Haha,
10/10, thread of the year.
I think if his name was Colekashvili or Cole-Jones we wouldn't be having this discussion.
Poor post. I wrote my reasons above, and from that it would seem that you haven't read what I wrote at all and just the ***le of the article.
You don't actually state any occaisions or examples of a big scrummaging performance by Cole in a big knockout match or big international.
Also wrongly read my arguments as I'm just saying x is better than x. I posted the evidence above such as the Premiership final, you tell me why Cole is better?
Also you say I'm biased, which isn't the truth. I actually think the Georgian props are getting a bit overrated by the mythical standing as few people watch them that often and just know they are quite a few around the Top 14, sure they destroy weak Tier 2 scrums like Canada and USA, but at the Rugby World Cup the Georgian scrum didn't bother Scotland, England or Argentina that much.
Jgenti is the only Georgian prop who I rate as top class scrummaging wise but he has problems discipline wise on and off the pitch, Zirakashvili is on the level below and is a good prop but not in the top tier, Kakovin is good but not in the top tier. Kubriashvili seems to have gone backwards since keeping Hayman out of the Toulon team. Nariashvili and Zhvania are still just prospects.
Accusing me of Welsh bias, is also just a cheap way of skipping the debate and failing to actually say why you think Cole is the best in the world.
Sorry Duck, but he is one of the best in the world. I don't think there is a clear 'best tighthead in the world', instead there are a number that are there or thereabouts.
Dan Cole may not be the best scrummaging tighthead in the world (I'd say that is Adam Jones), but he's still extremely strong in this area. He may not be the best carrying tighthead, but he's none too shabby. He is the best tighthead when it comes to the breakdown though. Add these together and you end up with a damn fine all rounded tighthead prop. At the age of just 25, that is quite incredible.
I agree, and I also said he is a very good prop in the OP, just not the best in the world, although I think he may well be by 2015. Just nobody actually read the OP is seems.
I also think your second paragraph sums it perfectly imo as well. Cole isn't the top scrummager, or ball carrier compared to the top props in those areas, but does do a fair amount of unglamorous hard work than some other tightheads don't.
This might be a shock to some few Welsh fans - but we don't all think Wales is the best team in the world. It's a matter of opinion. For example, in my opinion, Healy > Jenkins, Hartley > Hibbard, Ferris > Lydiate, Kearney > Halfpenny, Cole > Jones.
Emphasis on opinion.
You can't ridicule someone for thinking he's the best and then turn around and say 'oh but Adam Jones is the best'.
You're bringing up previous achievements of Jones, but guess what, players get old. I could say O'Driscoll is so much better than Davies, just look at his career. But I can't.
No Welsh fan has claimed that the team is the best in the world. It's Irish/English fans saying that Welsh fans claim this.
You also obviously haven't read the post, I didn't just simply say "x is better than x" as some people are portraying, I gave reasons and evidence. Also I brought up the Wales scrum getting on top of England as recently as 2012. So it's hardly as if I'm resting on an achievement from 2007 or something.
Only the most one eyed Welsh fan would claim all those Welsh players are first choice for the Lions.
Healy is easily ahead of Jenkins at the moment, because Jenkins' form has dropped to a level it has never done so in the past. Most Welsh fans I know have Paul James ahead of Jenkins as well, and given the lack of game time Jenkins is getting at Toulon, I don't see that changing before the Lions tour.
Hibbard hasn't cemented himself as Wales' first choice hooker yet, mainly due to unfortunate injuries. Not a fan of Heartley at all though, he's just as likely to cost us a test due to his thuggish nature as he is to have a good tour. Best is still my no.1, but even his form has dipped a little.
Both Ferris and Lydiate are injured at the moment. No guarantee how either will play after returning. I see no problem for Welsh fans to consider Lydiate ahead of Ferris though after having an absolutely barnstorming 2011-12, including being named 6 nations player of the tournament despite missing the first game. Both are excellent players, and I'd be happy with either, yet neither are guaranteed a place on the plane yet.
Halfpenny has been exceptional in everything he does for Wales in pretty much every single one of his 39 caps. Wales best player last season by quite some distance (Lydiate missed the second-half). He may be still developing his attacking game from fullback, but every other aspect of his play is very good. Kearney and Foden, as well as a few others are up there with him.
As for the Jones v Cole situation, it depends on what the management want to do. If they want to apply maximum pressure on Aus in the scrums, expect Jones to start. If they see Cole as someone that can help out the back-row to counter Pocock etc. at the breakdown maybe Cole will be selected. It is worth remembering that although Jones doesn't turn ball over, his job at the breakdown is to clear out, and he does this very effectively. Adam Jones is all about tight play, he excels in the scrums, at fringe defence and at clearing out rucks. It may not be as exciting as seeing Cole turn over ball, but it can be just as important, especially if you have a genuine 7 to do the turn-over work.
Another well reasoned post Dullonien. You seem to be one of the few who are actually debating and giving reasons, rather than those who just want to accuse of bias and give no reasons or logic to their thinking, and wishing to turn this into another ridiculous Halfpenny/Foden/Kearney debate that hijacked the Welsh thread.
I'm sure it was a Halfpenny foden thread, english getting all up in your grill, I put the first thing about Kearney in jest.
Just to think the other day we where all agreeing on the stamping thread, can't we all just make love and peace?
P.S Cole is a decent player and I am clueless when it comes to scrum play so all I will say is he is decent in the loose, something Jones isn't quite as good at nowadays
Jones has actually got better not worse in the loose these days actually. When Jones was Cole's age he was carrying too much weight, but it was (and he himself points this out) in 2008 when Gatland took over that he changed his attitude about fitness and now he actually makes more tackles/hits more rucks than he used to, as well as improving his scrummaging.