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European Champions Cup 2017/18: Pool 4

munstermuffin

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Point out which of the above I disagree with?

Never said Munster condoned cheating. Said a player received a 2 year ban on their watch. True. Was still banned for 3 months.

No idea why you're bringing up the case on a Leinster player.

Point out where I said that journalist doesn't write for the Independent please. What he said was true, Munster signed a player who was banned for taking steroids. Can you agree with that or is it fake news too? You may not like how he told the story but the basic fact behind it is undeniable.

Paul Kimmage has nothing got to do with this. He also didn't fail a drugs test. He admitted he took them in his book Rough Ride (great read) and crusades against drug taking in sport. Nothing wrong with that. He pointed out that Philip Browne said the IRFU had a stated zero tolerance policy to drugs and Munster signing Gerbrandt Grobler flies in the face of that. He's correct. Again, you may not like the fact that he pointed out hypocrisy but he didn't lie. Can you admit that?

I couldn't care less what Ger Gilroy thinks. He's making the same points as Kimmage and O'Connor though. Their points are correct even though you don't like how they were delivered. Why are you using him to attack myeslf and other Leinster posters on this site?

Point out where I moaned about Munster getting financial support for Thomond Park please.

I find it ironic that you're pointing out that people like me "only listen to what you want to hear and don't see the full picture". Isn't that exactly what you're doing?! I'd say I'm very balanced in how I express my opinions and call things how I see them regardless of where I'm from and who I support.

........................................

Think Munster will beat Toulon in the quarter final in Thomond Park. Clermont or Racing away in the semi will be a much tougher proposition.

Chris Farrell again looked good in my limited viewing of yesterday's game.
On Kimmage. He did fail a test.
On rest I never said you disagreed. Just put out facts.
Never said you said journalist doesn't write for Independent. Said you liked it.
Also Leinster player case is valid as it helps support reason why alot feel there is bias.
On Frankie Sheehan case it was paperwork filled out on IRFU watch that was issue and not their fault either.
Also Kimmage has alot to do with as I pointed out if it not a personal attack on 1 player why keep going after him. Why keep slating the Munster name. Why keep being factually not accurate on reporting of Munster.
On rest I never said you moaned I painted an overall view of press who are a bit bias. As I said not all Leinster fans are bad and not even fans as it the buyer journalism more than anything.
Can I also ask what I posted that is fair news?
I have no problem with balance. I am one who never said Grobler or drugs was a direct attack and praised guys like Thornley and co who raised it and argued it accurately.

I'm just pointing out facts or proof for better word why people like Kimmage are gutter press and more so pick and choose who to attack. He's a hypocritical gutter journalist in many people' views who seems to have no credible respect.

As I said I'm not saying you are unfair all the time but it is understandable why Munster fans do get ****** off due to aimed attacks by Independent for Munster simply calling them up on things.
 

The Alpha Bro

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On Kimmage. He did fail a test.
On rest I never said you disagreed. Just put out facts.
Never said you said journalist doesn't write for Independent. Said you liked it.
Also Leinster player case is valid as it helps support reason why alot feel there is bias.
On Frankie Sheehan case it was paperwork filled out on IRFU watch that was issue and not their fault either.
Also Kimmage has alot to do with as I pointed out if it not a personal attack on 1 player why keep going after him. Why keep slating the Munster name. Why keep being factually not accurate on reporting of Munster.
On rest I never said you moaned I painted an overall view of press who are a bit bias. As I said not all Leinster fans are bad and not even fans as it the buyer journalism more than anything.
Can I also ask what I posted that is fair news?
I have no problem with balance. I am one who never said Grobler or drugs was a direct attack and praised guys like Thornley and co who raised it and argued it accurately.

I'm just pointing out facts or proof for better word why people like Kimmage are gutter press and more so pick and choose who to attack. He's a hypocritical gutter journalist in many people' views who seems to have no credible respect.

As I said I'm not saying you are unfair all the time but it is understandable why Munster fans do get ****** off due to aimed attacks by Independent for Munster simply calling them up on things.
Kimmage is not partisan in the slightest. His attack on Dublin football after the All Ireland final was far less credible than attacking Aki or Stander. He's a pathetic journalist who will have a go at anything outside his own warped and hypocritical view of how sport should be governed. He's definitely not part of any "D4" agenda. The Indo is a rag and would jump on Leinster controversy in a heartbeat, right now the province is water tight with no current project players representing Ireland (not that I think that makes us "holier" than Munster) and we have no convicted dopers. Both of these are for points to debate, the project player debate is against Irish rugby rather than Munster, whether you agree with the stance or not. No news outlet is going to have an agenda against a sports organisation as a rule.
 

munstermuffin

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All fair points Alpha but there is very bad blood between ourselves and Independent.
On Kimmage I agree he is solely not out to Munster but is gutter journalist.
I don't agree with some bits but it fair debate. Just think Grobler was treated horrific. But I disagree on the "jumping on controversy" as it never happened as bad with Strauss, the Horgan ordeal was pushed away fast even now they refuse to challenge on things like Leinster screw up on signing 3 lads when only 2 can play. And let me clear up I'm not saying they should but if it was Munster who made that error it'd be thrown put there every time. Even now Munster still have one of best attendances in club rugby world wide and there is constant jibe if there is any gap. Leinster played last week and struggled to sell 18k. Plenty reasons I'm sure but again no jibes. Point is there a very very bias section of journalist and it desperate. And will clear up I'm not saying all Leinster is like that
 
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Very few would deny that it's been tough on Grobler and most have compassion for the human element of the story. It must be tough having this brought up when he's so far from family and friends. He made a huge mistake and served his punishment for it. The issue is the IRFU statement about zero tolerance for drug cheats. That's a very reasonable point even if you don't agree with it.

It doesn't matter that it was a Munster player who's at the centre of the storm. If it happened to a Connacht, Leinster or Ulster player the coverage would have been exactly the same. Leinster were rightly ridiculed for their handling of the Jamison Gibson Park and "Visa" Nacewa issue with getting into South Africa. Rightly so. The media didn't have a vendetta against Leinster because of what happened, merely pointed out that they screwed up. Same is happening with the Grobler story. It was a screw up.

If the IRFU take note and now stick to their stated zero tolerance policy, the media storm will have served Irish rugby well in the long term.

Which has nothing to do with this pool.

I watched most of the Leicester v Racing game yesterday. Lots of parallels between how the home side performed and how Leinster played in Matt O'Connor's second season in charge of the province. Leicester were devoid of attacking guile and ideas.
 

munstermuffin

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Very few would deny that it's been tough on Grobler and most have compassion for the human element of the story. It must be tough having this brought up when he's so far from family and friends. He made a huge mistake and served his punishment for it. The issue is the IRFU statement about zero tolerance for drug cheats. That's a very reasonable point even if you don't agree with it.

It doesn't matter that it was a Munster player who's at the centre of the storm. If it happened to a Connacht, Leinster or Ulster player the coverage would have been exactly the same. Leinster were rightly ridiculed for their handling of the Jamison Gibson Park and "Visa" Nacewa issue with getting into South Africa. Rightly so. The media didn't have a vendetta against Leinster because of what happened, merely pointed out that they screwed up. Same is happening with the Grobler story. It was a screw up.

If the IRFU take note and now stick to their stated zero tolerance policy, the media storm will have served Irish rugby well in the long term.

Which has nothing to do with this pool.

I watched most of the Leicester v Racing game yesterday. Lots of parallels between how the home side performed and how Leinster played in Matt O'Connor's second season in charge of the province. Leicester were devoid of attacking guile and ideas.
On Leinster issues. I'd disagree that they were ridiculed as it barely mentioned.
On IRFU zero tolerance. If that the key bit then it should've been their HQ and not the player that was targeted.
And I'd disagree it will serve us well long term if gutter journalist approach is there it takes away from real points.

But I will leave it at that as I agree it not on the topic of thread.

On Matt O'Connor. Isn't his supposed strength attacking. Like if he was coaching it usually attack
 

big ginger 8

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You said O'Connor is the Indo, I replied he is not the indo. He writes for them but he is not their editor or viewpoint. I'm fully aware he writes for them and learned long ago not to bother reading him. Don't blame me for a misunderstanding arising from your poor grammar.
 

The Alpha Bro

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I feel bad for the Tigers, didn't watch yesterday's games but its gone exactly as I expected for them. MO'C is being exposed a lot quicker than when he was in Leinster because he picked up a squad that hadn't won four trophies in the three previous seasons and has less players getting coached by a world class coach, Schmidt and Jones, 12 weeks a year. Leicester don't have huge depth but are under-performing massively which was a trend for his two years here. There's deeper problems in Leicester but getting rid of MO'C and replacing him with anyone decent gives them much stronger foundations immediately!
 

munstermuffin

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You said O'Connor is the Indo, I replied he is not the indo. He writes for them but he is not their editor or viewpoint. I'm fully aware he writes for them and learned long ago not to bother reading him. Don't blame me for a misunderstanding arising from your poor grammar.
Never said he was the editor or anything but won't resort to Your level BG8.
If I've poor grammar so be it
 
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