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A Political Thread pt. 2

I'm against any military interference/pressure/"help with weapon" of the 3rd part (regardless of who it is) in conflicts between 2 countries/different sides inside the one country. I think, it never leads to a real de-escalation and is almost never fair. If you want to help, then help to refugees to move to a safe zone/your own country(including transport, documents, material help to those refugees etc).
 
Zero tolerance towards anti semitism...

Sadly for the left Zionism and pro-Palestine sentism are all dog whistles to people engaging in anti-semitism. Its left the room for practical debate almost useless in the left. Which is why Labour clean up some mistakes are going to be made in kicking out the actual anti-semites. Don't think Starmer decides every individual case hence appeals processes and what not.

Now of course it's use by Corbynites to pretend there wasn't a problem despite the fact Jewish people say there were.

In fact yout post is full of all those red flags.

I say this as person who fully supports a two states solution if both side can work out what to do about Jureselum but I don't think either side is willing to come to the table in the same way the Irish were in the 90's. Until they are it's a useless conversation having and as long as the USA back Israel wholeheartedly nothing is going to change any time soon.
It sounds like you truly believe that rather than racism in the Labour party under Corbyn being greatly exaggerated by the pro establishment wing of the Labour Party and their media pals (see relative silence on Tory Islamiphobia) as a way of undermining the democratic leadership of the Labour Party and ensuring the Conservatives get re-elected. Thereby permitting the establishment wing of the Labour Party to regain power and implement undemocratic reform of the party by reducing the impact of ordinary Labour Party members in electing a leader. So that 'Sir' Keir and his establishment buddies need never have their privileged positions threatened by a democratic movement again.

For your information I've dated a Jew and never voted Labour. So you may wish to reread my post with that in mind if you find it in any way troubling. But hey throw mud if you like and close your mind to discussion about the Middle East if you like, both are second nature to your wing of the party after all. :p

And as for red flags, someone has to keep them flying because heaven knows 'Sir' Keir's version of the Labour Party won't.
 
I'm against any military interference/pressure/"help with weapon" of the 3rd part (regardless of who it is) in conflicts between 2 countries/different sides inside the one country. I think, it never leads to a real de-escalation and is almost never fair. If you want to help, then help to refugees to move to a safe zone/your own country(including transport, documents, material help to those refugees etc).
Did you know the USSR created a Jewish autonomous zone in Siberia near(ish) Vladivostok (after WWII) as an intended homeland, but it never really caught on and today less than 1% of the population there is Jewish.

I'm not sure if it pre-dated the British empire taking territory it had promised to the Arabs for their assistance in WWII and making Israel instead. Personally I'd have favoured a Jewish state in Bavaria or suchlike.
 
Did you know the USSR created a Jewish autonomous zone in Siberia near(ish) Vladivostok (after WWII) as an intended homeland, but it never really caught on and today less than 1% of the population there is Jewish.
Do you mean the Jewish Autonomous oblast' ? Yes, of course I know it :) Most of Jews left it for Israel in 90s from what I know. Interesting region,in general, with a wild nature (and Amur tigers). I haven't visited it yet though, unfortunately
 
Do you mean the Jewish Autonomous oblast' ? Yes, of course I know it :) Most of Jews left it for Israel in 90s from what I know. Interesting region,in general, with a wild nature (and Amur tigers). I haven't visited it yet though, unfortunately
Sorry, I didn't think it would be widely known, even in Russia.
 
I'm against any military interference/pressure/"help with weapon" of the 3rd part (regardless of who it is) in conflicts between 2 countries/different sides inside the one country. I think, it never leads to a real de-escalation and is almost never fair. If you want to help, then help to refugees to move to a safe zone/your own country(including transport, documents, material help to those refugees etc).

I can't say I agree in cases of civil war / political unrest with massive imbalance of power requires external pressure. Apartheid South Africa and Troubles North of Ireland are obvious examples where a resolution would not have been reached without heavy third party pressure.

With more isolated/stubborn countries with massive leverage like China or Israel in this case not much is going to happen but I wouldn't be proud of my country if they had good relations with countries like that, which unfortunately we do with China on account of the business they provide us.
 
What do you mean? In case with China for example
So our government have (recently) come out with harsh words against Israel, it went down pretty poorly. Unfortunately we have no relationship with Israel where sanctions would really make them even consider what they're doing.

We wouldn't dare criticise China despite their political concentration camps, we'd lose too much money.

In the 70s and 80s we boycotted South African products.

Obviously we put pressure on the UK re the north too.

And we have heavy involvement in UN peacekeeping in Africa.

I'm quite proud of most of that, we've had our own problems and tend to hold other countries to the standards we want, and I'd say have mostly achieved here. We are always near the top of quality of life and racial equality indexes so it's hard to point at us and claim hypocrisy*. If third party countries' only approach to civil war/unrest here was to take in refugees I can say with certainty that this island would be a far worse place to live with far less equality on both sides of the "border", I'd have also never been born.

External pressure is required when an imbalance of power has lead to oppressive regimes with tiered class systems in place. Because without it you have two or more opposing groups who hate each other and, more importantly, fear each other which leads to pig headedness and a total lack of dialogue as is evident in Israel today.

Saying this, I don't think the classic US World Police approach works, almost all of their attempts to intervene with army presence have failed miserably. But economic/trade sanctions, political condemnation etc... Should be a tool to destroy obvious widespread oppression like this.

*Not to say we're perfect. I think there's still widespread discrimination of traveller and gypsy people here.
 


Thought I'd share it for its mind boggling stupidity, also Mogg in The Sun today asking to find the Brexit benefits, reality being he'll get a list of things we could change in the EU but claim we couldn't.
 


Thought I'd share it for its mind boggling stupidity, also Mogg in The Sun today asking to find the Brexit benefits, reality being he'll get a list of things we could change in the EU but claim we couldn't.

I mean... She is technically correct...

You can blame Brexit for it, but it is ultimately as a result of "brussels beurocracy and red tape"
 
I mean... She is technically correct...

You can blame Brexit for it, but it is ultimately as a result of "brussels beurocracy and red tape"
Which came about because of Brexit... We are the side that has kept demanding renegotiations, who have been imposing deadlines, who have been demanding last minute extensions, who have reneged on what we negotiated and who have been threatening or actually invoking EU articles before we are ready.

The Brexit attitude is the perfect example of wanting to have your cake and eat it. Demanding all the perks you want but none of the downsides. If we wanted checkless trade, we should have stayed in a customs union. We very explicitly said we didn't want that so that now leads to border checks. This is exactly what you claimed to want but now you are complaining it's actually happening...?
 
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I mean... She is technically correct...

You can blame Brexit for it, but it is ultimately as a result of "brussels beurocracy and red tape"

Red tape and bureaucracy that the UK Government either failed to anticipate or chose to ignore the likelihood of. The EU were hardly going to roll over and have their bellies tickled if they wanted to send a message to it's member states about the consequences of leaving. If Scotland left the UK then the UK Govt would do exactly the same as the EU have done.
 
I mean... She is technically correct...

You can blame Brexit for it, but it is ultimately as a result of "brussels beurocracy and red tape"
I dunno about technically correct, you want Brexit, you refuse to join the customs unions, you are warned this will lead to massive issues at the border, it happens, than you blame Brussels? (The checks are in both directions)

The red tape is a result of the Brexit this government implemented and previous pursued to suggest otherwise is disingenuous at best.

May's decision to rule out the customs union and Johnson's doubling down has to be one of the stupidest decisions in history. We are the only country ever known to put economic sanctions on itself.
 
I find it ironic that people wanted to leave the EU because of all the 'red tape' but now the UK has to follow even more 'red tape' when dealing with the EU
 

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