[November Tests 2016 EOYT] England vs. Argentina (26/11/2016)

[Which Tyler]

I'm assuming (although don't know for sure) that the principle now would be that if the player is already there then he's not obliged to move out of the way.
That said, I still don't really understand how so many can't judge it/time it properly.

Unless it's changed for the current season... there were a couple of times last season where a player was waiting for the ball to land on them, and they got jumped into and carded; including one where the ball bounced and the jumper was still on his way upwards at contact.
Personally I'd like to see the person who creates the dangerous situation being penalised. So in the Finn Russell case, Biggar(?) jumped into Russell's space, and was entirely at fault (IMO) and should have been penalised. Even if that means that the player being stretchered off is the one shown a red card (not a good look for the game, hence WR will never even contemplate it - can you imagine what the likes of Allyson Pollock would have to say about that?

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

Still don't understand why Marler got yellow unless it was for repeat infringements, not normally a straight yellow for that except preventing a try scoring oppertunity.

IIRC, wasn't the yellow card originally introduced to address exactly that sort of ****ly, technical "professional" action more than foul play?

If anyone's looking for a new career the two biggest growth sectors are tattoo removal and being a TMO. Games are being ruined by constant referrals and they are always going to err on the cautious side and obey the latest dictat to the letter. I also think the conversation between the ref and TMO shouldn't be broadcast. The TMO will never tell the ref he's being a prat in front of millions on TV, he will do if it's one to one.

 

[RedruthRFC]

You think it was mid-range? You could clearly see him taking aim and then falling back to cover it up - To my mind he is bloody lucky he didn't cause a worse injury.
Much as he was provoked to an extent, I can't see any justification for less than a full term on that one tbh.

Sorry, I should have made myself clearer. I meant that I think that it will be assessed as mid range, not that I think this is how it should be assessed. As I say, I believe that the citing commission will attach significance to the fact that no injury was caused and won't be too harsh on that basis.

FWIW, my gut feeling (not having studied the incident extensively) is that it should be either the high end of mid range or low end of high end. The clear intent makes it at least mid range for me as does the fact that the contact was with the head. The fact that I've seen plenty more viscous stamps in the past makes me reluctant to say that it was as bad as being high end.

 

[Pieter Steph du Teague]

Daly banned for 3 weeks. Roko to start (please not Yarde).

 

[RedruthRFC]

IIRC, wasn't the yellow card originally introduced to address exactly that sort of ****ly, technical "professional" action more than foul play?

If anyone's looking for a new career the two biggest growth sectors are tattoo removal and being a TMO. Games are being ruined by constant referrals and they are always going to err on the cautious side and obey the latest dictat to the letter. I also think the conversation between the ref and TMO shouldn't be broadcast. The TMO will never tell the ref he's being a prat in front of millions on TV, he will do if it's one to one.

That's my recollection too. I seem to remember the phrase banded about at the time was that it was for "technical or persistent infingement", not for foul play. I don't remember the ****ly bit being included - that would fall under regular foul play. IIRC it very quickly became known as "the cop out card" because it started being used as a less controversial alternative to a red card which I don't believe was the original intention.

 

[The Jones Boy]

Try playing us in Chicago where we have a 100% record!!

Ha Ha Ha
Touche'

 

[Scotty]

So eng v aus. Who will start no 8 and 14? I hope to see clifford involved on the bench and hughes start if not injured. Also would like roko over yarde. With no daly to cover from 13 to 15 if needed who will make the bench as cover? Still care teo and slade?

 

[Pieter Steph du Teague]

So eng v aus. Who will start no 8 and 14? I hope to see clifford involved on the bench and hughes start if not injured. Also would like roko over yarde. With no daly to cover from 13 to 15 if needed who will make the bench as cover? Still care teo and slade?

Would've thought Hughes as a like for like sub for Vunipola at 8, May to 11 and Roko returning at 14. Expecting nothing different on the bench. Jones had no back three cover before (Slade ended up playing FB) so I'm not sure why he'd start now.

 

[Duck a l'Orange]

Would've thought Hughes as a like for like sub for Vunipola at 8, May to 11 and Roko returning at 14. Expecting nothing different on the bench. Jones had no back three cover before (Slade ended up playing FB) so I'm not sure why he'd start now.

Slade did well for himself out of position I thought. Strange that Fiji didn't test his positioning or catching with a few bombs onto him, but he was strong in defence and not out of place in attack.

 

[Pieter Steph du Teague]

Slade did well for himself out of position I thought. Strange that Fiji didn't test his positioning or catching with a few bombs onto him, but he was strong in defence and not out of place in attack.

I don't disagree at all, I thought he did well, but I think there should be some back three cover on the bench, especially when neither of the wings really cover fullback. I'd be looking to put Slade in ahead of Te'o too. Te'o's been fine but I think Slade's done more with the opportunities he's gotten. He also covers more positions which is pretty valuable in this England side.

 

[TommiG88]

Is there going to be an England Aus thread?

 

[NickBD]

Alastair Eykyn from BBC and BT saying Yarde & Hughes in pole position to fill England wing and No8 slots.

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

Is there going to be an England Aus thread?

No, never.

Alastair Eykyn from BBC and BT saying Yarde & Hughes in pole position to fill England wing and No8 slots.

I still don't see what Yarde offers. He has the same "problems" in defence as Roko whilst having the added problem of being **** poor in front up tackling too and much much worse in attack.

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

8 is one of those positions where I'd prefer an out and out specialist. How often has Hughes started with 8 on his back?

Yarde leaves me lukewarm. Roko may have his flaws but he's a more potent attacker. Then again the Aussies are generally pretty smart at sniffing out weaknessses behind the scrum so maybe it's the right call. Maybe.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

I'd say the vast majority of Hughes game time has been at 8

Would be very disappointed to see yarde starting

 

[Aristodemus]

I don't know why people are doubting Hughes at 8. He has been quality there for Wasps. I still think we are losing a major part of what has made us successful in Binny but he will do a good job I have no doubt.

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

OK, I sit corrected on Hughes. Haven't seen too much of Pests this term.

 

[Pieter Steph du Teague]

25 Players Retained by England:
1. Vunipola, Marler
2. Hartley, George
3. Cole, Sinckler
4. Lawes, Ewels
5. Kruis, Attwood
6. Robshaw
7. Wood, Harrison
8. Hughes
9. Youngs, Care
11. May
12. Farrell, Te'o
13. Joseph, Slade
14. Rokoduguni, Yarde
15. Brown

Predicted 23:
1. Vunipola
2. Hartley
3. Cole
4. Lawes
5. Kruis
6. Robshaw
7. Wood
8. Hughes
9. Youngs
10. Ford
11. May
12. Farrell
13. Joseph
14. Rokoduguni
15. Brown

16. George
17. Marler
18. Sinckler
19. Attwood
20. Harrison
21. Care
22. Te'o
23. Slade

 

[Raggs]

OK, I sit corrected on Hughes. Haven't seen too much of Pests this term.

Hughes has played almost exclusively at 8 for Wasps for the past 3 seasons, not just this season.

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

In my mind's eye I can only see him wth a 6 on his back. Time for a lie down!