Rugby Championship: South Africa - Australia (29/09/2012)

[MattyEdgeworth]

I've watched none of the Rugby Championship so far, but what you describe doesn't resemble the way he plays for Ulster. Which means you might want to look as much at the coach as the player...

An english ulster fan?

 

[Peat]

And english ulster fan?

Ahh, no need to look so horrified

 

[kusta]

I remember watching Morne Steyn at the world cup last year, particularly the game against Fiji, he was cutiing the line and not playing so flat. That try where he cut the line(I couldn't believe my eyes) and did an inside switch with Frans Steyn where he nearly scored but was caught short of the line and I think Beast got that try! I remember also against Namibia Steyn was not playing as flat and he took the line! Even against Samao.


Ok so my point! The problem can't be Steyn for playing so deep and not able to get his backline going cos he clearly has showed before that he can! The Problem is HEYNEKE MEYER, I feel the instructions must come from the top that Steyn must kick most of the ball he gets and play so deep and attempt Drop goals!


Now I'm not suggesting keeping him there cos he is not even kicking his goals anymore but it is Heyneke Meyer that is the problem! Just worry if Goosen gets forced to play like that also and he ruins the kid!

 

[kusta]

And I just went on to Youtube and watched the 19 tries scored by the Springboks @ the RWC 2011(Please go search and watch if you can to see my above point about Steyn and the type of game plan we were playing) and couldn't help but like how those tries came about and how our game plan was compared to the current one! We should never have dropped PDivvy after the world cup, look at NZ with Graham Henry after 2007 World Cup but every Boer oke in this country wanted PDivvy gone! We were on the right track I feel and now imagine Goosen featured in that type of game plan we were playing!!

 

[TRF_stormer2010]

We weren't even on the road with PdV and that's fact. With Matfield and Smit gone (though they might have stayed on uder PdV LOL) the man wouldn't have a clue as to what to do. And those embarrassing Bushisms of his..

 

[kusta]

We weren't even on the road with PdV and that's fact. With Matfield and Smit gone (though they might have stayed on uder PdV LOL) the man wouldn't have a clue as to what to do. And those embarrassing Bushisms of his..

That is what the media was feeding you! And you had no idea what was goin on behind the scenes now do you?! Propaganda my friend! It exists! especially with how our past was!

Mate read the autobiography by John Smit and it will tell you about the Prejudice media and it talkin about confused game plans and Pdv having Jake whites team which was cos the media wanted Pdv to fail and feed u wrong things to change your thinkin and beliefs and support them! People under-estimate how much power the media have!

 

[psychic duck]

And I just went on to Youtube and watched the 19 tries scored by the Springboks @ the RWC 2011(Please go search and watch if you can to see my above point about Steyn and the type of game plan we were playing) and couldn't help but like how those tries came about and how our game plan was compared to the current one! We should never have dropped PDivvy after the world cup, look at NZ with Graham Henry after 2007 World Cup but every Boer oke in this country wanted PDivvy gone! We were on the right track I feel and now imagine Goosen featured in that type of game plan we were playing!!

PDivvy had a much better South African team to coach than Meyer.

He had players like Victor Matfield, Fourie du Preez, Jaque Fourie, Heinrich Brussow, Bismarck du Plessis all at their peak under him, and South Africa should have really been New Zealand's closest challengers to the RWC in 2011.

Yet he still managed to get the team to underachieve, despite having those players.

And now Meyer is having to go through a rebuilding phase without those players.

Of course if you take Matfield, du Preez, Brussow (at his best), Fourie, Bismarck and Burger all out of the side, then it will be weaker. That's over a third of the side, and nearly all of the side's best players.

If South Africa had a good coach and selector during the 2008-2011 period, then South Africa would have been challenging the All Blacks much harder.

 

[kusta]

PDivvy had a much better South African team to coach than Meyer.

He had players like Victor Matfield, Fourie du Preez, Jaque Fourie, Heinrich Brussow, Bismarck du Plessis all at their peak under him, and South Africa should have really been New Zealand's closest challengers to the RWC in 2011.

Yet he still managed to get the team to underachieve, despite having those players.

And now Meyer is having to go through a rebuilding phase without those players.

Of course if you take Matfield, du Preez, Brussow (at his best), Fourie, Bismarck and Burger all out of the side, then it will be weaker. That's over a third of the side, and nearly all of the side's best players.

If South Africa had a good coach and selector during the 2008-2011 period, then South Africa would have been challenging the All Blacks much harder.

Sure had the players from 2007 but he had the right game plan of expansiveness and yeah u say he made them under perform but those players where getting old! In their 30's already and tell me how most rugby players perform over the age of 30! And How do you know how things would have turned out with Pdivvy rebuidling this year? We'll never know cos he wasn't given that chance and the risk was never taken

 

[TRF_stormer2010]

That is what the media was feeding you! And you had no idea what was goin on behind the scenes now do you?! Propaganda my friend! It exists! especially with how our past was!

Mate read the autobiography by John Smit and it will tell you about the Prejudice media and it talkin about confused game plans and Pdv having Jake whites team which was cos the media wanted Pdv to fail and feed u wrong things to change your thinkin and beliefs and support them! People under-estimate how much power the media have!

Am I not allowed to agree with the media if it correlates with my own perceptions of things then? PdV could not form a cohesive sentence in his home language never mind his poor English. Apart from that he thought Earl Rose was the business and his inherited team had a steady decline in performances and became ever more predictable in play under him. Half of his selections that turned out for the good and were asked for by the people came about because of forced injuries...

Nah, my agreeing wit the media does not translate into mind control and conspiracy theories.

 

[kusta]

and South Africa should have really been New Zealand's closest challengers to the RWC in 2011.

And technically we where the closest challengers to NZ @ the World Cup last year before we got controversially knocked out

 

[TRF_heineken]

Okay, so aside from this very unproductive last couple of posts, mainly by an angry Willem Alberts wannabe, lets get back on topic.

Craig Roberts, the Springbok Doctor reported that 6 Boks have ****les which they are monitoring, of which Frans Steyn's injury is the biggest concern.

the other ****les are: Johan Goosen (bruised heel), Flip van Der Merwe (Hamstring), Lwazi Mvovo (Hamstring), Jacques Potgieter (Groin) and Coenie Oosthuizen (general stiffness).

They didn't participate in yesterday's contact session mainly as a precaution. Frans Steyn went for scans at a nearby hospital, and it gave him and all clear. the only problem now is the swelling around the ankle. an assessment will be made on Wednesday.

News Reports suggests that If Frans Steyn is fit, then Goosen will Start on Saturday. But if Frans Steyn is unavailable, Morne Steyn will keep his place as HM wants to keep continuity in the team.

@kusta, dude, it's about time you pull that broomstick out of your ass and start saying something positive for a change, you ***** more than a girl on her period.

 

[Icemn]

I remember watching Morne Steyn at the world cup last year, particularly the game against Fiji, he was cutiing the line and not playing so flat. That try where he cut the line(I couldn't believe my eyes) and did an inside switch with Frans Steyn where he nearly scored but was caught short of the line and I think Beast got that try! I remember also against Namibia Steyn was not playing as flat and he took the line! Even against Samao.

morne stains's problem and SA problem (Jdv mentioned this aswell) is to spread the ball wide or break the line "WHEN IT'S ON"...
question is when is SA going to "Make it on" instead of waiting for gaps... Gaps will apear against weaker teams... That is why a guy like stain can look like a rockstar vs a team like Namibia..The gaps will not always appear vs NZ or Aus... That is why morne is nowhere in big games, that is when superstars look like rockstars ...imagine Dan carter vs Namibia, he will put stain in school...
morne stain for me should even play currie cup level, well maybe...

 

[kusta]

PdV could not form a cohesive sentence in his home language never mind his poor English. Apart from that he thought Earl Rose was the business and his inherited team had a steady decline in performances and became ever more predictable in play under him. Half of his selections that turned out for the good and were asked for by the people came about because of forced injuries...

Nah, my agreeing wit the media does not translate into mind control and conspiracy theories.

Now u bringing non Rugby related issues and getting personal?

And where things as predictable as they are now under HM? Cos we didn't look too predictable at the World Cup to me

And I never said anything about Conspiracy theories! Maybe if u already brain-washed by the media than you obviously will tell urself that you both have the same views when in fact they have made you buy into their views

 

[kusta]

morne stains's problem and SA problem (Jdv mentioned this aswell) is to spread the ball wide or break the line "WHEN IT'S ON"...
question is when is SA going to "Make it on" instead of waiting for gaps... Gaps will apear against weaker teams... That is why a guy like stain can look like a rockstar vs a team like Namibia..The gaps will not always appear vs NZ or Aus... That is why morne is nowhere in big games, that is when superstars look like rockstars ...imagine Dan carter vs Namibia, he will put stain in school...
morne stain for me should even play currie cup level, well maybe...

And besides the gaps, I'm talking about the way he is playing now compared to how he was playing at the World Cup! He is so deep in the pocket he can't get his backline moving! Last year he was playing much closer to the offensive line and able to pass the ball! Now he first thinks about kicking before he thinks about passing! Its the way he is being coached now that's why, its being instilled in him to be like that and let's hope it doesn't get passed on to all the other fly-havles in this country so for them to be able to make the Bok squad

 

[TRF_heineken]

Now u bringing non Rugby related issues and getting personal?

And where things as predictable as they are now under HM? Cos we didn't look too predictable at the World Cup to me

And I never said anything about Conspiracy theories! Maybe if u already brain-washed by the media than you obviously will tell urself that you both have the same views when in fact they have made you buy into their views

Yes, we were predictable during the World Cup. lets have a look shall we:

Vs Wales: Hougaard Scores a try from a set move which Fourie Du Preez perfected with Habana that has given us many tries previously. if not for that try, then we would have lost. Outcome = Predictable.

Vs Fiji: Our forwards dominated them as we knew their big backs would run at us. he dried up their ball possession and grinded out tries through mauls and forwards running off rucks. Outcome = Very Predictable.

Vs Namibia: Seriously??

Vs Samoa: tough match with many off the ball stuff, what else did you expect when Bismarck, Jannie and Bakkies are on the field and being confronted by big Pacific Islanders. Outcome = Predictable.

Vs. Australia: No South African wants to relive that match. Outcome = Very F***ing Predictable!

 

[Icemn]

And besides the gaps, I'm talking about the way he is playing now compared to how he was playing at the World Cup! He is so deep in the pocket he can't get his backline moving! Last year he was playing much closer to the offensive line and able to pass the ball! Now he first thinks about kicking before he thinks about passing! Its the way he is being coached now that's why, its being instilled in him to be like that and let's hope it doesn't get passed on to all the other fly-havles in this country so for them to be able to make the Bok squad

that is why HM favors Goosen over lambie, cuz of his kicking game... Goosen is going to play for the bulls pretty soon aswell...

 

[Darwin]

And technically we where the closest challengers to NZ @ the World Cup last year before we got controversially knocked out

Not really that relevant, but no, technically South Africa were not the closest challengers to New Zealand at the World Cup. Our closest challengers were the number 2 ranked team in the world, a team that had beaten us 2 out of the last 3 times we had played, a team we had never beaten at the Rugby World Cup before.....

Anyways.... I'm really interested to see what sort of team South Africa put out this week. I would love to see more of Goosen at international level (as long as it is not against the AB's) but it doesn't sound like we will see him. If F Steyn is out injured it may be a bit of a blessing in disguise for South Africa - it is not that he has been playing poorly (indeed he has been much better than de Villiers), but it will allow de Villiers to move to 12 (a position he is much better at IMO), and de Jongh to play 13. It would be great to see Taute in the mix too, but I can't really see that happening (maybe next year!).

 

[kusta]

Yes, we were predictable during the World Cup. lets have a look shall we:

Vs Wales: Hougaard Scores a try from a set move which Fourie Du Preez perfected with Habana that has given us many tries previously. if not for that try, then we would have lost. Outcome = Predictable.

Vs Fiji: Our forwards dominated them as we knew their big backs would run at us. he dried up their ball possession and grinded out tries through mauls and forwards running off rucks. Outcome = Very Predictable.

Vs Namibia: Seriously??

Vs Samoa: tough match with many off the ball stuff, what else did you expect when Bismarck, Jannie and Bakkies are on the field and being confronted by big Pacific Islanders. Outcome = Predictable.

Vs. Australia: No South African wants to relive that match. Outcome = Very F***ing Predictable!

Ok and this year?

HM stays in pretoria, used to coach the Bulls, Afrikaner =Conservative(doesn't want to see change) therefore very predictable.

Selection- Biased towards his old team =Therefore very predictable!

Kicking Game plan...played by his old team =Therefore very Predictable that the Boks will play it too.

Losing = Oh Very F*ckin predictable since the Bulls are doing the same

 

[Icemn]

@ kusta, you are on the money regarding HM and Pdv...

pdv was always going to struggle, in trying to play his gameplan... And the reason for that is simple... You cannot change a 200 year culture overnight... Pdv had 4year and the whole country against him... How do we even know he had carte blanch over that team??

i know for a fact Pdv use to sit in the coaches box and then he wasn't even aware of subs going onto the field... So was he the coach or just a front get the media satisfied before they turn it into a colour thing by stating rugby in SA is just a white sport why can't there be a black coach...

i think Pdv did a brilliant job under the circumstances, why he wasn't kept I don't know... We would have seen lambie and co...

By the way, did you guys know Pdv is and was always an AB supporter?

 

[Icemn]

F Steyn is out injured it may be a bit of a blessing in disguise for South Africa - it is not that he has been playing poorly (indeed he has been much better than de Villiers), but it will allow de Villiers to move to 12 (a position he is much better at IMO), and de Jongh to play 13. It would be great to see Taute in the mix too, but I can't really see that happening (maybe next year!).

i think under HM, any sort of injury to players are a blessing in disguise...