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England Rugby 2019/20 Thread

living sacrifice

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And obviously it'll be some rando that plays in the crusaders reserve team and is 34.


Or it'll be Luther burrell
Lol

I really rated Burrell as a top premiership player but he looked lost during his 15 minutes or whatever it was with Jones. Bit of a wasted talent as he really fell off after that.
 

Tigs Man

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Is it me or does Jack Maunder never get brought up in the 9 talk anymore?
Was literally the 9 for Exeter in the double.

I swear about 3 years ago everyone was saying he should be in the squad more and yet he's still only 23 (Same age as mitchell) with 75 caps for Exeter and a England cap.

You also have his younger brother Sam and Joe Snow at Exeter (I feel Snow needs to think about looking elsewhere though)
 

ratsapprentice

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Haven't watched a game of rugby all year....

Come back and Youngs is still in...

Cya.
 

TBeastT

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Is it me or does Jack Maunder never get brought up in the 9 talk anymore?
Was literally the 9 for Exeter in the double.

I swear about 3 years ago everyone was saying he should be in the squad more and yet he's still only 23 (Same age as mitchell) with 75 caps for Exeter and a England cap.

You also have his younger brother Sam and Joe Snow at Exeter (I feel Snow needs to think about looking elsewhere though)
I don't rate Maunder that much TBH. He's been solid enough for us but some of his box kicking has been very suspect at times and he's botched a few try opportunities by just... falling over. As you said, he's only 23 so I hope he's involved in the future but he's nowhere near ready enough yet IMO.
 

BPM

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Agreed. Maunder will benefit from starting more, but is currently the weakest link for Exeter IMO. I wouldn’t be totally surprised if Sam Hidalgo-Clyne creeps ahead in the pecking order.
 

scotty507

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Agreed. Maunder will benefit from starting more, but is currently the weakest link for Exeter IMO. I wouldn’t be totally surprised if Sam Hidalgo-Clyne creeps ahead in the pecking order.
The ex Scotland international overtaking the the 23 year old 9...shocker. naa im joking with you. I agree and disagree on this recently Chiefs have made clear they play a gameplan where they carry alot and make the opposition tackle alot and tire, so in theory having the more expansive 9 in the 21 shirt means your more likly to open up defences in the second half.

But i do rate Hidalgo-Clyne over Maunder.

Only remember seeing joe Snow play once but he looked class, raw but alot of skill.
 

TBeastT

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Shame Stu Townsend's had bad luck with injuries; there was a time when he looked decidedly better than Maunder.
 

Which Tyler

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Maunder is stuck where Ben Spencer was 5 years ago.
He seems to prefer thenidea of being loyal, and picking up medals on the bench, rather than moving to be first choice and developing as a player.

9s need game-time, there's simply no substitute for it.

Like Spencer 5 years ago, if he wants to fulfill his promise, he needs to move.
If he wants to win medals, there's nowhere to move to.
 

BPM

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Well Maunder has been the clear first choice since Nic White left. My question is whether he’s good enough to stay there?

SHC is a good player, but not so good that Maunder can’t hold-off the challenge. As Scotty has said, they have different styles and SHC is probably more impactful from the bench. The next question is whether Baxter feels that he needs to upgrade for Exeter to stay at the top? When I look at their side, 9 is definitely the weakest position IMO, but then staying honest with the cap requires balance so not every position is going to be equally strong I guess.
 

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Team for Italy...

15. George Furbank (Northampton Saints, 2 caps)
14. Anthony Watson (Bath Rugby, 43 caps)
13. Jonathan Joseph (Bath Rugby, 50 caps)
12. Henry Slade (Exeter Chiefs, 29 caps)
11. Jonny May (Gloucester Rugby, 56 caps)
10. Owen Farrell (Saracens, 83 caps)
9. Ben Youngs (Leicester Tigers, 99 caps)
1. Mako Vunipola (Saracens, 59 caps)
2. Jamie George (Saracens, 49 caps)
3. Kyle Sinckler (Bristol Bears, 35 caps)
4. Maro Itoje (Saracens, 38 caps)
5. Jonny Hill (Exeter Chiefs, uncapped)
6. Tom Curry (Sale Sharks, 23 caps)
7. Sam Underhill (Bath Rugby, 18 caps)
8. Billy Vunipola (Saracens, 51 caps)

FINISHERS

16. Tom Dunn, (Bath Rugby, uncapped)
17. Ellis Genge (Leicester Tigers, 18 caps)
18. Will Stuart (Bath Rugby, 3 caps)
19. Charlie Ewels (Bath Rugby, 15 caps)
20. Ben Earl (Bristol Bears, 3 caps)
21. Dan Robson (Wasps, 2 caps)
22. Ollie Lawrence (Worcester Warriors, uncapped)
23. Ollie Thorley (Gloucester Rugby, uncapped)
 

Which Tyler

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Surprised that Jonny Hill starts rather than benches after his last few weeks, have to trust their S&C decision there.

I really don't see anything in Furbank that puts him ahead of Malins (or Watson) at FB - but its no surprise that Eddie does.


Earl over Willis is the only thing that actively makes me sad - which is nothing against Earl, and may "just" be a reflection of time in-camp. The same may well have out paid to Malins at FB.
Obviously, Young's makes me sad, but I've grown accustomed to that


The only other change I see from MY 23, is Genge in for Obano, which now picking the better player over a kinder debut
 
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TBeastT

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Earl over Willis is the only thing that actively makes me sad - which is nothing against Earl
Makes sense really. I rate Willis very highly but in terms of who's going to bring more impact from the bench then it's undoubtedly Earl. I think Willis is definitely one of those players where he either starts or he isn't involved at all.
 

Geordiefalcon

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Earls is a beast...he has the lot as a flanker.

We have an ebarrassment of riches coming through in the back row. ...
Who do you pick out of:

Underhill
Curry x 2
Ted Hill
Willis
Earl
BIlly V
Dombrandt
Mercer
Ludlum
Simmonds
Wilson
etc etc
 

scotty507

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Earls is a beast...he has the lot as a flanker.

We have an ebarrassment of riches coming through in the back row. ...
Who do you pick out of:

Underhill
Curry x 2
Ted Hill
Willis
Earl
BIlly V
Dombrandt
Mercer
Ludlum
Simmonds
Wilson
etc etc
I want to see Willis Curry Dombrandt

As it stands there is no England back row that doesnt involve TCurry. Willis is up and coming but form prem back row. And Dombrandt balances out the back row but also brings smart running lines and a good rugby brain...i just wabt to know why EJ thinks otherwise.
 

living sacrifice

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Earls is a beast...he has the lot as a flanker.

We have an ebarrassment of riches coming through in the back row. ...
Who do you pick out of:

Underhill
Curry x 2
Ted Hill
Willis
Earl
BIlly V
Dombrandt
Mercer
Ludlum
Simmonds
Wilson
etc etc
I’m Eddie and I pick a lock at 6, a 6 at 7 and a flanker at 8 for lols.
 

Old Hooker

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Makes sense really. I rate Willis very highly but in terms of who's going to bring more impact from the bench then it's undoubtedly Earl. I think Willis is definitely one of those players where he either starts or he isn't involved at all.
I don’t think you can pigeon hole him like that. You don’t always want “impact” from the bench; for this game yes as we’re almost certainly going to want to cut loose, but there will be other games where we need to tighten up or defend a narrow lead where Willis’ skill set would be more useful.

But academic if he continues his current trajectory. If he does he’ll be starting.
 

TBeastT

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I don’t think you can pigeon hole him like that. You don’t always want “impact” from the bench; for this game yes as we’re almost certainly going to want to cut loose, but there will be other games where we need to tighten up or defend a narrow lead where Willis’ skill set would be more useful.

But academic if he continues his current trajectory. If he does he’ll be starting.
Yeah that’s absolutely true. I guess it just depends on what an individual wants coming off the bench. For me, there’s nothing more effective against tired legs than raw pace and explosiveness, which Earl is suited perfectly for, but everyone sees the game differently and I suppose that’s the beauty of it.
 

BPM

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Personally, I would have been very tempted to start Willis with Earl on the bench to bring impact.

One of the features of the Ireland vs. Italy game last weekend was the Italians inability to look after their own ball. Ireland turned them over pretty easily and I imagine Willis could have had an absolute field day. Curry and Underhill are both good over the ball though so I can see plenty of turnovers.

Another factor in the eventual score was that Italy dropped off massively at about 60/65mins in. Ireland only really ran away with it late in the game (notwithstanding the last minute Italian try). Earl’s skill set is probably more likely to be able to exploit that scenario than what Willis brings. If we use the bench well, Earl, Robson, Lawrence and Thorley could be a devastating set of players to bring on. Loads of pace, energy and try scoring potential.
 

Old Hooker

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Yeah that’s absolutely true. I guess it just depends on what an individual wants coming off the bench. For me, there’s nothing more effective against tired legs than raw pace and explosiveness, which Earl is suited perfectly for, but everyone sees the game differently and I suppose that’s the beauty of it.
In the majority of cases you’ll be right. I guess I just think back to Jason Leonard in the 03 final. The scrum was in danger of losing us the game, Leonard trots off the bench and tells the ref he can trust him to sort it out. You’d never have accused Leonard of being one to up the pace but that day his nous and experience made him the right horse for that particular course. A more explosive, volatile option like Genge might have lost us that.

Ref Reiser’s link, Jones is either monumentally taking the p*ss, trying to gee up Youngs or needs certifying.
 

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