All Blacks vs Springboks, July 10th 2010

[Seaton]

Well for starters, the tri-Nations start when the NH season finishes, so if one has a problem with fatigue now, imagine 2 straight seasons without a significant break.

Also, the more players that stay here (in particular the Stars and young players), the higher the level of rugby that is played by the domestic sides, which produces better players.

I will use Scottish football as an example
Scottish players went south to earn more money, the ease in which they could leave meant there were no quality and experienced players to 'tutor' the youth players, and the standard of play in Scotland dropped significantly.
Most older people would say that the Scottish teams of the 80s were far stronger than what we have now.
This obviously has lead to a meltdown of the national team.

It would be folly to select NH based players, because then the SA based players would be more inclined to go, but they wouldn't go so easely if they wouldn't be considered for the national team.
This applies to every major SH country (bar Argentina), and look how it has worked for them

 

[alex]

so the south africans, aussies, and us kiwis (and by us, i mean the all blacks) have to choose between pride(Allblacks) or money(NH club rugby)

 

[TRF_Ezequiel]

I would choose pride because I doubt that the rugby players of S14 clubs get paid minimum wages

 

[TRF_Ezequiel]

Well for starters, the tri-Nations start when the NH season finishes, so if one has a problem with fatigue now, imagine 2 straight seasons without a significant break.

I don't see the problem. It's not like the Tri-Nations is a 6 month tournament. The NH season finishes at the end of may and the Tri-Nations starts 10th of July. That's 6 weeks you get to rest.

There are football players that have less time to recover before playing the World Cup and afterwards returning to their club.

It's not impossible to play in a NH league and participate in the Tri-Nations

 

[Seaton]

I don't see the problem. It's not like the Tri-Nations is a 6 month tournament. The NH season finishes at the end of may and the Tri-Nations starts 10th of July. That's 6 weeks you get to rest.

There are football players that have less time to recover before playing the World Cup and afterwards returning to their club.

It's not impossible to play in a NH league and participate in the Tri-Nations

Aye, but football is nowhere near as demanding as rugby, and that happens only every 2 years (Euro Championships included), where as we are talking about a year on year basis, and you have not factored in the June Tests, and to add to that as soon as the Tri-Nations ends its back to club rugby in the North, with no break in between.

The only reason, I feel, that CJ and James (not sure about BJ) were able to be selected was because they have only played half a season or so

 

[Conal]

bj botha played the entire season for ulster andhas been fantastic at scrum time
mabey his scrumming abilities are just too good to ignore

 

[Amobokoboko]

Well the thing is that every player has to make his own decision, play in a very good competition with a chance to get the national jersey or play overseas for a phat contract in a minor competition.
When looking at S14 -S15 ( next year) you can't say that the level of rugby is low, the top 4 rugby countries are being represented and this is an ideal training ground to prepare your squad for the WC.
There is no logic in letting your good players go overseas, let them sit on the bench or play against weaker teams and then give him a spot in the national squad, those players will have lost some of their magic.

But you're making a good point.

 

[Seaton]

bj botha played the entire season for ulster andhas been fantastic at scrum time
mabey his scrumming abilities are just too good to ignore

Maybe thats why he hasn't been playing for the Boks in these internationals? Or at least not starting

If I had money to bet, this is what I would bet it on being the starting XV (the bench is dependant on what split he wants to go on)

1. Steenkamp
2. Smit
3. Jannie
4. Russouw
5. Matfield
6. Burger
7. Louw
8. Spies

9. Januarie
10. Steyn
11. Habana
12. de Villiers
13. Fourie
14. Aplon
15. Kirchner

16. Chiliboy
17. CJ (seeing as he can play both sides)
18. Bakkies
19. Potgeiter
20. Houggard
21. Juan de Jongh
22. Pienaar

Prediction: A South African to get cited, a lot of collapsing scrums, and after match death threats for Zane Kirchner

 

[TRF_Ezequiel]

Although I am a Sharks-fan I have to admit I can really enjoy Morne Steyn's play for the Springboks. He is maybe even a better kick-taker than Percy. That Tri-Nations match last year against the All Blacks where he scored all 31 points for the Boks. I believe that was a new record.

A week later he scored another 24 points against the Aussies. Unbelievable. I really hope he can regain that form he had back then

 

[Feicarsinn]

How good is this Aplon character? didn't really watch much Super 14 this year so I'm a bit out of the loop. Is he going to ask any major questions of the All Black defence and does he have a decent amount of stability to the rest of his game?

 

[TRF_Ezequiel]

Aplon really surprised me in the games against Wales and France. I think that, together with Habana, he's the biggest threat to worry about on the sides for the All Blacks. He's very quick off his feet and a good sub for JP Pietersen

 

[Seaton]

Problem with Aplon, is that just one solid hit will do him in

In the last league game of the S14, Bakkies Botha went into clean a ruck, in pretty much the same way as last year against the Lions
Anyways, his head hit Aplons head (and despite wearing a scrum cap) and it took a few minutes to get up.

Perhaps the only reason he is so quick and elusive, is because he fears for his very life every time a forward so much as looks at him.

 

[User1245]

That was a cheat shot from Bakkies. Came in from the side with the intension of hurting Aplon, got him more on the neck than the head.

Remember Aplon is a Kaapie, those okes are tough as nails!

 

[Boggle]

Aplon is a great player, has been for a number of years and I've been waiting to see when he might get a call up for the boks since about 2006 or so.

He's really impressed as a Springbok so far too, definitely would have him ahead of JP at the moment, until JP regains the form he had, seems so long ago I can't really remember when he lost it.

He did great against France, scoring a try by simply shouldering off the French center, which is impressive considering how small he is.



He scored 2 tries in that game, so it should contain some highlights of him.

 

[Darwin]

I am quite confident the AB's will win this game - we have had a much better form in our warm-ups this year than last year. Most importantly Dan Carter is back, and in great form.
I would pick a team along the lines of:

Woodcock
Mealamu
O Franks
Thorn
Donnelly
Kaino
McCaw
Read
Cowan
Carter
Rococoko
Nonu
Smith
Jane
Muliaina

Flynn
B Franks
Boric
Vito
Weepu
Cruden
Kahui/Ranger

The only really debatable starting position in my mind is who to start alongside Thorn at lock - I'd be happy with either Boric or Donnelly. I'm assuming Nonu will get some gametime this week at club level, otherwise he may well be eased back into the team from the bench (with Stanley starting). The outside back spot on the bench is between Kahui and Ranger - Kahui has been in great form over the last few tests, but I do like the idea of Ranger running against tired defenses with 20 mins to go.

 

[Teh Mite]

Tri-Nations heads to Soweto

http://www.planetrugby.com/story/0,25883,3551_6241529,00.html

Soccer City, the vast cauldron developed for the soccer World Cup Final in two weeks, is set to be used for a Tri-Nations match in August.

It will be a significant event in South Africa's history as the stadium is in Soweto, a symbolic township of the apartheid regime, while rugby is historically a 'white' sport. Indeed, in parts of the country, locals still support the All Blacks as opposed to the Boks for historical reasons.

In that regard, it's not insignificant that the match against the All Blacks on August 21 is the one likely to head to the 97,000-capacity Soccer City, relocated from Ellis Park.

The South African Rugby Union (SARU) is expected to announce the venue change next week, though it is already common knowledge as All Blacks coach Graham Henry inadvertently confirmed on Friday.

When asked about the possibility of the match being played at Soccer City at a media conference in Auckland, Henry said "Yeah, that's official isn't it?" before turning to his media liaison officer, who said it was not official.

Henry quickly said "No, I'm not allowed to say that, no, it's only speculation that we're playing in a station that holds 97,000. Gee, that would be great wouldn't it? I can't wait."

The move follows the successful hosting of the Bulls' Super 14 semi-final and final in Soweto's smaller Orlando Stadium in May after Loftus Versfeld was handed over to the round-ball game.

 

[nickdnz]

It will be a pretty awsome atmosphare, especially if the AB's get a bit of support from the fans. I can't see that happening though.

 

[TRF_Ezequiel]

Bok coach Peter de Villiers got thrown a few curve balls this week - on the selection of Ricky and Chiliboy as well as management of players leading up to RWC 2011.

Question:How is it possible for Ricky January & Chilliboy Ralapella to be playing for the Springboks if they are not even starting for their Provinces in Super 14 rugby? Justin le Roux

Peter replies: I do not pick the Vodacom Super 14 sides but I certainly believe that these two players have something to offer us and they have shown it in the Test matches to date. Ricky was the man of the match against Wales and Chiliboy is clearly reaping the benefits of his decision to play Vodacom Cup rugby this season as part of his extended injury recovery and conditioning programme. Well done to the Vodacom Blue Bulls on their role in this. There were other questions about Ricky from James Pitout, Peter L'Estrange and Sarah Boomgard which I cannot reply to individually, except to say that I know what I have in Ricky and I know what he is capable of. With Fourie du Preez not available you need the experience of a player who has "been there before" in a Vodacom Tri-Nations campaign.


Question:I would like to hear your view on how a player like Chilliboy, who is so talented and is proving himself on the international arena, can be a B player at his province? Why can't we get the best players in every position spread across the provinces, so as to allow them game time? Your biggest fan, Zola Mkumla

Peter replies: Zola, it is so refreshing to have a question asked from an alternative viewpoint. Well done! As national coach I would love to see this, but this is not an ideal world and whilst we have a good working relationship with the Super Rugby franchises and coaches we have to be mindful that they have their own unique challenges. We are so fortunate to have so many talented players in our country but only 22 places to fill in a Springbok squad!

Question:I know you are experimenting at the moment but I am concerned about the team gelling before the Tri-Nations. Are we not worried about the Tri-Nations but rather the World Cup Next year. Lionel Dreyer

Peter replies: I would not call it experimenting but rather making use of every opportunity that is available to us between now and the World Cup to evaluate and monitor each and every player who could be part of the World Cup squad next year. This year's Vodacom Tri-Nations is much more important than next year's as we play two matches in New Zealand and they are in places where we will play World Cup matches. The end-of season tour this year is also vital to our preparations. We are taking things step-by-step with the goal of making sure our top players are fit and available at the World Cup next year.

Question:My question is regarding the management of players leading up to the RWC 2011. Are the Super franchise coaches and you guys on the same page when it comes to player management and does the Bok management have any say in resting players during the Super 15 ? Dan Jardine

Peter replies: Dan, we are very much on the same page. In fact, the Springbok medical team met recently with its Super 15 counterparts to plan the way ahead for the country's leading rugby players in the lead up next year's World Cup. The main purpose of the session was to discuss the management of players in both International and national competition over the coming months with the ultimate goal of having a fit and full strength squad at the 2011 World Cup.

Questionlease let us know when you will put the (petty) personal issues aside and select the best fullback talent we have had in years. Frans (Steyn) is the most talented player since Naas Botha, but you let your personal feelings get in the way of us winning the 3N and the WC. You are supposedly to be objective, clearly not. Dawid Louw

Peter replies: Dawid, I am glad you asked that question. Thanks to Steven Hapelt, Gerrit Conradie, Mandy Kotze, Simon Clements and Jacques Harmse too for asking about Frans. There are no problems between Frans and I and I certainly do not have "petty" issues with him. I will never deny any player the opportunity of playing for his country. The truth is that Frans was only available for the Wales Test. Further discussion is needed with his club and agent about future availability and this is being dealt with presently. You have fallen for the perception created in the media that there may be issues between myself and the player which is untrue.


source: sarugby.co.za

 

[nickdnz]

To be honest, those answers were the best he's ever given on any subject. I supose when he has time to think about what he says, it helps. My respect has gone up a little bit for him as a public figure.

 

[TRF_Ezequiel]

His answer to the Steyn-question is completely ridiculous