Experimental Law Variations (ELVs) in 2008 Investec Super 14

[BLR]

Did they take out the 'hold' call in the scrums?

I didn't notice it on the weekend but if they have taken that out...that waws one of the main problems of 2007...

 

[Cymro]

The Free Kick rule at the brekdown was rubbish, it in fact destroyed the game between the Sharks and Western Force for me!

An infrigement is a penalty! End of! For me I see flankers having a field day killing the ball as they wont give away a penalty!

 

[hat]

The Free Kick rule at the brekdown was rubbish, it in fact destroyed the game between the Sharks and Western Force for me!

An infrigement is a penalty! End of! For me I see flankers having a field day killing the ball as they wont give away a penalty!
[/b]

they still have the ability to be sent off dont they

 

[sanzar]

I think based on week 1 the laws have made for too much negative kicking just like most other members have said. I cant see what was wrong with super 14 last year. I watched 4 games on sky and they were all pretty boring. Sometimes things that are not broken shouldnt be mesed about with. I will be wtching the next round with interest. [/b]

Yes, sometimes things aren't broken and shouldn't be messed with... but this doesn't apply to rugby. As a professional game they can't afford to have as many areas of the game so grey and open to interpretation that even veteran players are unable to understand why a penalty is given. Rugby has needed a number of its laws simplified and/or clarified for a long time... The ELVs may not solve all of this (as many of them are more to do with the pace of the game), but it certainly was about time for a bit of experimentation (and again, lets not pretend that rugby was "perfect" - this is hardly the first time new rules have been introduced after all).

As for what I thought of the first round, well like a lot of you a thought there was a bit too much aimless kicking, which gave it an almost 7s feel at times, but on the whole I enjoyed the encreased pace of the game and think that the free kick penalties at the breakdown are a great idea. By the time we get to the Tri Nations it should be clear which rules should stay and which should go. So lets not right them all off yet.

 

[danny]

<div class='quotemain'>
The Free Kick rule at the brekdown was rubbish, it in fact destroyed the game between the Sharks and Western Force for me!

An infrigement is a penalty! End of! For me I see flankers having a field day killing the ball as they wont give away a penalty!
[/b]

they still have the ability to be sent off dont they
[/b][/quote]
not if they are only giving away free kicks.

 

[Cymro]

The reason for this if that the they want to attract league fans to watch more union and they feel the union game is to slow!

 

[candybum]

hmm i wonder how the game of rugby was played in the very early 90's (or when it was invented)... if the laws (old ones) were used back then (or similiar)

 

[BLR]

hmm i wonder how the game of rugby was played in the very early 90's (or when it was invented)... if the laws (old ones) were used back then (or similiar)
[/b]

Defences are too good now, they have adapted to all the tactics of the 90's....I suppose with the pro era players and coaches had the time and technology to pile over tapes of games and invent new tactics to stop attack....the new laws at least add some more options in attack to combat this good defence....but coaches will most likely adapt to even these laws....

 

[danny]

<div class='quotemain'> I think based on week 1 the laws have made for too much negative kicking just like most other members have said. I cant see what was wrong with super 14 last year. I watched 4 games on sky and they were all pretty boring. Sometimes things that are not broken shouldnt be mesed about with. I will be wtching the next round with interest. [/b]

Yes, sometimes things aren't broken and shouldn't be messed with... but this doesn't apply to rugby. As a professional game they can't afford to have as many areas of the game so grey and open to interpretation that even veteran players are unable to understand why a penalty is given. Rugby has needed a number of its laws simplified and/or clarified for a long time... The ELVs may not solve all of this (as many of them are more to do with the pace of the game), but it certainly was about time for a bit of experimentation (and again, lets not pretend that rugby was "perfect" - this is hardly the first time new rules have been introduced after all).

As for what I thought of the first round, well like a lot of you a thought there was a bit too much aimless kicking, which gave it an almost 7s feel at times, but on the whole I enjoyed the encreased pace of the game and think that the free kick penalties at the breakdown are a great idea. By the time we get to the Tri Nations it should be clear which rules should stay and which should go. So lets not right them all off yet.
[/b][/quote]

I dont know too many veteran players who dont know what a penalty is for. You seem to think that faster rugby is all its about. you are so wrong . Rugby is a game of depth and different factors such as scrummaging , mauling , rucking along with great passing and try scoring. Im all for giving new laws a chance but the first thing they should do to improve quick ball is to properly and consistently penalise those who slow down ball and not be so quick to penalise a player to release. This in my opinion has brought about a real fear in players not to get isolated and stay close to support instead of really taking a risk and going for it. Surely we all hate to see pick and drive ,pick and drive........................................

 

[shtove]

The bit I saw of the Crusaders tonight was good. There was still too much kicking, but maybe that's just a hangover from the RWC?

 

[shazbooger]

yeah first view was the Bulls v Crusaders match. Forgot all the new rules until I saw him ping for a free kick instead of a penalty and i was like "what kind of funny assed game is this they are playing".

Immediate thought mirror those of ........... eh............ some other poster. Flankers are going to have a field day killing the ball with no fear of conceding points.

Secodnly, the drop goal will probably become more prominant now as a key opportunities for points. I presume it could be tapped, passed to outhalf for a drop goal attempt?

 

[mimic]

Yeah, something like in American football, may see teams snap the ball back another 10 metres to make it impossible to defend against.

 

[Charles]

Nope about the Droppie. It's not allowed until there 's been a turnover or an action of play at least. Which means you can't have the scrum or the tap and go for the DG. Sucks big time, aye. First you get your quick ball killed, and then you have to work for the try or you get nothing. If I was on the pitch it would **** me off big time I think...

 

[mimic]

A pass doesn't count as an action of play?

 

[Prestwick]

Immediate thought mirror those of ........... eh............ some other poster. Flankers are going to have a field day killing the ball with no fear of conceding points.[/b]

Hee hee, admit it sweets, good ol' Pendantic Pete was right! :lol:

How is the rule change removing the fixed limits of players at the line out? Thats what I really want to know because unlike people droning on like some stuffy old Sociology professor about "boring" forward play, what really ruined matches for me was one team getting the other by the balls, hoofing to the corner...only to lose the initiative and ruin the moment in a point of sheer anti-climatic dissapointment because they didn't have enough people in the line out...

 

[Charles]

@Mimic: No ! Disappointing, innit !

 

[sambãd5]

surely a maul counts then? get 8 men, run fowards togeather and pass it back to the 58?

 

[sanzar]

<div class='quotemain'>
<div class='quotemain'> I think based on week 1 the laws have made for too much negative kicking just like most other members have said. I cant see what was wrong with super 14 last year. I watched 4 games on sky and they were all pretty boring. Sometimes things that are not broken shouldnt be mesed about with. I will be wtching the next round with interest. [/b]

Yes, sometimes things aren't broken and shouldn't be messed with... but this doesn't apply to rugby. As a professional game they can't afford to have as many areas of the game so grey and open to interpretation that even veteran players are unable to understand why a penalty is given. Rugby has needed a number of its laws simplified and/or clarified for a long time... The ELVs may not solve all of this (as many of them are more to do with the pace of the game), but it certainly was about time for a bit of experimentation (and again, lets not pretend that rugby was "perfect" - this is hardly the first time new rules have been introduced after all).

As for what I thought of the first round, well like a lot of you a thought there was a bit too much aimless kicking, which gave it an almost 7s feel at times, but on the whole I enjoyed the increased pace of the game and think that the free kick penalties at the breakdown are a great idea. By the time we get to the Tri Nations it should be clear which rules should stay and which should go. So lets not right them all off yet.
[/b][/quote]

I dont know too many veteran players who dont know what a penalty is for. You seem to think that faster rugby is all its about. you are so wrong . Rugby is a game of depth and different factors such as scrummaging , mauling , rucking along with great passing and try scoring. Im all for giving new laws a chance but the first thing they should do to improve quick ball is to properly and consistently penalise those who slow down ball and not be so quick to penalise a player to release. This in my opinion has brought about a real fear in players not to get isolated and stay close to support instead of really taking a risk and going for it. Surely we all hate to see pick and drive ,pick and drive........................................ [/b][/quote]



Whether or not you know "too many veteran rugby players who know what a penalty is for" is as maybe, but in international rugby at least veteran players often can't understand why penalties are given due to all the differing interpretations ( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2rk_EzB2jM0). And no, I don't think faster rugby is what it's all about, but I do understand that for newcomers a faster more fluid game is generally more attractive... and that's what this is about as much as anything - not just making the game easy to ref, but also increasing it's appeal as a product.

 

[Prestwick]

I don't know SANZAR, can you give us a better reason than "we need to change for change's sake" because that is what you're really saying, right?

EDIT: Not that there isn't a better reason, far from it, but can we have...um...more..intensity to quote Lost in Translation.

FURTHER EDIT: Can someone PLEASE fill me in on how the new rules in regards to the line out are going? Have they even been implemented?

 

[Orcaral]

I don't think players will abuse the free kick rule in the ruck. While they may not be giving away a direct 3 points, constant free kicks to the opponents will result in one of several things.

1. A team with a dominant scrum e.g the Blues and Crusaders, will keep opting for the scum. With the new 5m, scrums are huge attacking weapons, not to mention they will wear down the opposition forwards. So instead giving away maybe 3points, you're giving your opposition a very advantagous attacking opportunity.

2. You get run off your feet, especially against a team like the Blues. While again not giving away a direct 3 points, this could lead to your team becoming fatigued sooner, and will be a significant factor during the last stretches of the game.

3. Ref yellow cards you for consistent and unsportsmanlike infringing. Alot of this will depend on the ref's judgement though.

Point number 3 is what I don't really like about the new laws. At the start they said they were trying to make the ref's job easier and make them less influential on the games outcome. But it seems they've just made it more complicated.