England V Wales - 29th May

[Tmartin995]

http://www.englandrugby.com/news/tuilagi-withdraws-from-england-tour-squad/

Manu's out of this game and the tour. His replacement is going to be named after this game, presumably from Burrell, Devoto and Hill.

 

[spartan32]

Winning this game could be crucial for world rankings, bearing in mind that seeding for the world cup will be in a years time.

I think that Gatland will take this very seriously. It's a perfect chance to pick up a win versus an under strength English side and gain some confidence going into the NZ tour.

This game will matter a lot more to the Welsh, as they are bound to get white washed by New Zealand, where as England stand a fair chance of walking away with wins, although if this game does indeed count towards the world rankings a win for either team would be handy.

Ps all the confidence in the world won't help the Welsh on tour in New Zealand.

 

[spartan32]

Neither LCD or Teo are available for this game as they are both playing in finals the day before.

Forgot about that.

In which case give Devoto the nod. Better all round skill set then Burrell. Sure there's plenty of other hookers that can come in for LCD and do a fine job. In fact I think this game may well be a chance for England to display our strength in depth.

 

[welshglory]

This game will matter a lot more to the Welsh, as they are bound to get white washed by New Zealand, where as England stand a fair chance of walking away with wins, although if this game does indeed count towards the world rankings a win for either team would be handy.

Ps all the confidence in the world won't help the Welsh on tour in New Zealand.

Never underestimate the effect a good win versus England can have!

You lot came very close in two of the tests in 2014. Ireland drew a test in 2012. Considering this NZ squad is in a bit of a rebuilding phase and this Welsh squad is probably the strongest we've ever had minus Halfpenny missing I think there is every reason to be optimistic. At least one win should be within grasp.

 

[Raggs]

I rather hope Wales do win a test, if not two.

 

[MojoPin]

Never underestimate the effect a good win versus England can have!

You lot came very close in two of the tests in 2014. Ireland drew a test in 2012. Considering this NZ squad is in a bit of a rebuilding phase and this Welsh squad is probably the strongest we've ever had minus Halfpenny missing I think there is every reason to be optimistic. At least one win should be within grasp.

I do think it's achievable by the group of players we have, I'm just not sure their game is focused and developed enough yet. We'll see though, a win against England would certainly help.

 

[AzaMatt]

Never underestimate the effect a good win versus England can have!

You lot came very close in two of the tests in 2014. Ireland drew a test in 2012. Considering this NZ squad is in a bit of a rebuilding phase and this Welsh squad is probably the strongest we've ever had minus Halfpenny missing I think there is every reason to be optimistic. At least one win should be within grasp.

im a fairly optimistic lad but the depth new zealand have is outstanding. even though they've lost some mainstays, their replacements in some cases are just as good. basic skills are at another level, especially skills under pressure. i think we will push them close in all the tests but they will pinch them all, maybe only by a couple of points. the test in 2014 showed that the gulf between us for 80% of the game is not much. but that last 20% they took it to another level that we couldnt get to. in some ways we are a better side now player wise but our form has been dipping lately. hopefully we get a good win on sunday to get momentum that we can take on the tour. i really do hope we win at least 1 test but im not that confident tbh

 

[ncurd]

Never underestimate the effect a good win versus England can have!

Loosing to Australia then SA last year in the world cup (they did beat Fiji!)

Loosing to Japan in 2013 2 games later then loosing to SA and Australia

In 2012 they did beat France afterwards but then got whitewashed by Australia


I'm not sure beating England does anything other than give them bragging rights they beat England....

 

[Bada-Bing!]

Never underestimate the effect a good win versus England can have!

You lot came very close in two of the tests in 2014. Ireland drew a test in 2012. Considering this NZ squad is in a bit of a rebuilding phase and this Welsh squad is probably the strongest we've ever had minus Halfpenny missing I think there is every reason to be optimistic. At least one win should be within grasp.

No they didn't; they lost 3-0 as well.

 

[welshglory]

The biggest issue is that we don't have the attacking game to trouble SH defences. It showed in the world cup when we couldn't even score a try past a 13 man Australian side, and we struggled against South Africa as well. 6 nations didn't look much better in that perspective either, where North and Roberts were able to create something out of nothing a few times.

He needs to unlock that if we are to be succesful outside of the 6 nations going forward, or even in the 6 nations considering England's potential. This weekend would we be a good place to start

Ah well Ireland came incredibly close anyway. My point is that especially in the first test you have a chance if you go full out, NZ are notoriously slow starters (performance wise anyway) in the international year.

If there was ever a time to target a victory on NZ soil it is this tour.

 

[j'nuh]

The biggest issue is that we don't have the attacking game to trouble SH defences. It showed in the world cup when we couldn't even score a try past a 13 man Australian side, and we struggled against South Africa as well. 6 nations didn't look much better in that perspective either, where North and Roberts were able to create something out of nothing a few times.

He needs to unlock that if we are to be succesful outside of the 6 nations going forward, or even in the 6 nations considering England's potential. This weekend would we be a good place to start

Ah well Ireland came incredibly close anyway. My point is that especially in the first test you have a chance if you go full out, NZ are notoriously slow starters (performance wise anyway) in the international year.

If there was ever a time to target a victory on NZ soil it is this tour.

New Zealand also have quite a few retirees from the last time they were out. Notably, Carter-Nonu-Smith are no more. No doubt they will be replaced with a new generation of legends, but it's a good chance for Wales to target the switch-over period.

Just realised this has already been talked about. Still, I think it can't be understated how good Carter-Nonu-Smith are, and how difficult it will be for the next generation to live up to them!

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Ah well Ireland came incredibly close anyway.

I think you might be confusing it with our draw with SA in SA.
The Boks are our bogey team like Australia are yours - no matter how good we think we are, and how much of a dip they're in, we can never get a win.

 

[ratsapprentice]

Nabbed this from twitter:

 

[welshglory]

I think you might be confusing it with our draw with SA in SA.
The Boks are our bogey team like Australia are yours - no matter how good we think we are, and how much of a dip they're in, we can never get a win.

Actually i was referring to the 2nd test of Ireland's tour to NZ in 2012 where Carter slotted a drop goal in the 81st minute!

Agree with your point though

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

Nabbed this from twitter:

2014 is a bit out of date but it sort of highlighted what I and others believe, Ashton relies on a dominant team and doesn't function well without it. He is a finisher and that's it.

 

[j'nuh]

2010-11 was when he had his dream partnership with Foden, mind.

Couldn't care less about Ashton, but I wish Foden was in his glory form. At his best, he was the best fullback we have had in the last decade IMO.

 

[Peat]

Nabbed this from twitter:

In fairness, Ashton's time under Lancaster was just dire for everything to do with attack. We scored 12 tries in 2012 and 2013 6Ns; we scored more than that in both the 2014 and 2015 6Ns all by themselves. In the games he played for Lancaster, no one scored more than Ashton did (Tuilagi was even). It wasn't like the other winger was racking them up - with the exception of Marland Yarde in the 2014 Summer Tour, nobody scored a try on the opposite wing to Ashton. And I think that might have happened due to Freddie Burns being switched in (6N 2012-2014, we score only two tries through the wingers; then we replace Farrell with Ford and score 7 in 2015).

And stuff.

I don't want to excuse Ashton too much but he was stuck with crap to work with.

 

[ratsapprentice]

The other wingers that were being picked were pretty dire too though...

 

[Hendo74]

The biggest issue is that we don't have the attacking game to trouble SH defences. It showed in the world cup when we couldn't even score a try past a 13 man Australian side, and we struggled against South Africa as well. 6 nations didn't look much better in that perspective either, where North and Roberts were able to create something out of nothing a few times.

He needs to unlock that if we are to be succesful outside of the 6 nations going forward, or even in the 6 nations considering England's potential. This weekend would we be a good place to start

This is very true. Hopefully the likes of Rhys Webb and Scott Williams, both sorely missed recently, will make a big difference to the attacking side of things. They both bring something a little different to the table.

 

[spartan32]

In the 6 nations Wales were soundly beaten by England in the first half and had it not been for some rather shabby English Defence in the 2nd half would have been whitewashed. Drew with Ireland, scrapped past Scotland. I guarantee NZ will not be so accommodating. And what could Wales really take away from playing a below strength England missing key game changing players such as Itoje, Kruis, Faz, Goode, Knowel, the Vunipolas, etc. At least half the first team not available. Plus the England players who are out will probably have one eye on the Aus tour and won't be firing too hard.