a Kiwi?
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dundeesmiffy
Guest
FAO: SaintsFan Webby
ahem
in my little corner of Scotland, it would be proper to tell you to 'shut your pus' (puh-ss) at this present moment.
and Schalk, i think he qualifies through residency, but I'm pretty sure you're right, he is Kiwi born.
If you really think Wilkinson at his peak was simply a boot, you really can't have watched him properly.[/b]
ahem
Sure, at the start of his career he was good, good hard hits and exciting rugby.[/b]
in my little corner of Scotland, it would be proper to tell you to 'shut your pus' (puh-ss) at this present moment.
and Schalk, i think he qualifies through residency, but I'm pretty sure you're right, he is Kiwi born.
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SaintsFan_Webby
Guest
You talk about this 'era of kicking for goal'. There's no such thing. The Wilkinson of 2002 would have been just as keen to take the points in an international match as the Wilkinson of 2008 will be. Capturing the form which made him the best number 10 in the world is unlikely now, but there is little difference from the style of play he used when at his peak.
So I'll keep whatever the hell my 'pus' is open.
So I'll keep whatever the hell my 'pus' is open.
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Prestwick
Guest
in my little corner of Scotland, it would be proper to tell you to 'shut your pus' (puh-ss) at this present moment.[/b]
Wait...people still live in Dundee? :mellow:
Ewwwww :wacko:
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dundeesmiffy
Guest
haha, yes we do....if you can call it living.
it's actually the worlds biggest village.
it's actually the worlds biggest village.
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spampy
Guest
What about playing Wilko at 12 and Cipriani at 10?
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I was thinking at the opposite, then wilko at 10 is the best.... Cipriani can do too effort still in that position, but like 12, he could be very dangerous for the opposite
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d04689
Guest
in truth i think cipriani is way over rated, he will be good but there are other young fly-halfs who are not far off him and i dont think he will ever be as good as wilko
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Bullitt
Guest
Wilkinson is an incompitant, dangerous (in a health and safety way, not because of talent), over-rated one-trick pony who's been living off his name for the last 5 years and is only playing for England because uncle Robert is running roughshot over Englands selections for the first team, Saxons and coaching staff.
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d04689
Guest
it must have just been a massive coincidence that england started to actually play some rugby when he returned to the side last year then?
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Bullitt
Guest
Did they ********. England stuffed it up the jumper and kicked it away at every opportunity.
During the world cup England only had a backline that moved when Barkley was at 10 (incredible considering how **** he is), until Wilkinson came in and kicked every bit of posession away. Combine this with his god awful tackling ability (i.e. awful technique and not looking after the wellbeing of other players), highly over-rated goal kicking and no distribution skills whatsoever, what we have is a relic from the old-boys network at the top of the RFU hierarchy systematic of the exact problems in English rugby today.
I suppose you also believe Tait is the "wonderkid" Rob Andrew makes him out to be? Or that Rob Andrew is actually a good coach?
During the world cup England only had a backline that moved when Barkley was at 10 (incredible considering how **** he is), until Wilkinson came in and kicked every bit of posession away. Combine this with his god awful tackling ability (i.e. awful technique and not looking after the wellbeing of other players), highly over-rated goal kicking and no distribution skills whatsoever, what we have is a relic from the old-boys network at the top of the RFU hierarchy systematic of the exact problems in English rugby today.
I suppose you also believe Tait is the "wonderkid" Rob Andrew makes him out to be? Or that Rob Andrew is actually a good coach?
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getofmeland
Guest
England need to drop Wilko for several reasons, the firstly is due to him having what I call the England Footballer Syndrome, for those who don't know what this is, it is when there heads expand to the point where all comments just bounce off their thick skulls, then the other part of this factor where they think they know what is best for the team, the final part of this syndrome is the PANIC stage when the **** hits the fan they panic or disappear...
Wilko still thinks he should be England Captain, although I think he only has been a couple of times?
But Wilko couldn't organise a **** up in a brewery!!!
Wilko still thinks he should be England Captain, although I think he only has been a couple of times?
But Wilko couldn't organise a **** up in a brewery!!!
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RC
Guest
Yikes, Johnny boy is getting raped in this topic!
Defensively, i think he's a solid boy, but one thing that has stuck in my mind as of late has to be his delivery to the centres/wingers etc. His distribution has certainly been shocking since his 'comeback' and to be honest i didn't really pay attention to him before that. He panics very easily and his main tactic of kicking the ball away isn't really doing England any good when all they are looking for is someone to keep a fluidity of play in the bacline and get some consistency going. When that ball changes hands, England are left to stutter without getting time to gain any parity in their attack.
Now i don't know much about England's up and coming fly halves, but i don't understand why Cipriani can't get a start. He has a creative flair, he loves to run the ball and it's not as if England's backs can't do the running. I mean, hell, he just may decide to start utilising Big Les, shouting at the big f***er, tell him to come looking for the ball and create some havoc in the midfield, because Johnny seems totally ignorant to the fact that England has a deadly weapon on the wing.
Who knows, with johnny out of the picture, England may actually get some consistency, then some encouraging wins (instead of negative ones like against Italy), then they'll gain confidence, then by god...they could be dangerous again.
Disclaimer: I am in no way claiming that Wilkinson is the main catalyst for all of England's current problems. But he is a major factor in the team and is not bringing many positives to the team any more.
Defensively, i think he's a solid boy, but one thing that has stuck in my mind as of late has to be his delivery to the centres/wingers etc. His distribution has certainly been shocking since his 'comeback' and to be honest i didn't really pay attention to him before that. He panics very easily and his main tactic of kicking the ball away isn't really doing England any good when all they are looking for is someone to keep a fluidity of play in the bacline and get some consistency going. When that ball changes hands, England are left to stutter without getting time to gain any parity in their attack.
Now i don't know much about England's up and coming fly halves, but i don't understand why Cipriani can't get a start. He has a creative flair, he loves to run the ball and it's not as if England's backs can't do the running. I mean, hell, he just may decide to start utilising Big Les, shouting at the big f***er, tell him to come looking for the ball and create some havoc in the midfield, because Johnny seems totally ignorant to the fact that England has a deadly weapon on the wing.
Who knows, with johnny out of the picture, England may actually get some consistency, then some encouraging wins (instead of negative ones like against Italy), then they'll gain confidence, then by god...they could be dangerous again.
Disclaimer: I am in no way claiming that Wilkinson is the main catalyst for all of England's current problems. But he is a major factor in the team and is not bringing many positives to the team any more.
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dullonien
Guest
Originally posted by Wilkinson
"Italy are a great side. But the guys all chipped in, they were brilliant to a man. We were fantastic."
I can't believe he came out with this comment regarding the Italy match. The second half performance might have been worse than their second half display against Wales! England won that match due to an excellent display on the opposition lineout, stealing crucial ball (or a poor Italian lineout, however you view it).
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nick_w
Guest
Originally posted by Wilkinson
"Italy are a great side. But the guys all chipped in, they were brilliant to a man. We were fantastic."
I can't believe he came out with this comment regarding the Italy match. The second half performance might have been worse than their second half display against Wales! England won that match due to an excellent display on the opposition lineout, stealing crucial ball (or a poor Italian lineout, however you view it).
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I've just seen this comment on BBC and had to look twice. Someone was talking earlier on about "English Footballer syndrome", surely this is the biggest example of this indicated in the last few days. If Wilko thinks the English played well on Sunday, then it just shows how much he looks outside of him.
He's playing a one dimensional game and simply will not listen to any criticism. I know that players tend not to concentrate on what the papers say and "focus on out own game" but to get a fair analysis of how he is playing, he needs to be listening to everyone, not just Uncle Rob and Brian.
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Bang
Guest
I really hate this idea that Wilkinson returned to the English rugby team and almost lead them to world cup glory. Wilkinson had a terrible world cup this service to the men outside him just put them under pressure, his general play kicking at no point trapped the other team down there end of the field. To top this all off his goal kicking was only about 60%.
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Wilkinson in the past used to take the game by the scruff of the neck and he along with the forwards would strangle the life out of the team they were playing with great general play kicking and pin point goal kicking. He even had the ability on occasion to ignite the men outside of him. That Wilkinson is no longer with us.
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Wilkinson in the past used to take the game by the scruff of the neck and he along with the forwards would strangle the life out of the team they were playing with great general play kicking and pin point goal kicking. He even had the ability on occasion to ignite the men outside of him. That Wilkinson is no longer with us.
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stormmaster1
Guest
Wilkinson needs senior players around to help him choose correct options, and provide those options. At the moment he is getting slow ball with no options. He panics and kicks badly. I think Wilko is good enough, but with the right players around him. Thing is Cipriani didn't look any better when he came on, so i think the real issues start with the pack generating good ball and breaking the gain line.
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evs
Guest
Wilkinson needs senior players around to help him choose correct options, and provide those options. At the moment he is getting slow ball with no options. He panics and kicks badly. I think Wilko is good enough, but with the right players around him. Thing is Cipriani didn't look any better when he came on, so i think the real issues start with the pack generating good ball and breaking the gain line.
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Wilkinson will never be the player he was, that said more experience around him would help and I agree that Cipriani is maybe a little too inexperienced right now. England should stick with him, it would do Cipriani no good to be thrust in at the moment.
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