[RWC2023 QF3] England vs Fiji (15/10/2023)

[Reiser99]

I don't like the selection, but I didn't expect much else.

SB is taking a huge gamble and if England lose then he will be in hot water.

 

[dirty harry]

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Matavesi on the bench is a shock, hes clearly standout but his dad just died.

Also Kuravoli on the bench too?!?!?!

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

"Chase those ******* kicks"

"Make those ******* kicks chaseable".

 

[NotTooAmused]

Matavesi on the bench is a shock, hes clearly standout but his dad just died.

Also Kuravoli on the bench too?!?!?!

Kuruvoli on the bench i'd imagine as the last resort "kick them to death" strategy? not sure.

 

[bushytop]

Baffling… Steward might not have set the world on fire this World Cup but even an average Steward is a damn solid fullback. Thought it was a bit strange seeing people clamouring for Smith at 15 after the Chile game but didn't actually think it'd happen… and in a World Cup quarter final at that. People are strange… when you're a stranger…

 

[ageingback23]

I think you could also ask what x factor Arundell brought to that game? there was one chip over the top after a line break, but other than that the tries were walk-ins. Several he just trotted over the line, so I don't give a ton of credit for that
He's a good player who's rapid and can break tackles, but also it's interesting to note how rarely Ireland would involve you team wise in games under Farrell or Schmidt until maybe a year in camp
I'm just playing devil's advocate here, I'd take him over Daly, but think Daly's left boot (hopefully used for touchfinders too), and experience show through, plus I genuinely thought he was should be starting centre with Lawrence
TLDR I can see an argument for Arundell, but that argument shouldn't be based purely on trotting five of the easiest tries he'll ever score against Chile, where the rest of the team created the space for him to walk over the line

Not sure anyone on here is basing the Arundel thinking on the 5 tries. It's on his prem form, and things like the amazing first touch he had in the Australia game where he busted through two Aussie defenders like they were crate paper. He's fast, powerful, has a great step and is really young so loads of time to work on him and make him world class. Instead he's inconsistently used and apparently kept in the wilderness to protect little lord fontlaroy who he has somehow offended. There have been some pretty sort games for England in our pool and arguably he should have played all of them to see how he could do and have a chance to develop. Instead, i fear we will lose another great opportunity and may never see him again.

 

[Bruce_ma gooshvili]

Finally, Marcus starts at 15. Blooming obvious this was worth a shot from his substitute appearances. Would have preferred Ford but England may score tries in open play here with the ability of Marcus to do revolutionary things like, pass a ball accurately whilst running!

I understand why Fiji dropped the speedy winger but Tuisova at 12 and Ranradra on the wing is making an already pretty dull, conservative side sensationally one dimensional. I think they hit a brick wall here.

England 37 - 6 Fiji

 

[TRF_Olyy]

It's on his prem form

His premiership form was pretty terrible at the end of the season tbf

England 37 - 6 Fiji

Bloody hell, I'll have some of what you're drinking please

37 isn't even divisible by 3!

 

[dirty harry]

Finally, Marcus starts at 15. Blooming obvious this was worth a shot from his substitute appearances. Would have preferred Ford but England may score tries in open play here with the ability of Marcus to do revolutionary things like, pass a ball accurately whilst running!

I understand why Fiji dropped the speedy winger but Tuisova at 12 and Ranradra on the wing is making an already pretty dull, conservative side sensationally one dimensional. I think they hit a brick wall here.

England 37 - 6 Fiji

This is world class thinking!

 

[Mrs. Peter Quinn]

I don't like the selection, but I didn't expect much else.

SB is taking a huge gamble and if England lose then he will be in hot water.

Not sure actually - I suspect the RFU will feel he's got credit in the bank..

 

[ageingback23]

Baffling… Steward might not have set the world on fire this World Cup but even an average Steward is a damn solid fullback. Thought it was a bit strange seeing people clamouring for Smith at 15 after the Chile game but didn't actually think it'd happen… and in a World Cup quarter final at that. People are strange… when you're a stranger…

Steward is solid, and by that we mean he can catch a ball with some consistency when it's kicked his way, and he's taller than most backs so has a higher chance of doing so. Which is great, but I'm pretty sure smith, and any other competent rugby player at this level can do. The issue is that Steward can't doing anything of value with the ball when he actually does catch it, where as smith can. So in the end BS is risking a slightly higher chance of balls not be taken in the air, to generate a much higher chance that a reasonable counter attack will come about. I think it's a fair gamble. Look at the difference Barrett makes for NZ. How much ends up developing from his counters. Is it the best use of Smiths skills, probably not, but is developing him in other areas a good idea? Probably. Should we be experimenting at te quarters in a WC? Almost certainly not, but frankly i like Smith and am glad to see him on the pitch and hope that he gets a chance to shine.

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

Not sure actually - I suspect the RFU will feel he's got credit in the bank..

If they're paying him anything like Jones he will have. If he gets sacked and compensated like Jones he definitely will have. Unlike the RFU who will be checking to see if Wonga.com are still trading.

Genuinely think a second loss to Fiji allied to everything else would make Borthwick's position untenable.

 

[ncurd]

Baffling… Steward might not have set the world on fire this World Cup but even an average Steward is a damn solid fullback. Thought it was a bit strange seeing people clamouring for Smith at 15 after the Chile game but didn't actually think it'd happen… and in a World Cup quarter final at that. People are strange… when you're a stranger…

Remember after the first game everyone was saying Ford had to start every game and that went away after the second. England are just suck a mess right now with no clear sense of direction people clutch onto the latest thing as the next saviour.

We aren't good and it will require a complete rethink post world cup. I don't think Ive ever cared less about an England match. And the brain thinks a loss could be pretty important.

 

[IT157]

It may also be that going forward he can't be selected due to going to France so why waste the caps, if a player already has plenty of experience it probably matters less but the balance of having inexperience as a potential liability whilst not contributing to their immediate future does have some logic, one could also ask if that was the logic why put him in the squad in the first place, just trying to rationalise it.

He can be selected next season even though he is playing in France.

 

[ageingback23]

I don't like the selection, but I didn't expect much else.

SB is taking a huge gamble and if England lose then he will be in hot water.

What did you want to see instead? Cole being on the pitch is a head scratcher for sure, but the pack seems about as good as one could hope. In terms of backs we always new Farrel and we going to start, but at least Smith is on the pitch, and he could work some magic with Daly who I think is a decent player with plenty of skill set. Manus been solid enough thus far, Marchants looked good, people seem to be on Mitchell's case, but I don't think he's been that bad, and Cares on the bench if things start to go really wrong. Arundel was never getting on the pitch, Malins is slow, stepless, and uninspiring, Watson injured, Steward ain't no wing, so it has to be May and Daly. Of course we all believe Ford should be in at 10, but that wasn't going to happen either.

 

[bushytop]

Steward is solid, and by that we mean he can catch a ball with some consistency when it's kicked his way, and he's taller than most backs so has a higher chance of doing so. Which is great, but I'm pretty sure smith, and any other competent rugby player at this level can do. The issue is that Steward can't doing anything of value with the ball when he actually does catch it, where as smith can. So in the end BS is risking a slightly higher chance of balls not be taken in the air, to generate a much higher chance that a reasonable counter attack will come about. I think it's a fair gamble. Look at the difference Barrett makes for NZ. How much ends up developing from his counters. Is it the best use of Smiths skills, probably not, but is developing him in other areas a good idea? Probably. Should we be experimenting at te quarters in a WC? Almost certainly not, but frankly i like Smith and am glad to see him on the pitch and hope that he gets a chance to shine.

Happy your happy… just from an outside perspective I'd kill for Wales to have a Freddy Steward. Play-off rugby is more about the percentages than any other sport in my mind… and I think Smith 'might' be okay for a quarter-final against Fiji (no disrespect) but if you get through and Smith goes at XV against France/South Africa, I'd expect him to get exposed.

 

[AngloScotsHybrid]

Happy your happy… just from an outside perspective I'd kill for Wales to have a Freddy Steward. Play-off rugby is more about the percentages than any other sport in my mind… and I think Smith 'might' be okay for a quarter-final against Fiji (no disrespect) but if you get through and Smith goes at XV against France/South Africa, I'd expect him to get exposed.

This raises the question is Smith being selected to start at fullback for a specific game against Fiji or is he now deemed the best option at fullback for all matches going forward?

 

[ageingback23]

Happy your happy… just from an outside perspective I'd kill for Wales to have a Freddy Steward. Play-off rugby is more about the percentages than any other sport in my mind… and I think Smith 'might' be okay for a quarter-final against Fiji (no disrespect) but if you get through and Smith goes at XV against France/South Africa, I'd expect him to get exposed.

I agree completely. And I can't see that happening at all. I think you play the right players for the appropriate games. There's scope for Smith in this game as we wouldn't expect the Fijians to be much cop with the kicking game, and so a good chance to have another decent attacking option on the field. Come Semis (if we make it that far) England will be playing lockdown rugby and hoping they can hang on long enough against superior opposition.

 

[AngloScotsHybrid]

I agree completely. And I can't see that happening at all. I think you play the right players for the appropriate games. There's scope for Smith in this game as we wouldn't expect the Fijians to be much cop with the kicking game, and so a good chance to have another decent attacking option on the field. Come Semis (if we make it that far) England will be playing lockdown rugby and hoping they can hang on long enough against superior opposition.

And whats the logic for starting Dan Cole against Fiji?

 

[Jimbo]

Happy your happy… just from an outside perspective I'd kill for Wales to have a Freddy Steward. Play-off rugby is more about the percentages than any other sport in my mind… and I think Smith 'might' be okay for a quarter-final against Fiji (no disrespect) but if you get through and Smith goes at XV against France/South Africa, I'd expect him to get exposed.

Whilst I love you sticking up for our players Steward is vastly over rated, this comes across as if Freddie is rock solid which he hasn't been at all, Scotland exposed him as have a number of other teams, hell given his perceived aerial superiority he was pretty poor on our line when we conceded the cross field try again Samoa. If he was solid at the back but not much going forward I could accept that but for me he isn't.