Ashley-Cooper summoned back by his club

[gaston le gaff]

If you are in contact with them then surely they wont say it to your face that they are there for the money as that would be considered rude. Have to be polite and say what a nice country it is and how friendly the people are. This happens every time someone visits another country its a courtesy to say these pleasantries.

you cant be serious!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! and there is no if i am in contact with all. at MHR.

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Probably because of the exchange rate... You know, something to do with Economics, Political issues and policies and all that jazz. Of course the players who are already there will tell you something different.

Do you really think they will say the same as a player still stuck in SA, not getting the benefits they are getting there?? Why would the french-bound players jeopardize their current situation and the huge amounts of money they are getting? Self-preservation.

anything and everything but the truth well played sir you know nothing!!!!!!!!!!

 

[TRF_heineken]

you cant be serious!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! and there is no if i am in contact with all. at MHR.

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anything and everything but the truth well played sir you know nothing!!!!!!!!!!

Just because you don't like the response from different saffas with the same viewpoint, doesn't make it less true.

But okay, let's leave it at that. There are too many active threads where there are needless debates going around. I've said what I wanted to say, and I'll leave it at that.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

AAC started for his club yesterday so I guess that rules other the concussion/injury theory!
World Rugby really need to take a stand on this.

 

[gaston le gaff]

AAC started for his club yesterday so I guess that rules other the concussion/injury theory!
World Rugby really need to take a stand on this.

he also scored a try, so all the excuses about concussion are bull and the President called him back end off, and somehow i do not think WR will be getting involved, this is now history, time to move on folks

 

[nickdnz]

What a joke, WR should put some massive sanctions on them to be honest.

 

[smartcooky]

he also scored a try, so all the excuses about concussion are bull and the President called him back end off, and somehow i do not think WR will be getting involved, this is now history, time to move on folks

And you wonder why the rest of the rugby world thinks that those in charge of French Rugby clubs are arrogant pricks.

I wonder if you and FrenchFan will still think that "this constant demonizing of French clubs" all just a big joke when a concussed player who returns to play without competing the proper protocols, ends up dying. If your clubs persist in playing Russian Roulette with concussion, sooner or later, they will end up pulling the trigger with the bullet in the firing chamber. It will happen, its only a matter of time.

 

[Gavin]

And you wonder why the rest of the rugby world thinks that those in charge of French Rugby clubs are arrogant pricks.

I wonder if you and FrenchFan will still think that "this constant demonizing of French clubs" all just a big joke when a concussed player who returns to play without competing the proper protocols, ends up dying. If your clubs persist in playing Russian Roulette with concussion, sooner or later, they will end up pulling the trigger with the bullet in the firing chamber. It will happen, its only a matter of time.

Not everyone thinks that French club owners are arrogant pricks as you so elegantly put it.

Why are we suggesting that it was the French club in the wrong? Could it be that AAC was making an excuse to remain in Australia a bit longer than returning to his employer?

 

[smartcooky]

Not everyone thinks that French club owners are arrogant pricks as you so elegantly put it.

Why are we suggesting that it was the French club in the wrong? Could it be that AAC was making an excuse to remain in Australia a bit longer than returning to his employer?

Oh dear. Do you actually know anything about what happened?

AAC was taken off the field for a sideline concussion test WHICH HE FAILED. He also did the required follow up psychometric test WHICH HE FAILED. This initiates the MANDATORY Graduated Return to Play Protocol. So, AAC wasn't making any excuses, unless you think he faked the test failures! Got evidence of that then?

Bordeaux-Begles forwards coach Jaques Brunel said..

"We'll give him a checkup next week with a neurologist to see if he can eventually be called on.But he seems to be physically and mentally fit to play,"

So, is Brunel a doctor then? Giving him a "check-up with a neurologist" is not what the GRTP (currently being used by WR) states. It all seems very slap-dash to me. After seeing the utter contempt with which Noves disgregarded the rules around concussion with the Florian Fritz incident, I have seen nothing that would indicate to me that they have learned any lessons or accepted that what Noves did was wrong, and I have no confidence that the people running these clubs will not put the team first and the health & well being their players second


ETA: AAC was concussed on 27 August, and was still showing symptoms a week later when he returned to France on 4 September. He played for Bordeaux-Begles on 10 September. Forgive me if I am dubious that he could have competed this protocol...

....in just six days!!!

Players who fail both the Sideline concussion test and the follow-up psychometric tests are usually out for at least a month, and in particular, AAC needs to be treated with extra caution as this is at least the third time that he has been concussed.

 

[Which Tyler]

Far from the first to do so though.

In fact everyone who isn't suffering after effects will pass 5 days worth of tests inside 6 days (well, 4 as the first will have been passed by the time of his return,)

As for "checking up with a neurologist" neurologist ARE Drs and exactly the right specialists to conduct the tests, so not sure why you consider that to bea problem.

You or I may prefer a mandatory stand-down period, but despite your claims, there isn't one (well, there is, it's 5 days and includes training)

WR does need to get involved to protect article 9 (?) on player release though.

 

[smartcooky]

Far from the first to do so though.

In fact everyone who isn't suffering after effects will pass 5 days worth of tests inside 6 days (well, 4 as the first will have been passed by the time of his return,)

As for "checking up with a neurologist" neurologist ARE Drs and exactly the right specialists to conduct the tests, so not sure why you consider that to bea problem.

You or I may prefer a mandatory stand-down period, but despite your claims, there isn't one (well, there is, it's 5 days and includes training)

WR does need to get involved to protect article 9 (?) on player release though.

The problem I have with their use of a neurologist is that he/she needs to be chosen independently, not by the club, who may well have medical people on tap who are prepared to do and say what the club wants; and if you don't believe that happens in rugby, I suggest to look up "bloodgate"

AAC failed both concussion tests (sideline on the 27th, follow up on the 28th, and a week later on the 4th was still showing symptoms, so therefore he cannot have progressed beyond Step 1 of the protocol. Then he gets back to France, and magically, passes the next four steps in six days. Sorry, not buying it. I have a lot of experience dealing with concussion with my involvement as an official in Equestrian Eventing... things simply do not work like that. If a person is still showing symptoms a week after being concussed, those symptoms are not going to disappear that quickly.

 

[Which Tyler]

Surprisingly, I know, and I agree with you; but don't see any reference to "our neurologist" just "a neurologist" I'd also suggest that clubs dont have neurologists on the pay role as standard; they may, but it'd be a new one on me.

Actually, people can recover that quickly; it's unusual, but far from unheard of. Do we have a link to what test he failed on the 4th? Phase 1? Phase 5? Irrelevant pitch-side? Do we know what symptoms at what degree of stress he was exhibiting on the 4th?
Now, I agree that French rugby (well, all of rugby) has historically been very lax with concussion, and has had dodgy attitudes towards damaging players; but I claim that this level of recovery is unfeasible is patently false; sorry.

 

[smartcooky]

Actually, people can recover that quickly; it's unusual, but far from unheard of. Do we have a link to what test he failed on the 4th? Phase 1? Phase 5? Irrelevant pitch-side? Do we know what symptoms at what degree of stress he was exhibiting on the 4th?

You can only progress from one step to the next when you are completely symptom free for 24 hours. If AAC was still showing symptoms a week later (and my understanding is that he was) , then he had still to complete Step 1.

 

[Which Tyler]

I know that, I'm clever and can read things.
What I don't know, is if he was still showing SSx at rest, or under stress - I simply haven't seen that level of information for him.

 

[FrenchFan]

Let's see what WR decide about UBB over concussion.

One point about UBB Bordeaux. I'm not their lawyer and I'm not here to defend them. But they consulted an independent neurologist who is not on the club's payroll. Now of course it was pointed out that he might do the club a favour (more slander) when I find it hard to imagine a doctor would risk his career for a rugby club. Also, how would one prove this in a court of justice?

I suspect like many others over here it is WR that don't have the balls to face a French club in court. Because, fact is, under French laws, Bordeaux by consulting an independent neurologist have covered their arse.

My guess is WR will walk away from a real court fight they don't have the guts to take. But I could be wrong... Let's see what they do. Because now it's their move.

And maybe, while we wait, they'll serve us up another round of blather on the 'Global Season'.