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English summer rugby

Think Rats is onto something here. Which is fantastic news for Yarde, as his main competition consists of out of position full-backs at the moment, he looks like a bit of a shoe-in. A fit Benjamin and Nowell could both compete strongly for this shirt.

Its not bad news for May either - Wade is still an incredibly exciting talent, but based on what I saw in on the Lions tour, there's still a few defensive issues linked to a lack of bulk, which could let May overtake - and Ashton has a few things to prove, or so you'd like to think. Mindyou, if Tom Varndell gets his defensive issues completely in order, I think this shirt will be his.

As for scrum-half - just ****. Time for Catt to earn his corn; all the three favourites can do it, its up to him to beat it out of them if needs be.
 
But May is more of an athlete than a creative type. Unless by athlete you mean a Lomu/North/Alex Tuilagi go-through-'em type. May's a finisher and counter-attacker. At Gloucester, if there's a stubborn defence to break down, you look at Burns and JSD. If there's plenty of space in the game, you look at Trinder and May.

And as for go-through-'em, fast athlete types, I'm still waiting on Benjamin.
 
I can't see Benjamin coming back in to the England set-up anytime soon considering he's not played for a year and is unlikely to get much game time for Tigers, bar LV= appearances when fit. Shame his injury came when it did as he was on the cusp of breaking in, but that's life I guess.
Nowell, on the other hand, I'm looking forward to seeing play more. Really looked good for Exeter (and England u20s) - just needs to lose the scrumcap and we're golden.
 
Redefine the terms as solid guy and strike runner then I guess - like Jane and Savea, only nowhere as good.

As for Benjamin, wouldn't count on him not getting Tigers gametime, if the quality is still there I think he'll play a lot.
 
Redefine the terms as solid guy and strike runner then I guess - like Jane and Savea, only nowhere as good.

As for Benjamin, wouldn't count on him not getting Tigers gametime, if the quality is still there I think he'll play a lot.
 
I can't really remember (because I've never bothered to follow Wuss) how good Benjamin was, I'm just going on the fact that the Tigers bought him as an indication of his quality.

How good is he by your estimations?
 
He was a great runner of the ball and lethal finisher.
This was, however, a bloody long time ago. Ashton used to be a great winger, so anything can happen

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ratsapprentice said:
I can't really remember (because I've never bothered to follow Wuss) how good Benjamin was, I'm just going on the fact that the Tigers bought him as an indication of his quality.

How good is he by your estimations?
Click to expand...
Very powerful runner. 6'1 and 16-and-a-half stone. In perspective, that's only half-a-stone lighter than North, but with a slightly lower centre-of-gravity too. Makes him a very powerful runner. He's also a good finisher, as it takes something special to score the amount of tries he did at Worcester.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pVa5vIP5BtE#t=20s
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Gxm20S4klA#t=1m02s

When fit, I think he'll soon coast into the Tigers lineup. He has that power game that I can't see the Tigers being able to resist.

England? Not sure. Even when he was fit, I would have still had players ahead of him. So he has to get back to where he was, and then some, to get into England. But he's one of the few "power options" available to England.
 
I'm more excited about the current England team and selection choices than I have been for quite a while. If only we can get over the 2 humps of transferring good performance at U20 to the pro game and good performances at clubs to the national side. Somehow things tend to break down between those 2 areas where English players perform well.
 
Rat that was some powerful photoshopping right there. Might make that my desktop background.
I'm more excited about the current England team and selection choices than I have been for quite a while. If only we can get over the 2 humps of transferring good performance at U20 to the pro game and good performances at clubs to the national side. Somehow things tend to break down between those 2 areas where English players perform well.
Click to expand...

Guys like Slade, Clifford and Sisi have already put in some good LV performances, Clifford in particular. I think out of the U20 squad from the JWC they are the most likely to be involved in the England set up by 2015. Some of the other current U20s may mature a bit later.

The really encouraging thing for English rugby is after this summer we have a huge depth of talent. Not only the stand out U20s guys coming through but also the players from Argentina and some guys in the Premiership *cough* Daly *cough* who didn't get a look in. If you look at all of the teams people have listed above there are players 'missing' in each squad who arguably should be there. For example putting Launchbury and Parling in the row and Atwood on the bench still leaves Lawes, Myall and Slater as players who have been around the England setup this year and easily have the ability to challenge for a starting spot. A few years ago we weren't in this position. The EPS was a much more exclusive group and there was less quality competition for starting spots.
 
Think you're being too sanguine there Patchey. I'm not sure Ed Slater has sufficient athleticism to make it at international level, much like Louis Deacon didn't, and Kearnan Myall is seriously light for an international lock. Lawes definitely has international quality, but he also has several flaws to his game. Same with most areas in the squad. I feel that our potential depth is excellent, but our actual depth looks very suspicious to me.
 
Perhaps. I guess we'll know more by the time the next Six Nations comes around. I agree with you in a way, a lot of the players cited as part of England's depth haven't quite proved themselves yet. In terms of looking forward to 2015 I think this season is crucial for players to step up and show that their potential can be converted into something.
 
What I see as our "Depth Chart", to use an American sporting phrase:

1. Corbisiero, Vunipola, Marler, Mullan
2. Youngs, Webber, Buchanan, Lindsay
3. Cole, Wilson
4. Launchbury, Lawes, Kruis, Kitchener
5. Parling, Attwood, Slater, Robson
6. Robshaw, Wood, Croft, Fearns, Haskell
7. Kvesic, Fraser, Wallace, (Seymour*)
8. Morgan, Vunipola, Clifford
9. Youngs, Care, Simpson, Robson
10. Burns, Farrell, Flood, Ford
11. Yarde, Biggs, Nowell, Thompstone
12. Twelvetrees, Eastmond, Barritt
13. Tuilagi, Joseph, Daly, Tomkins, Burrell
14. Wade, Ashton, May, Varndell
15. Foden, Brown, (Daly)


I've not included people who who obviously aren't up to it, or are stop-gaps (eg. Paice)
Neither have I included people who are not ready to be picked this year (eg. Luke Cowan-Dickie)
It is, as always, an amalgam of my opinion and what I believe to be Lancaster's.


*Not really, Olyy :lol:
 
I'll fight you.

You've missed Thomas off of the #3 list, as well - I don't agree that he should be there (yet?) but he's in the EPS/capped sooo...
 
Thomas is obviously considered to be the next in line by Lancaster/Rowntree.

But he is simply too bad in the scrum to be considered for top level internationals.
And that's saying something considering Vunipola is good enough...
I really don't understand what people see in him, I'll be keeping an eye on him in an effort to though.
I think someone like Sinckler is going to surpass him before he gets a chance to amass any caps.
 
Thomas is only 21 and has missed a whole season's worth, more or less, or experience/getting stronger. Plenty of time for him to fulfil his potential; although fair enough anyone saying he shouldn't be where he is in the depth charts until he does though... but he is, it is pretty obvious.
 
He is, but if Cole and Wilson were both to be ruled out, I have a feeling Rowntree would plumb the depths for someone who can scrummage.
 
Rowntree would probably scum down himself in that instance.

I agree with most of the 'depth chart' except for Varndell, whatever form he's on he won't get picked.
 
There's no guarantee Sinkler will be better than Henry.
Thomas was very good at age grade.

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