watch out for india in rugby

[187]

well, alot could happen in 20yrs and yes they may take a turn for the worst. i think there'll be only 3 or 4 tier 1 teams but the tier 2 teams will grow and grow with occassional tier 2 team breaking into tier 1 every so often but then dropping back down..

as for india.. i used to have this indian guy in my rugby team back at school, he played openside. skinny as hell but he was an awesome defender for his size. shaan mgaan.. i think that's how u spell his name.. don't tell me that's a pakistani name! haha

 

[Prestwick]

Well you're talking about nations of small populations but with moderately high levels of investment falling into obscurity due to mismanagement, lack of financial investment and a general inability to keep up with bigger nations who can throw more money at the 'problem'

The reason why Ireland can at least keep up these days? They're not in a state of low-level civil war all the time like in Wales or Scotland. They're more shrewd and prudent on how they invest their limited cash and they make sure they nurture and protect their stars (i.e. keep em' at home and keep em' contracted to the IRFU).

Nations like Japan, India, China & America are different kettles of fish. First of all, they each have huge populations and secondly they have huge pots of money to go around for all sports. In Japan, Rugby may be the 4th biggest sport after Baseball, Sumo & Dive ball, but because of the way that the teams are organised (all of them are corporates), they can afford facilities for team training, etc which would match the average GP club. Splashing out millions on running a rugby club to the likes of Toyota or Yamaha is small change considering the hundreds of millions they plough into R&D for the latest car (or piano) so when you look at it, the likes of Japan are already keeping pace with the likes of England's clubs or New Zealand's provinces. Don't forget also that Japan has the 4th largest number of registered Rugby players in the world too. About 125,000 players or something like that.

America is a similar case. They don't need to become the "biggest sport" to be huge. The players are coming from College out of those who couldn't make the NFL draft and if Rugby in America even got a fraction of the cash that the NFL has then it could easy develop at a pace that would outstrip even that of New Zealand. If the yanks want to do something, they'll do it, dancing kidnapped Pacific Islanders clad in black be damned they'll do it! And considering the team that the yanks are putting together (for example, the guy who negotiated the huge Adidas sponsorship & merchandising package for the All Blacks has joined Team USA as well as getting Nigel Melville on board too).

In the end, I wouldn't be too rash to dismiss those who are bigger than you who to them, your average national funding level for the sport is small change.

 

[Caledfwlch]

i'd like to see Punjabi MC's Mundian To Bach Ke as India's run-on theme. now that is something to combat cricket

 

[feicarsinn]

india have something like 15000 players i think

 

[Canadian_Rugby_Guy]

how about them canucks eh? Nah all we got is Tim Horton's. f***ing timbits.

 

[Hamster]

Haha India, maybe they might want to keep imrpoving there cricket after what happened in the 07 wc..

Maybe if big blokes like that guy in the longest yard can play rugby for INdia, they might smash teams ranked 20-30 haha

Nah seriously, great to see rugby is getting better known to India, I hope they do well.

Did you know USA won the gold medal in 1900 for rugby? Or somewhere around then. I think they were ranked no.1 in the world or something, it was big there.. but then some idiot ran off and decided to have American football and the crowd followed him, ****** me off hearing that.. It would be AWESOME... if America was a rugby country and NFL never existed, same goes if it was a cricket country.

 

[shtove]

India's national team came to England a couple of years ago, and I was talking about the tour with a Pakistani - he just laughed at the idea of Indians playing a man's game. A bit of muslim-hindu mockery. Touchy subject, so I ordered another pint.

I didn't follow the tour, and assumed it was a squad from the Indian army following the "garrison game" tradition. That's the way rugby grew in Ireland.

I don't see much hope for Japan or China, unless they bring in Pacific Islanders for their front fives and lineouts. But India could be interesting. Might even bring the country together, like SA ... I'm not placing any bets.

And good luck to Nigel Melville in the US. Maybe they'll cop on one day and play proper sports.

 

[Prestwick]

Shtove, haven't you seen "Goodness Gracious Me" and the song entitled "blame it on the Hindus/Muslims" done to the tune of Micheal Jackson's "blame it on the boogie."

There has always been a very very subtle thing between Hindus, Muslims and Sikhs in India. Its best to just nod and order another pint, they're not like us Brits Shtove, you just can't start gibbering on about this and that atrocity or something which could get them hot under the collar. So, on reflection, choosing discretion as the better part of valour was the right choice

I disagree about your pessimistic view on Japan or China. Japan has been expanding the game at a rapid pace, as all the teams are corporate owned, they have lavish funding and financial security that only we could dream of. People have got to get past this concept of Japanese and Chinese people being tiny midgets that go "BANZAI!" and then promptly commit suicide by ramming the USS Missouri or something. If you see Sumo live, you know that the Japs can quite happily produce big guys who can hit hard, it is possible and give it ten odd years they might be nudging to take England's place in the top ten *desolate sigh*.

I would expect the game in India grew much like how Cricket grew in India, just by it being imported and then catching on with the locals. Rugby as a "Garrison game" only really happened in Ireland, elsewhere it were either imported or exhibited via visiting Royal Navy parties. Argentina for example first got a taste of rugby thanks to regular visiting Royal Navy survey ships followed rapidly by the Welsh settlers moving into the country. Paraguay and Uruguay first got a taste of rugby in a similar fashion thanks to the Royal Navy.

 

[shtove]

Shtove, haven't you seen "Goodness Gracious Me" and the song entitled "blame it on the Hindus/Muslims" done to the tune of Micheal Jackson's "blame it on the boogie."[/b]

I wrote that song. Still waiting on the royalties.

I disagree about your pessimistic view on Japan or China. Japan has been expanding the game at a rapid pace, as all the teams are corporate owned, they have lavish funding and financial security that only we could dream of. People have got to get past this concept of Japanese and Chinese people being tiny midgets that go "BANZAI!" and then promptly commit suicide by ramming the USS Missouri or something . If you see Sumo live, you know that the Japs can quite happily produce big guys who can hit hard, it is possible and give it ten odd years they might be nudging to take England's place in the top ten *desolate sigh*.[/b]

Well, I know squat about this subject. But aren't all the really big, tall sumo guys from the Pacific Islands? A bit like those big line-breakers who turn up in NZ. But then, isn't Kevin (Irish name) Mealamu basically Japanese?

And, uuuuh ... England are a seriously good bet for RWC 07. All you have to do is scrape past SA.

I would expect the game in India grew much like how Cricket grew in India, just by it being imported and then catching on with the locals. Rugby as a "Garrison game" only really happened in Ireland, elsewhere it were either imported or exhibited via visiting Royal Navy parties. Argentina for example first got a taste of rugby thanks to regular visiting Royal Navy survey ships followed rapidly by the Welsh settlers moving into the country. Paraguay and Uruguay first got a taste of rugby in a similar fashion thanks to the Royal Navy. [/b]

The Welsh are responsible for Arg rugby? I just got a little bit more relaxed about Pool Death in RWC 07. Thanks.

Cricket is unique and imponderable. Can't be compared to other stuff.

 

[BigTen]

"...Well, I know squat about this subject. But aren't all the really big, tall sumo guys from the Pacific Islands? A bit like those big line-breakers who turn up in NZ. But then, isn't Kevin (Irish name) Mealamu basically Japanese?..." shtove.

Er <nervous cough> you do realise that Mealamu's first name isn't Kevin, right!?

Maybe you could check out this link to spot your mistake.

http://www.rugbymuseum.co.nz/ABProfilee.as...C&IDID=1029

It also tells you in which country Mealamu was born so that will answer your question in relation to what nationality he is.

 

[Prestwick]

But aren't all the really big, tall sumo guys from the Pacific Islands? A bit like those big line-breakers who turn up in NZ. But then, isn't Kevin (Irish name) Mealamu basically Japanese? [/b]

Well not all of them, the best guy is apparently Mongolian but the Japanese have some excellent Sumo wrestlers too.

And, uuuuh ... England are a seriously good bet for RWC 07. All you have to do is scrape past SA.[/b]

We're dooomed I say, dooooooooomed! :cryy: Avenge our deaths Ireland!

The Welsh are responsible for Arg rugby? I just got a little bit more relaxed about Pool Death in RWC 07. Thanks.[/b]

You're welcome Anything I can do to put your mind at ease :lol:

 

[stalefish1]

i reckon in a couple of years, India could develop to be a rugby nation as good as Canada or Portugal. i say that because obviously they're not going to shoot up to the top tiers of internation rankings, but i saw highlights of their game against Chad, i think it was, and they looked pretty good for a fledgling nation. it's encouraging to see so many young nations like Georgia, Portugal, Russia, Spain, India, Austria and other countries beginning to pick up on the international scene, and of course, this will only improve the game.

 

[shtove]

"...Well, I know squat about this subject. But aren't all the really big, tall sumo guys from the Pacific Islands? A bit like those big line-breakers who turn up in NZ. But then, isn't Kevin (Irish name) Mealamu basically Japanese?..." shtove.

Er <nervous cough> you do realise that Mealamu's first name isn't Kevin, right!?

Maybe you could check out this link to spot your mistake.

http://www.rugbymuseum.co.nz/ABProfilee.as...C&IDID=1029

It also tells you in which country Mealamu was born so that will answer your question in relation to what nationality he is. [/b]

Thanks for the link. Is Keven different from Kevin?

As for place of birth, he still looks Japanese.

 

[Prestwick]

Well, allot of the foreign born players who play for Japan may indeed play for Japan, they are not actually..er..Japanese if you get my drift. You can't gain full Japanese citizenship unless both of your birth parents are of direct Japanese descent. That is why there are millions of Japanese-Koreans living in Japan with no citizenship, only work permits.

 

[DC]

isnt their fly half like some big white guy or something?

 

[Prestwick]

I don't think it is that bad, but at best, that big white guy will only have a work permit.

 

[mj44]

plus you guys have a huge population and a lot of players to choose from eventually!

hmm china, usa, india the big three of the future? [/b]

Flawed theory. Like I said in another thread, population doesn't always produce quality, despite the fact that in theory a larger pool should a huge advantage. Look the kiwi's. They have a smaller pool of players than most other countries, even though rugby may not be the dominant sport in other countries. In Australia our talent is spread over more codes. The kiwi's perform better than other nations despite having less resources and a smaller pool of players.

USA, do they dominate baseball? No. Do they dominate basketball? They are definitely the number one basketball nation, but given their culture and player pool they are huge underachievers.

How about Australian cricket versus cricket in countries like India and Pakistan? They swarf the aussie population and take the sport more seriously than the aussies yet the aussies are consistently the best in the world?

How about soccer? A nation like brazil should clearly dominate. They are soccer crazy, the players there are hungry and they have such a large population. Yet countries like Germany, France, the Uk, Italy and even the smaller european nations are very competitive.

How about Fiji in rugby? Despite poor resources and an extremely small player pool they can achieve respectable scorelines with the top teams in the world. They also compete/flog nations with much larger player pools and infinitely more resources.

You're also ignoring the fact that rugby will never be the dominant sport in those countries, so the player pools are actually much smaller than you would think. Especially in the case of the US where rugby would be a winter sport and compete against nfl, nba, college basketball and college football, and nhl to some extent. The athletes will go to where the money is and in the US it is american football, basketball and baseball. Rugby will NEVER be able to compete with the salary levels of those sports.

It takes more than population to make a competitive international team.

 

[TRUE LEGND]

As for place of birth, he still looks Japanese.
[/b]

Is Keven different from Kevin? If you think about it, B.O.D looks dutch to us

 

[shtove]

<div class='quotemain'>
As for place of birth, he still looks Japanese.
[/b]

Is Keven different from Kevin? If you think about it, B.O.D looks dutch to us [/b][/quote]

Sorry, mate - not trying to step on anyone's toes. I guess Keven is just a different spelling of Kevin - or is it a Maori name? And Mealamu has to have some Japanese blood in him. Europe is really mixed racially - we have our types, but a lot of the time you can't really tell a Greek from a Finn from a Dutchman from a Spaniard ...

 

[rugbyindianmaniac]

Finally I see a thread that appreciated indian rugby, I love this site