England 2024/25

[Pieter Steph du Teague]

If Ford gets called into the Lions you'd be mad not to call him in just for this summer,
Blocking the development of Charlie Atkinson is hardly the end of the world when you've already got the two Smiths

I don't think Farrell would accept it though tbh

Especially on a tour where we need to develop centres. The likes of Dingwall, Ojomoh, Ma’asi-White, etc. would benefit far more from playing and training outside Faz than Atkinson or Donoghue.

 

[Ddanno]

I don't think Farrell would accept it though tbh

He absolutely would, his ego wouldn't be able to refuse.

Like you, I don't know who else there is though. Atkinson isn't good enough, Donoghue would be a ridiculous gamble and. Errr. Yeah.

 

[Pieter Steph du Teague]

He absolutely would, his ego wouldn't be able to refuse.

Sorry wtf?

 

[TRF_Olyy]

He absolutely would, his ego wouldn't be able to refuse.

What makes you say that?
He retired from England a season before moving to France, not like he removed himself from selection via moving to France

 

[Ddanno]

If Borthers picks up the phone he'll be on the coach pronto. Just a feeling rather than anything I can actually point to.

 

[BrokenWing]

According to Ruck (I know), Faz is going to be part of the Sky team covering The Lions.

 

[Rugbyfan564]

According to Ruck (I know), Faz is going to be part of the Sky team covering The Lions.

He is confirmed to be on the Argentina match.

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

If Ford gets called into the Lions you'd be mad not to call him in just for this summer,
Blocking the development of Charlie Atkinson is hardly the end of the world when you've already got the two Smiths

I don't think Farrell would accept it though tbh

Agreed, although I think he might if it was to help us out of a hole, but beyond that, as I said on another thread, I’m pretty sure he sees his England race as run.

 

[Geordie]

It depends... Borthwick might offer him a player coaching role for the tour.

And that would surely interest him, Saracens and England long term.

Being a top player doesn't guarantee a person would be a great coach, but you can't help thinking Owen could go on to be a very good coach.

 

[BPM]

I think Farrell probably will end up as a very good coach but as of right now, I don’t think there’s enough water under the bridge for him to come back in any capacity.

We’ve only just started moving on. The prospect of bringing him back in feels like a backwards step to me.

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

Got to have Pepper and Ilione involved

Ilione off the bench has been next level in every game he's played nearly

Would start Pepper at 7 if Curry out

 

[Geordie]

Got to have Pepper and Ilione involved

Ilione off the bench has been next level in every game he's played nearly

Would start Pepper at 7 if Curry out

Ive said many a time, of all the lads we've lost in recent years Pepper was the one that I was most gutted about. The lad will be another level.

But I've just posted on your Leicester thread, illone just impresses every game.

I hope they both tour. Leave Pearson etc at home.

 

[Pieter Steph du Teague]

Think my back row stable for Argentina would now look like:
6. Hill, Ilione
7. Curry, Underhill, Pepper
8. Willis, CCS
Kenningham very unlucky to miss out but don't see how Pepper and Ilione can be overlooked after the last few weeks, especially since they're both younger. Barbeary could also perhaps feel a little aggrieved but he really just doesn't seem like a test match player to me. Too one dimensional.

 

[Not Mike Brown's Sock]

Think my back row stable for Argentina would now look like:
6. Hill, Ilione
7. Curry, Underhill, Pepper
8. Willis, CCS
Kenningham very unlucky to miss out but don't see how Pepper and Ilione can be overlooked after the last few weeks, especially since they're both younger. Barbeary could also perhaps feel a little aggrieved but he really just doesn't seem like a test match player to me. Too one dimensional.

Kenningham 100% deserves to go. Ilione is super talented, but Kenningham has had a better season as a whole imo.

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

Personally with Curry fine to play and Underhill with that ban missing the first game I would leave Underhill at home and bring Kennignham
What's the point really in bringing him to play 1 test game v Argentina? (Really no point playing him against USA).

 

[Pieter Steph du Teague]

Kenningham 100% deserves to go. Ilione is super talented, but Kenningham has had a better season as a whole imo.

I’d go Ilione as he brings something different to the table with his freak strength. Kenningham is another fetcher style flanker who’d just be bringing more of what several other back rowers already bring. Ilione brings something different, which for me means he’d be far more likely to play a real role in the future if Borthwick decided we needed more of a brute at 6.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

It's a shame it's a short tour,
As it stands I'd only take one of Pepper/Ilione (probably Pepper as he's played a lot more, Ilione only has 3 non prem cup starts) but if we had Canada and/or Pumas thrown in the mix too I'd take both
Shame they both were in the final as one starting vs France and the other vs USA would be good

I, too, wouldn't take Underhill (unless BC is crocked)

Very interested to see who we put out vs France XV - do they treat it as an A game or as a chance to get some cohesion into combos we'll use vs Argentina?
First choice XV is going to be very changed up compared to the 6N

 

[BPM]

I'd go Ilione as he brings something different to the table with his freak strength. Kenningham is another fetcher style flanker who'd just be bringing more of what several other back rowers already bring. Ilione brings something different, which for me means he'd be far more likely to play a real role in the future if Borthwick decided we needed more of a brute at 6.

Not sure that’s entirely fair. He’s also an excellent lineout forward and a good carrier. His turnover stats have rightly got the plaudits but he has a lot more strings to his bow.

 

[Pieter Steph du Teague]

Not sure that's entirely fair. He's also an excellent lineout forward and a good carrier. His turnover stats have rightly got the plaudits but he has a lot more strings to his bow.

Okay sure, but the other fetcher flankers we have (Curry x2, Underhill, Pepper) are also good carriers, so in that regard he's still not really bringing anything different to what we already have.

Will concede the point about lineouts though, but I think most are agreed that that shouldn't really be a primary criteria for back row selection, especially for a guy who is realistically competing for the 7 shirt.

 

[Ddanno]

Kenningham has earned a shot. He might only last the tour, or even just end up tackle bagging because Lions, but he deserves to go.