• Help Support The Rugby Forum :

[COVID-19] General Discussion

Reiser99 said:
I get that, though as you mention this is for the oxford one, yet they are also doing it with the pfizer one despite no direct evidence.
Click to expand...
FTFY
There's no direct evidence, but there is indirect evidence. The human immune system still works the same way, regardless of what the bottle says.

IIRC (my virology was 20 years ago, and cursory), typically when vaccines require 2nd doses, the first gives you a decent response, and immunity; but the second gives you both a top-up, and prolonged immunity. As far as these vaccines are concerned, we simply don't know - we cannot know anything "long-term" about a virus that was first identified about a year ago.


Personally, I'm intinctively uncomfortable with a 12 week wait between doses of the AstraZeneca vaccine - but that's based on gut feel, with no evidence - AstraZeneca and Oxford University themselves seem to be comfortable with 12 weeks, then they know a **** load more than anyone here.
For the Pfizer vaccine, they haven't tested anyone at all with a 12 week wait; so that doesn't sound worth the risk - but it's still an educated guess based on how vaccines work, not just a panic measure pulled out of Johnson's johnson.



As ever with this unpresidented pandemic, I'm not going to overly castigate anyone for making mistakes, or taking a risk that doesn't pay off.
I reserve that for entirely foreseeable mistakes (such as directly undermining their own message and eroding confidence in the advice), going explicitly against the advice of those who know (which may include Pfizer, but I'd need to see what they say), and repeating previous mistakes (delaying inevitable action).

For AstraZeneca this is a calculated risk, based on (low-confidence) evidence. For Pfizer this is a calculated risk based on immune responces to vaccines.

The upside is that we get immunity into twice as many of our most vulnerable people in a short period of time.
Potential downside is that those same people may need a 3rd dose (once we've secured enough, and rolled out vaccination programmes nationally, and can be done with much less hassle).
Other risks are from the repeated mistake of muddled messaging and eroding confidence / support of recommended measures.


Bear in mind, a single dose of the AstraZeneca vaccine is still 53% effective at preventing symptomatic infection and 100% (low confidence) effective at preventing hospitalisation, whilst apparently also reducing spread.
 
Last edited:
Which Tyler said:
So we can expect kockerynof the suggestion tomorrow, and a full national lockdown in what? about 10 days time?
By then, of course, the numbers will be at least double and the NHS will have been run out of beds a few days earlier.
Click to expand...
If so then you really have to question the intelligence of the those in charge as they will continue to repeat mistakes.

Lockdown in Spring came too late.
Tiers came too late.
Second lockdown came too late.
London and south-east into tier 4 came too late.

That doesn't include all the u-turns. I get people are happy that a government can admit when it's wrong. But when they are constantly u-turning (even before covid tbh) then it does scream clueless. Some of the u-turns are literally happening within 24-48 hours. I know it's a fast moving situation, but surely the data doesn't change that drastically.
 
Reiser99 said:
If so then you really have to question the intelligence of the those in charge as they will continue to repeat mistakes.
Click to expand...

The only thing that comes to mind that has me questioning their intelligence is the apparent belief that refusing to control the spread of the virus will minimise damage to the economy. It seems clear to me that measures introduced in a timely manner won't have to last as long or be as stringent, so will inflict less economic damage and comes with the added bonus of killing / damaging less human beings. Everything else, I put down to them being a bunch of self serving sociopaths including their willingness to trade away human lives in the misguided it will save money.
 
RedruthRFC said:
The only thing that comes to mind that has me questioning their intelligence is the apparent belief that refusing to control the spread of the virus will minimise damage to the economy. It seems clear to me that measures introduced in a timely manner won't have to last as long or be as stringent, so will inflict less economic damage and comes with the added bonus of killing / damaging less human beings. Everything else, I put down to them being a bunch of self serving sociopaths including their willingness to trade away human lives in the misguided it will save money.
Click to expand...
looking from the outside

justification for protecting the economy over lives seems more silly than last year because there are now examples around the world of very strict lockdowns working and allowing the economy to get back to some sort of normality, far from unscathed but that ship has sailed already anyway
 
I've almost given up caring about what the government does, Tier's 2-4 make zero difference to my life. Most accepted mistakes in Feb/March last year when everything was new but after that its been the same mistake over and over again. There's zero hope they'll learn and their supporters will support them regardless, its a depressingly solid base as well.

Just hope the vaccine rollout is quick.
 
ncurd said:
I've almost given up caring about what the government does, Tier's 2-4 make zero difference to my life.
Click to expand...
The only difference I notice is gyms opening and closing,
Incredibly frustrating, but I can understand why (though churches being open in tier 4 is a **** take).


Saw an old article earlier, from when the scientists were begging for a full lockdown at October halfterm, saying that worst case scenario would be hitting 31k cases a day.
We've topped 50k for 6 days in a row and the Government still won't close schools
 
TRF_Olyy said:
The only difference I notice is gyms opening and closing,
Incredibly frustrating, but I can understand why (though churches being open in tier 4 is a **** take).


Saw an old article earlier, from when the scientists were begging for a full lockdown at October halfterm, saying that worst case scenario would be hitting 31k cases a day.
We've topped 50k for 6 days in a row and the Government still won't close schools
Click to expand...
Yup circuit breaker was suggested by SAGE back in September to coincide with half term. Its bloody ridculous.

Yet what trends on twitter? #sackwhitty

We have a completely incompetent government on this and there is duck all we can do about it.
 
Scotland just announced strict stay at home from midnight Tonight.
 
Looked at some gym equipment this morning, on finance - decided to mull it over.

Went back after Scotlands announcement and literally everything sold out.

Let the fattening begin.
 
TRF_Olyy said:
Looked at some gym equipment this morning, on finance - decided to mull it over.

Went back after Scotlands announcement and literally everything sold out.

Let the fattening begin.
Click to expand...
Ah foolish person, I spent 3 weeks off running and just getting back into it. Luckily I've been pretty much doing that on my own my own since last March so use to it.
 
ncurd said:
Ah foolish person, I spent 3 weeks off running and just getting back into it. Luckily I've been pretty much doing that on my own my own since last March so use to it.
Click to expand...
Ennit, literally fuming haha

I can't really run that much because of a variety of injuries that flair up (if it's not shin splits it's ankles if it's not ankles it's not knees).
Might crack my mountain bike out but it feels insanely unsafe riding the roads around where I live
 

Similar threads

A
[COVID-19] - Things to do when under lockdown
9 10 11
Replies
205
Views
16K
Kiwiwomble
Kiwiwomble
TRF_Olyy
Westworld Discussion [SPOILERS]
Replies
15
Views
2K
ncurd
N
TRF_Olyy
Game of Thrones Discussion [SPOILERS]
37 38 39
Replies
762
Views
49K
ncurd
N
Toko_11
There are currently 274 users online. 19 members and 255 guests
Replies
5
Views
2K
Stumpy
Stumpy
C
  • Locked
Moderators: Good or Bad?
Replies
5
Views
1K
LittleGuy
LittleGuy

Latest posts

Top