Is this try legal?

[Aedaphon]

The rules on juggling and whether a player has control of the ball have always (at least in my opinion) been fairly ambiguous.

Usually it's pretty easy to judge the situation by eye, but what does everyone else think about this? I want to say it's legal, but I have nagging feeling that it isn't...

 

[lucky number 7]

Provided it does not hit another player ref or the ground it can't be judged as a forward pass.

As he handnt fully collected the ball I'm assuming the argument is that it's much the same as a player juggling in order to control the ball. It just so happens he did so in the most advantageous manner

 

[dullonien]

From my understanding it would be deemed illegal. You aren't allowed to deliberately knock the ball forwards, even if you catch the ball before it hits another player/the ground. Otherwise it would be too easy to throw the ball over the defensive line, run through and collect it.

You are allowed to juggle with the ball if the ref decides it was by accident, but not if on purpose. This is a similar interpretation rule to that of kicking the ball after losing control. Even though a player kicks it before the ball touches the ground, the ref still pulls play ball for a knock on. There is nothing to differentiate a deliberate kick from an reactionary one after knocking the ball on other than intent, but that is something a ref must rule upon.

So it should have been a penalty to the defending team.

 

[psychic duck]

Can you legally throw the ball over the defence, run past, catch it without it touching anybody, then play on without it being a knock on?

Kind of like a chip ahead but with hands, is that legal?

 

[dullonien]

Can you legally throw the ball over the defence, run past, catch it without it touching anybody, then play on without it being a knock on?

Kind of like a chip ahead but with hands, is that legal?

No!

 

[SelimNiai]

From my understanding it would be deemed illegal. You aren't allowed to deliberately knock the ball forwards, even if you catch the ball before it hits another player/the ground. Otherwise it would be too easy to throw the ball over the defensive line, run through and collect it.

So it should have been a penalty to the defending team.

Thats my feelings although a defensive scrum would most likely be given as most refs would, I guess, give it as a knock-on

 

[Aedaphon]

Can you legally throw the ball over the defence, run past, catch it without it touching anybody, then play on without it being a knock on?

Kind of like a chip ahead but with hands, is that legal?

Definitely not legal. The ambiguity comes from the fact that you are allowed to juggle the ball as much as you like before you gain control of the ball. Here he doesn't technically have control of the ball, but at the same time the knock forward seems so deliberate that there is a case to be made for a penalty.

 

[dullonien]

Thats my feelings although a defensive scrum would most likely be given as most refs would, I guess, give it as a knock-on

Possibly. But it should be viewed as an act of deliberate unsportsmanlike behaviour, and that carries a penalty offence. Similar to accidental or deliberate offside from a knock on. Whether most ref's would award that is another matter though.

 

[lynam1104]

Saw this early and from my understanding illegal. Theres a difference between losing slight control over the ball before regathering it and effective throwing it over someones head.

 

[sifplay]

I say yes. If you throw it forward and catch it its not a knock on or anything correct? So it can't be illegal then can it?. You can even head the ball forward.

 

[dullonien]

I say yes. If you throw it forward and catch it its not a knock on or anything correct? So it can't be illegal then can it?. You can even head the ball forward.

As previously mentioned in this thread, you are not allowed to throw the ball forward and catch it. You can pass it sideways or backwards to yourself, but any deliberate throwing/knocking of the ball forwards is illegal.

I do realise that these intricate laws must make it difficult for newcomers to the sport, but they are essential to stop people just throwing the ball over the defensive line, running though (the defence wouldn't be allowed to tackle someone without the ball) and catch it the other side. It would make a mockery of the game!

I suppose you're allowed to head the ball, but trying to head a rugby ball and maintain any control would be difficult. Honestly never seen someone purposefully doing so before.

 

[sifplay]

As previously mentioned in this thread, you are not allowed to throw the ball forward and catch it. You can pass it sideways or backwards to yourself, but any deliberate throwing/knocking of the ball forwards is illegal.I do realise that these intricate laws must make it difficult for newcomers to the sport, but they are essential to stop people just throwing the ball over the defensive line, running though (the defence wouldn't be allowed to tackle someone without the ball) and catch it the other side. It would make a mockery of the game!I suppose you're allowed to head the ball, but trying to head a rugby ball and maintain any control would be difficult. Honestly never seen someone purposefully doing so before.

I would believe you if you can back up your statements with proof like the IRB laws around this issue. You have failed to look at 2 things. First off all according to law what is a throw forward? Then according to law what is considered a knock forward?

Rugby union is one of the few ball games where the ball cannot be passed forwards.That means a player moving towards the opposition's dead ball line must pass the ball to a team-mate either along or behind an imaginary line running at right angles to the side of the pitch.

Note the word "team mate" used. So Throwing it forward for yourself is not to a team mate and does not fit the criteria of a throw forward to be judges as one. Lets go on The same principle applies even when players are not passing the ball.

If they fail to catch or pick up the ball cleanly and it travels forward off a hand or arm and hits the ground or another player, it is called a knock-on.

As you can see the circumstances that must be met there is "hits the ground" or "another player"Since you throw it forward to yourself and catch it you have not knocked it on nor have thrown it forward as you did not pass it or met the requirements needed for it to be called a throw forward.