Wanted Competitions

[Jayatron]

<style>@font-face { font-family: "Cambria"; }p.MsoNormal, li.MsoNormal, div.MsoNormal { margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: "Times New Roman"; }div.Section1 { page: Section1; }</style> On my latest travels across Europe I have strengthen my opinion that rugby 2012 should include as many competitions of rugby union as possible. When in Rome, not really a rugby hotbed, I came across rugby adverts in banks, shops, general street signs, even having a drink in a rugby bar. Now of course there were numerous football advertisements but no more than rugby. However the interesting thing is when I was at the Italian port of Brindisi on my way to Greece. We, my girlfriend and I, met four young Belgium men who after a quick chat found out loved rugby and all played.
I met so many people from all over the world who watched or with a rugby ball "messed around with friends".
This game has to appeal to as many as possible so adding the Belgium international rugby team, the Italian super 10 competition and the likes of the French and English second tier leagues could help generate sales and
Expand rugby new markets. Like I said previous rugby games has helped me and my friends keep interest in the game when no club was around, not everywhere is like Wales or New Zealand were there is club in every village. It will help rugby and I do believe help H.B.
I study in Wales and there is more hype for Pontypridd playing Cardiff in the Welsh premiership than the Scarlets playing the Ospreys in the Magners league.

 

[ranger]

Think about the target markets; the majority of sales will be in Europe (in fact, don't be surprised if there are more sales in the UK alone then the whole of Aus & NZ combined).

With a project as young as this one, without the finantial clout of EA to back them up, if there's no profit there's no sequel. Therefore good business sense is to target the bigger market and localise them with familiarity - It may surprise you but the majority of rugby fans north of the equator have never even heard of the ITM Cup (Nor the currie cup). Everyone however knows the big 5 (AP, T14, ML, HEC & S14).

As he said, get it right in the basics first, then add the fancy stuff after.

A tad patronizing there.. Give me a bit of credit aye?

I just don't think we should be writing off these options until we really know how much time and money it would take to produce them. We are really just guessing here as to the viability of putting the Currie Cup and ITM cup in. I dont want it to seem as if we have reached a consensus on the board and decided to just flag those options if it turns out HB can fit them in.
The game you're after (6 NH modes to 2 SH modes) kind of sucks for us to be honest, i'm not even sure if i would buy that game. Surely there would be some value the ITM cup from a neutral's perspective. Say what you want about the defense and set piece, but it is the best competition in the world for running attacking rugby. Thats what the casual rugby gamer is after isnt it?

 

[Teh Mite]

A tad patronizing there.. Give me a bit of credit aye?

I just don't think we should be writing off these options until we really know how much time and money it would take to produce them. We are really just guessing here as to the viability of putting the Currie Cup and ITM cup in. I dont want it to seem as if we have reached a consensus on the board and decided to just flag those options if it turns out HB can fit them in.
The game you're after (6 NH modes to 2 SH modes) kind of sucks for us to be honest, i'm not even sure if i would buy that game. Surely there would be some value the ITM cup from a neutral's perspective. Say what you want about the defense and set piece, but it is the best competition in the world for running attacking rugby. Thats what the casual rugby gamer is after isnt it?

How is it patronising when a country with a 60m population is more then 2 with a combined population of barely 25m? Then considr the French, Irish, Italian and American markets where the majority of sales will happen. The only country where it's likely to sell in any significant numbers in the southern hemisphere is South Africa.

As for your arguement about "running rugby" - You all say that for whatever competition it is on. Is the ITM a better competition for running rugby now then the Super 14????

Lisences are just there to look pretty. They don't make the game "have better running rugby" or whatever tired kiwi cliche you want to hurl away. The same game mechanics will be there regardless of whatever skin is coating the game.

And I bet you would buy buy it even if there was a "boo-hoo-hoo bias" to the Northen Hemisphere competitions ("because they oppress us. Us southerners are held down by the northern man").

 

[SavageLez]

I think that SPECIAL attention should be given to the MAJOR Leagues and Tournaments such as the World Cup, Lions Tour, Super 14, Tri- Nations, 6 Nations etc. It would be great if the top premiership teams from SA, NZ , AUS, ENG, FRA, SCO, IRE, WAL are already available (if money is an issue then dont licence them all but copy as close to the real thing as possible).

To make everybody happy you should be able to create your own league and/ or tournament, teams and players if they are not already in the pool of available players!

 

[_George]

How is it patronising when a country with a 60m population is more then 2 with a combined population of barely 25m? Then considr the French, Irish, Italian and American markets where the majority of sales will happen. The only country where it's likely to sell in any significant numbers in the southern hemisphere is South Africa.

As for your arguement about "running rugby" - You all say that for whatever competition it is on. Is the ITM a better competition for running rugby now then the Super 14????

Lisences are just there to look pretty. They don't make the game "have better running rugby" or whatever tired kiwi cliche you want to hurl away. The same game mechanics will be there regardless of whatever skin is coating the game.

And I bet you would buy buy it even if there was a "boo-hoo-hoo bias" to the Northen Hemisphere competitions ("because they oppress us. Us southerners are held down by the northern man").

bro, u don't give us much respect do u ? NZ is the best rugby country in the world and your talking about not having an ITM Cup in this game ? our top ITM Cup teams ( and Currie Cup ) could probably beat most of NH top professional teams .

 

[TRF_Olyy]

bro, u don't give us much respect do u ? NZ is the best rugby country in the world and your talking about not having an ITM Cup in this game ? our top ITM Cup teams ( and Currie Cup ) could probably beat most of NH top professional teams .

Stop trying to pick fights.

 

[_George]

Stop trying to pick fights.

im not .

 

[ranger]

How is it patronising when a country with a 60m population is more then 2 with a combined population of barely 25m? Then considr the French, Irish, Italian and American markets where the majority of sales will happen. The only country where it's likely to sell in any significant numbers in the southern hemisphere is South Africa.

As for your arguement about "running rugby" - You all say that for whatever competition it is on. Is the ITM a better competition for running rugby now then the Super 14????

Lisences are just there to look pretty. They don't make the game "have better running rugby" or whatever tired kiwi cliche you want to hurl away. The same game mechanics will be there regardless of whatever skin is coating the game.

And I bet you would buy buy it even if there was a "boo-hoo-hoo bias" to the Northen Hemisphere competitions ("because they oppress us. Us southerners are held down by the northern man").

This whole, "This may suprise you" buisness is whats patronizing, not the numbers themselves. Yes, i realize the facts at play here, i never disputed them. You seem to assume i am some insular fan who thinks that because i see something one way, the rest of the world does too. I don't like that.
There are a couple things i willl question though, why does Ireland count as a country where the majority of sales will occur when they have a near identical population to NZ? Do you have access to the actual sales figures from the different countries for the previous games? What separates them as a country where the game will sell in "significant numbers"?

As for running rugby, yes. I believe the ITM cup is better than the Super 14 in that regard. I said before that it isn't without its flaws but that is an area where i think its the best in the world. As for it being a "tired kiwi cliche?" its not a cliche, it actually exists. I don't expect you NH lads to realize what running rugby is, but i assure you it exists. Its not a cliche or a myth and we do it down here, and will be putting in into practice all over your national teams this november, if you want to get a closer look at it

You seem to have overlooked my main point here. I just don't want to write off the possibility of including those two competitions if it turns out that HB can reasonably afford to put them in the game. I don't want them to have a look at the forum and see that we have reached a consensus that everyone is happy with in discarding the ITM cup and Currie cup. I don't know how much it would cost to include these licenses, or how much extra time it would take to model the players and that, it seems like everyone is just assuming that it will be expensive so we may aswell give up on it. I dont want to until a member of HB staff ( or yourself upon asking) shows us the figures or says that it would be too costly.
How much do you want to bet that i'll pick up this game also? I wont just buy something just because the word "Rugby" is printed on it. If the gameplay is much the same as the last games, and its just stacked with NH competitions (no offense, but i just find them **** boring, personal preference) then i see no reason for me to buy it. I didn't buy 08 because it didn't do enough to sway me.

I have also resisted the urge to tell you to grow up, which I'm quite proud of.

 

[Teh Mite]

"why does Ireland count as a country where the majority of sales will occur when they have a near identical population to NZ?"
Because they're part of the Larger European market who'd buy into HEC and Magners league licences. I don't expect HB to include the All Ireland League in the game, which is the ITM equivalent.

"I don't expect you NH lads to realize what running rugby is, but i assure you it exists."
Well blow me down with a feather, are you sure?

"Its not a cliche or a myth and we do it down here, and will be putting in into practice all over your national teams this november, if you want to get a closer look at it"
And that has what to do with whaqt leagues are included in the game? Or for that matter, the game mechanics relating to have every match would play out?


"How much do you want to bet that i'll pick up this game also? I wont just buy something just because the word "Rugby" is printed on it. If the gameplay is much the same as the last games, and its just stacked with NH competitions (no offense, but i just find them **** boring, personal preference) then i see no reason for me to buy it. I didn't buy 08 because it didn't do enough to sway me."
So if the game were to have NO liscences in it at all you would say "no thanks, that's not for me" eh? ******** would you.

"I have also resisted the urge to tell you to grow up, which I'm quite proud of."
lol, now who's being patronising?

 

[Hurricane Nate]

I'll be ****** if they have all the NH comps and miss out the ITM/Currie Cup. Quality competitions should get the nod over competitions that are lower in quality and in my opinion SH shits on the NH comps (in terms of player calibre). If they do decide to put all of the comps in I hope they base the NH teams around 10man rugby and the SH teams around attacking 15man rugby for added realism.

 

[dan the man]

New Zealand is the best country in the world! The World Cup will be held here the same year this game is released... i would be very disappointed if the ITM Cup wasn't included!!!
The three wise men (All Black coaches) are closely following the ITM Cup to decide on who will be included in there 'end of year tour'. This competition is a very big deal in NZ and is always growing in popularity.

I would much prefer this over an Asian/Japanese Comp

 

[Dizzy]

New Zealand is the best country in the world! The World Cup will be held here the same year this game is released... i would be very disappointed if the ITM Cup wasn't included!!!
The three wise men (All Black coaches) are closely following the ITM Cup to decide on who will be included in there 'end of year tour'. This competition is a very big deal in NZ and is always growing in popularity.

I would much prefer this over an Asian/Japanese Comp

Nuff said

 

[ranger]

"why does Ireland count as a country where the majority of sales will occur when they have a near identical population to NZ?"
Because they're part of the Larger European market who'd buy into HEC and Magners league licences. I don't expect HB to include the All Ireland League in the game, which is the ITM equivalent.

Thats an unsatisfactory answer there. Sure Ireland is part of a larger market, okay then. That doesn't explain why that individual country is more likely to sell more copies of the game than NZ. Can we get the actual figures instead of just guessing?.
As for the All Ireland League being the equivalent, that's simply bullshit. It seems to be a common problem with NH observers to assume that the two systems run in parallel tiers. It doesn't. You cant point at one competition and call it the equivalent because the competitions are just structured differently.
To illustrate my point, look at the likes of Lifiemi Mafi, Matty James, Peter Borlase, Cameron Jowitt, Mark Sorenson and a whole host of other players from NZ who played almost exclusively in the ITM cup, with only fleeting tastes of any Super 14 experience if any. They all managed to waltz gaily into this supposed higher tier of rugby in the northern hemisphere with ITM cup written on their resume, where are the All Ireland league players signing super 14 contracts?
What can we infer from this? is NZ just a superior country, where even our inferior athletes playing in ****-poor competitions can demand an NH contract? of course not, the structure of competitions are just different.

This weekend Piri Weepu, Victor Vito and Corey Jane are all lining up for Wellington in a team already stacked with Super 14 players. How many games does Tommy Bowe and Ferris and O'Leary actually play for their All Ireland teams?
If we are comparing the All Ireland league to anything, it would be the New Zealand club competition. Every All Black has a super 14 side he plays all the games for, an ITM cup team he plays roughly half the games for, and a club team he might turn out for once or twice a year. In Ireland, they are only attached to a Magners side and an All Ireland team. The tier of rugby that the ITM cup rests on doesn't exist in Ireland so you can't compare it.

"I don't expect you NH lads to realize what running rugby is, but i assure you it exists."
Well blow me down with a feather, are you sure?

And

"Its not a cliche or a myth and we do it down here, and will be putting in into practice all over your national teams this november, if you want to get a closer look at it"
And that has what to do with whaqt leagues are included in the game? Or for that matter, the game mechanics relating to have every match would play out?

It doesn't really, your post was just so smug that i thought it would be rude not to respond in kind. I'll admit that im not an expert when it comes to game mechanics. If it were a simulation and true to life though, the play would be more free flowing in the ITM cup. If i were trying to advertise rugby as a spectator sport to a new market, i would use that.

"How much do you want to bet that i'll pick up this game also? I wont just buy something just because the word "Rugby" is printed on it. If the gameplay is much the same as the last games, and its just stacked with NH competitions (no offense, but i just find them **** boring, personal preference) then i see no reason for me to buy it. I didn't buy 08 because it didn't do enough to sway me."
So if the game were to have NO liscences in it at all you would say "no thanks, that's not for me" eh? ******** would you.

That's not what i was saying. If the game has great gameplay i would buy it regardless. Considering the circumstances, i'm not confident of this however. If the game had average gameplay and also featured the ITM cup, then that would be a selling point for me.
If the game had average gameplay, then this dazzling array of NH licenses wouldn't do it for me and i would probably pass on it.

"I have also resisted the urge to tell you to grow up, which I'm quite proud of."
lol, now who's being patronising?

Me

 

[_George]

I'll be ****** if they have all the NH comps and miss out the ITM/Currie Cup. Quality competitions should get the nod over competitions that are lower in quality and in my opinion SH shits on the NH comps (in terms of player calibre). If they do decide to put all of the comps in I hope they base the NH teams around 10man rugby and the SH teams around attacking 15man rugby for added realism.

agreed

 

[Duckdee]

It's all your own fault, you shouldn't have such a weird system.

 

[smiffymies]

i am sorry but i higly doubt itm teams could as you say "****" on the NH teams. Regardless of if you agree or not, the ITM is at a lower standard than the magners and aviva premiership. That is just a fact. There are players in the ITM who are outstanding but as a whole, the teams are on paper seen as weaker. Just stating a fact.

 

[Teh Mite]

Hey everyone! Let's have an inter hemisphere cock swinging contest! Kiwis, you start!!!11!!!11!!!one1

 

[smiffymies]

everyone keep your cocks inside your pants please

 

[ranger]

Hey everyone! Let's have an inter hemisphere cock swinging contest! Kiwis, you start!!!11!!!11!!!one1

That was clearly not what i was doing..

 

[Hurricane Nate]

i am sorry but i higly doubt itm teams could as you say "****" on the NH teams. Regardless of if you agree or not, the ITM is at a lower standard than the magners and aviva premiership. That is just a fact. There are players in the ITM who are outstanding but as a whole, the teams are on paper seen as weaker. Just stating a fact.

Fair enough, but even at full strength?. Even the B&I Lions stuggled against most of them (bar Manawatu) so I tend to think that our provincial rugby is not as weak as some may think. Yep 5 years ago but they are the latest NH team to play against any of them and their meant to be the best of the best.