Question for the Kiwi posters

Discussion in 'Rugby World Cup 2019' started by BobbyM, Oct 30, 2019.

  1. Jabby

    Jabby First XV

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    and thats not true...you know we didn't have apartheid here aye...the first NZ national team toured NSW in 1884 and had two Maori players, Jack Taiaroa (Ngāi Tahu) and Joe Warbrick (Te Arawa)

    and you must be must smarted then i, you've lost me on the Read not leading the Haka...you deliberately make a false comparison?
     
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  3. OneBlackEye

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    Also don't some of your collage footballs teams do the haka? You guys seem to love it in the videos I've seen.

    No cringing at all.

    Except from everyone else.
     
  4. OneBlackEye

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    Also does it make you cringe to see non Maori New Zealanders sing our national anthem?
     
  5. Jabby

    Jabby First XV

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    people seem to struggle with the idea of embracing and respecting a culture that might not be inherently theirs

    the way i see it, there are certain parts of traditionally Maori culture that have transcended, they have become part of NZ culture in general, i'm not going to go out and get a Ta Moko but i'm happy to talk about getting some Kai, I've partaken in several Hungi both on Marae and off, i'll drop the odd Kea ora and when representing my high school, doing my high schools Haka, doesn't mean i'm claiming to be Maori, but i see those thing and lots more and being part of the world i grew up in
     
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  6. Jabby

    Jabby First XV

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  7. mania

    mania First XV

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    as an aside. this is typical worldRugby BS.

    so the richest tier 1 nation , ie England get fined 4 figures. wow big fkn deal. this is fining the whole team.
    but when Samoa got fined for a non sanctioned mouth guard in 2011 they got fined 5 figures. this is for individual players.

    dont worry i know no one gives a fk about tier2 nations least of all Samoa. just pointing out how worldRugby looks after its tier1's
     
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  8. ragerancher

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    There doesn't seem to be a huge amount of consistency here. The English response to the haka is supposedly not offensive as it is accepting the challenge and yet at Twickers when the fans join in singing Swing Low, which is our trademark response, almost every time we hear about how we are disrespecting the haka by singing over it.

    I wish New Zealanders could decide whether the haka is a challenge to be met or some holy ritual that must be met with the upmost reverence and treated the same way as the anthem.

    I also suspect that had England lost the game we would be hearing far more about how their response was disrespectful.
     
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  9. Jabby

    Jabby First XV

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    once again though when ive seen stuff like that it seemed to be journo's (using the term lightly) trying to drum up clicks...like there was an article people were referring too earlier in the WC but when you read through the Journo admitted they hadn't talked to any Maori or even NZ's and just assumed they would be offended
     
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  10. Zapphod

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    I agree, it seems when people talk about Maori and non-Maori they are focusing solely on skin colour and the problem with that is that it gives a false impression.
    There are very few if any New Zealanders with family going back to even the WW2 era who aren't at least part Maori.

    Funny however that we both use the Haka as a drinks break.
    :)
     
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  11. OneBlackEye

    OneBlackEye Academy Player

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    I don't even know where to start here.

    First of all, New Zealanders aren't going to all decide on anything about anything. Just like anywhere else you're going to find all different views and **** journalism.

    You can read whatever view you want on the internet and like most people you're probably pretty good at remembering the things that confirm what you want to believe. You probably like the idea of New Zealanders getting all upset about these things so take note of every YouTube comment and click bait article that suits you.

    I certainly don't know any kiwis that get upset about haka responses and most love any kind of response. Feel free to disregard that in favor of a NZ herald article you read that time though.

    Also why do you suspect it would be worse if NZ won? That doesn't even make sense. It's like you're disappointed NZ weren't sore losers so created another universe where they are sore winners.

    And since you brought it up. And I'm saying I don't think singing at Twickenham OR standing in a V is disrespectful. Surely even you can see the difference between the fans singing over it and the actual team doing something themselves in response? Save the "OMG guys make up your minds".
     
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  12. TRF_heineken

    TRF_heineken RIP #J9

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    Don't read too much into the journalism crap. When the AB's do the haka in SA, we sing Ole Ole Ole trying to mute the Haka. And the best part is that WR can't do anything about the fans singing in the stands.

    I also love it when the teams do some sort of challenge, but for me it shouldn't happen every game, because then that too will become old very quickly, and then that will make it boring.
     
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  13. ragerancher

    ragerancher First XV

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    Wow you certainly read a lot into that. Bit hypocritical to say I'm assuming all these things when you decide to tell me what I think...
     
  14. Cooper

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    Kia ora mate! I have similar heritage, my Dad is Scottish and Mum is Maori, I was born in New Zealand. I'm very proud and value both sides of my heritage and in particular my Maori heritage. Mum's side of the family (Iwi) has it's own Haka and Marae/Pa (shared house) and perform it for guests routinely. It's a welcoming and challenge.

    What the English did was in no way disrespectful, they met the challenge and I thought in a very classy way. WR are being petty fining them, but rules are rules. The V was really cool and classy, no offense was taken and none should be, anyone saying otherwise is being a bit precious.
     
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  15. Cooper

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    What I've noticed about the Haka in some games, is the energy it produced can be deflected back in our face. I felt the English response to the Haka put the sh*ts up us a little and got the blood flowing for the English more and you saw the start they got off to! Similar to the French in 2011, opposition can use the Haka energy in their favour if they come up with a good response to it.
     
  16. Cooper

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    Sorry mate, but this is flat out BS, barely anyone thinks this way in NZ.
     
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  17. ragerancher

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    Well it's good to hear that, means that those who have acted like it's offensive are doing so because they are getting offended on someone else's behalf.
     
  18. OneBlackEye

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    Fine. Im sorry I assumed that.
     
  19. mania

    mania First XV

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    https://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/rugby...ones-calls-for-all-blacks-to-scrap-bogus-haka

    i think ABs should stop doing the haka in europe. if its so controversial then those countries that complain about it ABs should just not do it there. save it for special occasions and countries
    i like kirwans article on it and in it he states that its only since the 80's that the haka has been done before every game. before then it was on rare occasions , like the last game of the tour.
     
  20. 40/20

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    Absolutely. And where they are doing that, they're massively ill informed anyway. The wider local opinion has been almost universally positive.

    But unfortunately, what passes for "journalism" these days seems to be just regurgitating some social media mutterings and then presenting that as a representative view to generate clicks. Don't fall for that rubbish.

    Personally, I loved the English response. Not only entirely appropriate, but tactically very smart too.

    The All Blacks will never admit it, but that threw them IMO. Dunno if anyone else noticed, but when the team was doing the haka, many of them were looking around, trying to eyeball an English player on the edges, whereas normally its just eyes focused forward where the opposition usually stand. Their normal routine was out and as we always hear, good preparation is all about routine. Mentally, they were forced into doing something different. Compare that to the composure of the English boys during that time... they knew what they were going to do and had already mentally prepared for it.

    Fast forward into the game itself and that was my overriding impression. Their composure. Even after scoring points, the celebrations were muted which was picked up in local commentary by Scotty Stevenson as well.

    Eddie and Farrell played a very, very smart game and it all started with their response to the challenge. It may only seem a small thing, but when we hear about small percentages often being the difference, I'm absolutely convinced it had an impact.
     
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  21. Rinkadink

    Rinkadink Bench Player

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    What country has complained about it though? Seems like it just SJ from the article. NZ Herald + Stuff NZ are poor media outlets, need to go in the bin alongside Wales Online and the like.

    Everyone I know in the UK loves the Haka, the complaint a fair few have is that teams are limited in their response to it which is very different and not aimed at NZ but rather governing body.
     
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