Australia v South Africa

[feicarsinn]

Jeez Oz look very poor.

 

[DNAPlay]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (smartcooky @ Aug 30 2009, 12:24 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

This is all over bar the shouting. Its going to turn into a real hiding if the Wobblies aren't careful

A bonus point win to South Africa puts them on 17 points

Best New Zealand can do is 18 (two 4-try bonus point wins). That means South Africa would have to lose their last two games by more than 7.

Ain't gonna happen, might just as well hand them the trophy now.

This shows up the stupidity of the current format where everyone plays everyone else three times. It virtually over and were only 3/4 of the way through the competition. The remaining matches will be meaningless dead rubbers.

Roll on Argentina joining this comp.[/b]

Agreed 100%

 

[Flux]

Australia have been poor, but so has Bryce Lawrence.

 

[Boggle]

Funny how nobody mentions how good the Boks were today, or the running game they played.

Meh.

 

[DNAPlay]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Boggle @ Aug 30 2009, 01:42 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

Funny how nobody mentions how good the Boks were today, or the running game they played.

Meh.[/b]

Good point. Boks were fanf***ingtastic.

Although what is Gary Gold doing there? Our scrum is shite.

 

[shtove]

I reckon Aus will turn in to a very good team, they just have to cut out the stupid mistakes in handling, contact, lineout ... everything!

Seriously, they do look much more inventive than the Boks and will be able to mix it up when they get a rhythm going, especially if the offloads come in the tackles. Mind you, very hard to do that against a smother defence and backrow like the Boks have.

First two tries were down to AAC - turned his back on penalty + went AWOL on Fourie.

Commentators tried to convince everyone that the Saffers had shown their running game. Uuuuh ... nope. Some nice set piece stuff when they get in to the 22, but still no clue in midfield attack and enough with the garryowens.

I noticed the ref was on about "intiring" from the side at rucks.

 

[smartcooky]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Flux @ Aug 29 2009, 11:39 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

Australia have been poor[/b]

Agree

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Flux @ Aug 29 2009, 11:39 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

but so has Bryce Lawrence.[/b]

Disagree. He was consistent, he made very few mistakes, and he explained his decisions clearly

Additionally, was VERY strict on the 10m Law, making sure that players ahead of the kick did NOT advance at all until put onside by an advancing onside team-mate. I wish more referees would do this.

He also outright told that yappy little prick Luke Burgess to shut his trap. Telling a scrumhalf to shut up can only be a good thing.

 

[gingergenius]

ouch. thank god we're playing australia this autumn. thank god we're not playing south africa.

 

[Wazimba2K]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Wally @ Aug 27 2009, 05:11 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (shtove @ Aug 28 2009, 11:46 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Problem I saw with Genia last week was the way he directed play in the last few minutes, when Aus should have been setting up for a winning DG. He went to the touchlines, instead of funneling the ball to the midfield, and finally threw a pass that bounced of a speeding lock's chest. Not a general.

Good to see Melhor back with huge, detailed posts![/b]

He's 21 and played about 21 minutes of Test rugby, he will learn.
[/b][/quote]

It wasn't Genia's fault. Giteau had to call for the drop goal and say he was ready.

Genia took the next best option.

 

[William18]

Very impressive performance from South Africa. I had a few doubts over whether they could replicate their game away from home. From what I saw they were more attacking and tried to take Australia on a bit more. South Africa fully deserve this tri nations, they have easily been the top side.

 

[QLD]

South Africa took the initiative early on, dominated Australia and had a heap of confidence. I love South Africa's pack - like 8 Brad Thorns who will die for each other. Their lineout was incredible, Aussie's were terrible again.

Burgess has to be dropped, dunno how many more chances Deans wants to give him. **** service, slow to the breakdown didn't help. Genia gives crisp service and will only get more confident every game he plays.

Pocock should replace Brown in the starting team and Quade Cooper at flyhalf for Brisbane.

 

[Flux]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (smartcooky @ Aug 30 2009, 12:56 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Flux @ Aug 29 2009, 11:39 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Australia have been poor[/b]

Agree

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Flux @ Aug 29 2009, 11:39 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

but so has Bryce Lawrence.[/b]

Disagree. He was consistent, he made very few mistakes, and he explained his decisions clearly

Additionally, was VERY strict on the 10m Law, making sure that players ahead of the kick did NOT advance at all until put onside by an advancing onside team-mate. I wish more referees would do this.

He also outright told that yappy little prick Luke Burgess to shut his trap. Telling a scrumhalf to shut up can only be a good thing.
[/b][/quote]

I say that on the basis of Bryan Habana's second try. Seeing as you're an ex-referee, I'm wondering what your take is on the fact South Africa created a try scoring oppurtunity and fluffed it, but that wasn't deemed advantage enough, so they got another go at it and scored off the resulting scrum. A couple of minutes later, Australia were given an advantage from a knock on, had no advantage whatsoever, as all they'd done was set the ruck up really, and advantage was called over (this wa around the halfway mark, if that makes any difference).

Other than that, and a few knock ons that appeared to have gone backwards, I'd have to agree with what you said as well.

 

[feicarsinn]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Dale @ Aug 30 2009, 01:49 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

South Africa took the initiative early on, dominated Australia and had a heap of confidence. I love South Africa's pack - like 8 Brad Thorns who will die for each other. Their lineout was incredible, Aussie's were terrible again.

Burgess has to be dropped, dunno how many more chances Deans wants to give him. **** service, slow to the breakdown didn't help. Genia gives crisp service and will only get more confident every game he plays.

Pocock should replace Brown in the starting team and Quade Cooper at flyhalf for Brisbane.[/b]

On the lineout, was I the only one who thought that the wallabies persistance in going for the long option was foolhardy at best. I mean while I really don't think that Spies is the finished article by any means, if your gonna chuck the ball to him, considering how massive he is, he'll have a hell of an impact on the game. In my opinion poor decision making and basic errors cost Oz the game.

 

[Melhor Time]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (smartcooky @ Aug 29 2009, 08:24 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

This shows up the stupidity of the current format where everyone plays everyone else three times. It virtually over and were only 3/4 of the way through the competition. The remaining matches will be meaningless dead rubbers.

Roll on Argentina joining this comp.[/b]

Why not kick Australia out of the 3N? They are not able to win afterall? I do not want them removed but the point is vivid for everybody to understand. Australia bing in the 3N as a part of a three way battle for SH supremacy is simply not accurate. The current team is not good and the coaching has nothing to do with this.

Seriously, this is not so surprizing. Australia suffer from having no local player base. This is why they go after NRL players. Sooner or latter they will need to select players base din Europe, even if the rule is to only allow one or two based there in the team it will be an improvement. Look at Australia's options to replace Mortlock. There are none. The options, in Australia, are Cross or Ashley-Cooper. One is a former league player and the other is a fullback. Another could have been Timana Tahu who is another league player. While the other option for 13 woiuld be Lote Tuqiri... yes a league player too. Australia cannot go on with no national competition. The Super 14 is not producing players, certainly not enough in different positions. Some of the Wallabies are poor. Burgess was outplayed to the extent that his international career should have ended in November 2008 when playing vs France. The reason he is still there is a lack of options. This is the same reason why John Connoly played Giteau at 9 in 2007. Barnes and Lakham were there to play flyhalf. Australia really need Mark Gasnier playing for them. Today he scored two tries for Stade Francais. SF were losing and looking like being badly beaten at one point but Gasnier played well to help his team win. He plays in France so can't represent Australia, despite being much better than Cross, et all. This will need to change, and may come under review, if Australia keep losing. There is no way that Tyrone Smith is better. If Australia don't use Gasnier then he could very well play for France. France would be using Brock James but he played sevens for Australia so cannot.

Could Australia's amateur players (no Super 14 players allowed whatsoever) play Canada and the USA in North America and win? I am not so sure. Well Argentina's Jaguars have done so this year. Argentina are moving towards a professional domestic competition. John O'Neill, cancelled Australia's after one year. Mr O'Neill is not doing Australia many favors. His handling of the ARU's international affairs is anti-expantionist in many ways. Australia need better relations with many rugby countries. Its all good and well to move a Bledisloe Cup match to China or Japan to make a profit but the domestic fans need variation and need to see the strenghts of more teams. Australia's low crowd vs France in June in Sydney was really shocking. Vs Wales in 2007 it was too. John O'Neill blamed the Welsh for not having all their top players yet a French team who had defeated New Zealand didn't sell ticked two weeks latter. Australia have not hosted Argentina since 2000 and have not played in Argentina since 2002. Here lies the problem. The fans are, in large part, clueless. This is shocking given that the ARU is in a four way war with rugby league, soccer and Australian rules football. Rugby's strength is that it is international, unlike league and aussie rules. Yet, Mr O'Neill seems to not understand this. He does so much harm to Australia's relations with others. He should be looking to build a future with the world power Argentina.

He should be wanting to act as a regional leader in the Pacific. Think back to the success of World Cup games in 2003 in Adelaide, Wollongong, Canberra, Gosford and Townsville. These venues sold out, or virtually sold out games including Ireland vs Argentina, France vs USA, Canada vs Italy and Japan vs Fiji. The ARU should be taking games to these places. It needs to host teams like Samoa, Fiji, Tonga and Japan at these venues. Mr O'Neill pulled Australia 'A' out of the Pacific Nations Cup which made games like these that much more important. Australia needs to take games to the fans. Use these venues and make use of the year outside of the Super 14, Tri Nations and November / June internationals.

When Giteau was 12 the things were better for Australia. This is when the team scored tries. He should be playing here. Cooper was better at 10 but Brock James is what is missing. I have said so a few times already. Flyhalf play does not need to be a star like Carter or Hernandez. Wilkinson certainly has little play making skills compared to these guys, yet he controls play. Andy goode does too. He replaced a Giteau like player (Danny Cipriani) and England were better off. Organization is key at flyhalf. Brock James has this. Morne Steyn is a rubbish runner yet has this too. Why has Ronan O'Gara been the man for Ireland for so long? Cooper, Beale, O'Connor and Giteau are all immensely talented but most are better at other positions. The Wallaby backline is very unbalanced.

A balanced backline would be:

10 James
11 Ioane
12 Giteau
13 Gasnier
14 Mitchell
15 Ashley-Cooper

 

[Wally]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (smartcooky @ Aug 30 2009, 12:24 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

This is all over bar the shouting. Its going to turn into a real hiding if the Wobblies aren't careful

A bonus point win to South Africa puts them on 17 points

Best New Zealand can do is 18 (two 4-try bonus point wins). That means South Africa would have to lose their last two games by more than 7.

Ain't gonna happen, might just as well hand them the trophy now.

This shows up the stupidity of the current format where everyone plays everyone else three times. It virtually over and were only 3/4 of the way through the competition. The remaining matches will be meaningless dead rubbers.

Roll on Argentina joining this comp.[/b]

That's generally what happens when one team wins all its games.. It wouldn't matter if everyone played each other once, twice, three times or fifteen. South Africa obviously deserve to have the competition sewn up.

 

[feicarsinn]

Ah the one area where the 6N wins out over the 3N. drama to the max!

 

[Haj]

Cant take anything away from the saffas. First half especially wallabies were clueless on how to break the line. i think it was around the +30 minute mark when boks put up the first high ball. Good to see.
Our midfield was clearly a target with a new centre combination.
Burgess needs to go and giteau needs space so I agree with a shift to 12. I guess that leaves only cooper to run at 10 with Barnes out but at least Cooper made the bok defense stutter a few times.
Reffing was consistant and had no bearing on the game.
Fully deserved win for the boks.

 

[nik]

Watched only the last 30 minutes of the game. I didn't see much running rugby from the Springboks. Maybe it was evident in the first half which I missed out. Most of the running is only done by one player and that is Fourie Du Preez, he is the main play maker/line breaker in the 'Boks team.
SA had awesome defense though. Amazing at the physicality they bring into the tackles and rucks. They have set a new bench mark. It's true, the 'Boks pack is like 8 Brad Thorns. They are manhandling the opposition very easily. Plus the forwards are very atheletic too, no back can run around them.

It's simple strategy to beat the Boks really, the opposition needs to gain forward ascendency. But I don't think any team in the world at the moment can even match them let alone gain forward ascendency.

 

[KZNSharksFan]

No running game? They put up a sum total of 2 high balls in the first half and only reverted to a kicking game once they had the game in the bag. The midfield is NOT clueless in attack ffs! JDV didn't have an amazing game, but he was still solid, and anyone who watches that midfield regularly will know it is very capable. I enjoyed it very much but I think the Boks let the foot off a bit at the end and Australia capitalised fully on this.

 

[Boggle]

After we had scored our fourth try we just went back to kicking and defending like mad, which isn't a bad strategy I guess when you can kick and defend as well as we do, but thought we could have really destroyed Aus if we kept doing what we were doing.