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Suggestions/ideas for Rugby 2012

Should be able to pick any team in the world league to start off with and not force to choose between lesser sides. A player improvement system would also be great similar to the one in Fifa / Pro Evolution with a bunch of random names + stats coming through which would provide for endless entertainment. Be a Pro is should also be ranked up there with the more important additions + maybe some more classic matches/clips to unlock.
 
A simple easy way to make the breakdown less random, more compettitve!

I was thinking about how to improve the breakdown and came up with an idea.

There are 2 ways to steal the ball in defence, The first was to use a fetcher (like richie McCaw) to steal the ball or the Second to counter ruck. Just like in real life.

Once an attacking player gets tackled, the tackler gets to his feet or another defender gets to the ruck and attempts to fetch the ball (this is indicted with a green light on their head), Once the green light is on you click in the right stick in to steal the ball just like on previous games. However you wont get penalised like in previous games. THe player fetching the ball or attempting to steal has a green light on his head when he is on his feet and has the right to attempt to steal, the light goes red when he is off his feet. If u are still holding or clicking the right stick in when its red you get penalised. Also if u click the stick in b4 the light goes green u will also get penalised. The first player into the breakdown who attempts to steal is automatic, good fetchers like McCaw take less time to steal the ball. In order to prevent the player stealing the ball the attacking team simply has to put a player(s) into the ruck by tapping "a" just like in previous games. As soon as a player is commited they knock off the player attempting to steal. Light goes red.

Some players may take a very long time to steal the ball eg Backs, So it is more wise to simply tap "a" and commit numbers to the ruck in order to counter ruck the same as in previous games. You simply tap "a" for a player to enter the ruck, The sooner the better, and the more players the higher the chance of winning the ball. If your the defender and you tap "a" while your own player(fetcher) is attempting to steal the ball it will cancell out his attempt to steal, but it will strenghten your chance to counter ruck.

Attackers who are quick at commiting players to the ruck won't have much trouble with the players attempting to steal, as it takes time to steal. (it might a good idea tho if a player such as Richie McCaw, George Smith are harder to knock off the ruck, it might take 2 backs to knock them off, or a forward with lots of strengh stats).

Simple! Not too difficult. And of course the green light on his head can be some-thing else, Just an indictor that a player is attempting to steal, is on his feet. Another indictor for when he's off his feet.

Even a simpler idea would work just like the quick pass/quick tap system when in attack of the previous games. Instead the "x" indictor comes up in defence and say "steal ball", only happens at certian times in the game when one of ur players are attempting to steal, when the indicator comes up, you simply hold in the x button (instead of tapping it like the quick pass), and if you do it quick enough, before your opponent commits too many players to the ruck you win the ball. Attacking players can cheat (try to hold onto the ball by clicking in the right stick, however are liable to penalties).
 
A be a pro mode would be fantastic
and more controll at the break down
 
I think players definitely need to have more urgency about them. I don't like seeing players who are near to rucks just standing there waiting for the re-programmed forwards to amble in. I'd like to see some Blitz defence. I'd like to see some urgent defence. I'd like to see the winger, far outside any possible opposition come in and help once in a while.

I'd like to see players running after the ball, so they can take a quick lineout. And on that point, if a player is near the line, and catches the ball, he should either catch it in-field, and run away from the line OR he should catch it outside, and take a quick lineout (maybe), OR he should leave it. And there should be an option to choose what he does, or something.

If I kick from the ruck, or at kick-off, I want to see chasers chasing hard, sprinting! Moody is angry, he should be killing people when chasing the ball.

While I remember it, on a kick-off, if you kick it juuuust right, then the AI on your team will tackle the player in the air, resulting in a penalty and maybe even a yellow card! If I didn't choose to do that, I shouldn't have to be penalised. I don't even think it should happen. It made me rage when I got a straight red one time!

Urgency in the play, please :)
 
I think players definitely need to have more urgency about them. I don't like seeing players who are near to rucks just standing there waiting for the re-programmed forwards to amble in. I'd like to see some Blitz defence. I'd like to see some urgent defence. I'd like to see the winger, far outside any possible opposition come in and help once in a while.

I'd like to see players running after the ball, so they can take a quick lineout. And on that point, if a player is near the line, and catches the ball, he should either catch it in-field, and run away from the line OR he should catch it outside, and take a quick lineout (maybe), OR he should leave it. And there should be an option to choose what he does, or something.

If I kick from the ruck, or at kick-off, I want to see chasers chasing hard, sprinting! Moody is angry, he should be killing people when chasing the ball.

While I remember it, on a kick-off, if you kick it juuuust right, then the AI on your team will tackle the player in the air, resulting in a penalty and maybe even a yellow card! If I didn't choose to do that, I shouldn't have to be penalised. I don't even think it should happen. It made me rage when I got a straight red one time!Urgency in the play, please :)

Yes omg the tackle the player in the air thing is ridiculous and it needs to be fixed, also when you put up a high ball make so that the opposition will jump aswell and not just stand there and watch you go up and get it
 
omg yes. The worst part of the game was when the opposition kicks it close to the touch line and your player would catch it in-field and then run out, even if ur holding the controls to run in! It was so frustrating! needs to be fixed.
 
brilliant ideas on the rucking system sebastian v. i would love that to be in the game. nothing like a back breaking the line thn richie mccaw makes a takle an steals the ball an then that would create a great counter attack an create a chance to score. i dont think it would be hard to put it in the game aswel. plus the hole red light/green light thing is an awesome idea. also i think the drop goals should be fixed an put back to the way it was on rugby 06. an make it that sum kickers like morne styen an the other styen kan drop kicker farer then others because they kan drop kick from about 50 meters plus.
 
It would be awesome to have a world all-stars team. As well as a Southern Hemisphere all-stars and a Northern Hemisphere all stars team! That would be awesome for North V South rivallry!
 
ability to hold the player up in the goal line to stop a try??

I dont know about that.. in the rugby league games where the player is held up pretty much anytime there is a tackler around him it gets pretty annoying.

Maybe only if you try and maul over or have a go close to the ruck..
 
It would be awesome to have a world all-stars team. As well as a Southern Hemisphere all-stars and a Northern Hemisphere all stars team! That would be awesome for North V South rivallry!

Just do what I do, and edit the Pacific Islanders team roster to be your southern hemisphere all stars, and make the Barbarians your northern hemisphere stars.
 
Just do what I do, and edit the Pacific Islanders team roster to be your southern hemisphere all stars, and make the Barbarians your northern hemisphere stars.

But then you dont have a PI team or a Barbarians team.. it would be nice if you could have both. There needs to be a player editor for that to be done too
 
It would be awesome to have a world all-stars team. As well as a Southern Hemisphere all-stars and a Northern Hemisphere all stars team! That would be awesome for North V South rivallry!

There's recently been talks about having a real NH vs SH match. Or some kind of World Club Challenge game where the winners of the Heiniken Cup vs The winners of the Super 14. But it's too difficult to set a date that suits both hemispheres...

Anyway, I came up with a Southern Hemisphere squad made of the SANZAR teams:

1. Tony Woodcock
2. John Smit
3. Carl Hayman
4. Victor Matfield
5. Bakkies Botha
6. Schalk Burger
7. Richie McCaw
8. Pierre Spies
9. Fourie du Preez
10. Dan Carter
11. Bryan Habana
12. Matt Giteau
13. Adam Ashley-Cooper
14. Sitivini Sivivatu
15. James O'Connor


Lets hope there's Create-A-Team in Rugby 2012 :)
 
There's recently been talks about having a real NH vs SH match. Or some kind of World Club Challenge game where the winners of the Heiniken Cup vs The winners of the Super 14. But it's too difficult to set a date that suits both hemispheres...

Anyway, I came up with a Southern Hemisphere squad made of the SANZAR teams:

1. Tony Woodcock
2. John Smit
3. Carl Hayman
4. Victor Matfield
5. Bakkies Botha
6. Schalk Burger
7. Richie McCaw
8. Pierre Spies
9. Fourie du Preez
10. Dan Carter
11. Bryan Habana
12. Matt Giteau
13. Adam Ashley-Cooper
14. Sitivini Sivivatu
15. James O'Connor


Lets hope there's Create-A-Team in Rugby 2012 :)

On current form;

1) Benn Robinson
2) Andrew Hore/Tatafu Polata Nau
3) Carl Hayman (if he counts as a SANZAR player, if not Ben Alexander)
4) Brad Thorn/Bakkies Botha
5) Victor Matfield
6) Richie McCaw
7) David Pocock
8) Pierre Spies
9) Fourie du Preez/Will Genia (too close to call)
10) Quade Cooper
11) Bryan Habana
12) Dan Carter
13) Conrad Smith
14) Cory Jane
15) Adam Ashley-Cooper
 
hey guys great news that this is going ahead. i have a suggestion myself, however its a bit complicated so bear with me till the end. suggestions welcome.

1. Player positioning and rucks

The biggest problem with simulating rugby is that player positions aren't as defined as, say, Madden where play resets for every drive. When a ruck forms, its hard to consistently say where every player should be in relation to the ruck and the defensive and offensive lines without impeding the fun factor.

Where players stand after a phase should be pre-determined by their position, their stats and the attacking or defensive focus. These 'focuses' should be set with the d-pad. Attacking focuses should be: tight, forward run, backline play, kick and Defensive: wide, pillar and post, kick, pressure. These should the be the standard options, but depending on the scope of the project customisation could be allowed for. In a typical game of rugby (excluding mauls) no more than 4 players from each side join a ruck in any given phase. A similar limitation should be added to the game, which means that by the 4th player into the ruck from either side the ruck outcome has already been determined given the players and the stats involved. Stick with me.

For example, player one takes the ball into a ruck with his winger after making a break from a scrum setplay. Immediately, he adds the flanker who was trailing the back line move with X, who drives out the opposing fullback to protect the ball. (ideally, another button, say square, to quickly pick and drive should be added). However, both player 2s openside and no. 8 have better speed stats than player 1s number 8 and blindside so they both arrive next at the ruck and counter-ruck over the top to turn the ball over. In another scenario, player 1s halfback arrives to provide quick ball before the no.7 can be cleaned out. Or in another situation, player 1 draws in his fullback and outside centre who join with the number 7 to stop the counter-ruck. Another example; player 1s number 8 has better speed/acceleration stats and arrives first and drives over his number 7 to strengthen the ruck and retain possession.

Where is everyone else? The game engine knows that the ruck outcome will be determined by the players from either side around it (in the example, wingers, fullback, back-row). Depending on the attacking option selected with the d-pad (tight play, forward run, kick or backline move) the forwards will either be standing pillar and post at the ruck, behind the backline or at shoulder of the flyhalf. Say forward run has been selected as the attacking focus. A second rower will be positioned next to the fly-half with two-front rowers, crashing the ball up with both forwards immediately entering the ruck. Ball retained. Shift the attacking focus to backline move. The other second-rower (and back-rowers) remain around the fly-half (and can be passed to with L2) however the default attack under backline move is to shift wide. The outside centre is tackled and the second rower and two back-rowers shadow the backline to drive over. However, player 2s blindside and no. 8 have not been in the last ruck and his defensive team focus was shifted to wide. They arrive with the tackler. The flanker steals the ball and the number 8 seals the ruck.

Essentially, every ruck outcome should be scripted and the animation pre-defined by the combinations of players already there. This sounds tricky to execute but once all the combinations and outcomes (ie two forwards on 1 back, 3 backs, 1 forward etc) are animated the development side is done. This is really tricky to get your head around, and more work on the finer details obviously needs to be done, but I think it would really solve most gripes with the game; the random nature of rucks, the bunching that has occurred in defence and attack and the annoying inclusion of slow forwards in a backline move.

2. The Sprint Meter

These are slightly less complicated, thanks for sticking around through that one. Basically, I think the sprint meter isn't necessary. It basically ruined WCR and rugby challenge 06 because backline play was really limited. Added to that, it is also not really all that realistic. How many times have you seen a winger sprint 70m, only to slow down 10m out and be tackled? This event should be controlled by the acceleration and speed of the players in attack and defence. This would also do away with the R2 sprint button. (I don't know about you guys but everyone I play just always has this held down). R2 could then be freed up for some better attacking options for passing (L2 and R2 for forward runner) and defensive options (not sure here - maybe organising sliding defence?).

3. Subbing players

In rugby 08, players would suddenly get really, really incompetent when they moved to a position they didn't have in their stats. I think in 2012 it would be nice if the players have core stats (like speed/acceleration, strength etc.) and positional bonuses which add more stats to certain things if they're in their own position. If a winger is injured, an outside centre on the bench moves in. His core stats are still the same but he has no positional bonuses which add to them. The injured winger, who was already a winger, had speed, acceleration and finishing bonuses.

4. All-star teams, historic teams, more comps.

All can be worked in with a fairly simple team creator and customization option in-game. Development time should be spent on gameplay because that's where the game lives or dies.
 
hey guys great news that this is going ahead. i have a suggestion myself, however its a bit complicated so bear with me till the end. suggestions welcome.

1. Player positioning and rucks

The biggest problem with simulating rugby is that player positions aren't as defined as, say, Madden where play resets for every drive. When a ruck forms, its hard to consistently say where every player should be in relation to the ruck and the defensive and offensive lines without impeding the fun factor.

Where players stand after a phase should be pre-determined by their position, their stats and the attacking or defensive focus. These 'focuses' should be set with the d-pad. Attacking focuses should be: tight, forward run, backline play, kick and Defensive: wide, pillar and post, kick, pressure. These should the be the standard options, but depending on the scope of the project customisation could be allowed for. In a typical game of rugby (excluding mauls) no more than 4 players from each side join a ruck in any given phase. A similar limitation should be added to the game, which means that by the 4th player into the ruck from either side the ruck outcome has already been determined given the players and the stats involved. Stick with me.

For example, player one takes the ball into a ruck with his winger after making a break from a scrum setplay. Immediately, he adds the flanker who was trailing the back line move with X, who drives out the opposing fullback to protect the ball. (ideally, another button, say square, to quickly pick and drive should be added). However, both player 2s openside and no. 8 have better speed stats than player 1s number 8 and blindside so they both arrive next at the ruck and counter-ruck over the top to turn the ball over. In another scenario, player 1s halfback arrives to provide quick ball before the no.7 can be cleaned out. Or in another situation, player 1 draws in his fullback and outside centre who join with the number 7 to stop the counter-ruck. Another example; player 1s number 8 has better speed/acceleration stats and arrives first and drives over his number 7 to strengthen the ruck and retain possession.

Where is everyone else? The game engine knows that the ruck outcome will be determined by the players from either side around it (in the example, wingers, fullback, back-row). Depending on the attacking option selected with the d-pad (tight play, forward run, kick or backline move) the forwards will either be standing pillar and post at the ruck, behind the backline or at shoulder of the flyhalf. Say forward run has been selected as the attacking focus. A second rower will be positioned next to the fly-half with two-front rowers, crashing the ball up with both forwards immediately entering the ruck. Ball retained. Shift the attacking focus to backline move. The other second-rower (and back-rowers) remain around the fly-half (and can be passed to with L2) however the default attack under backline move is to shift wide. The outside centre is tackled and the second rower and two back-rowers shadow the backline to drive over. However, player 2s blindside and no. 8 have not been in the last ruck and his defensive team focus was shifted to wide. They arrive with the tackler. The flanker steals the ball and the number 8 seals the ruck.

Essentially, every ruck outcome should be scripted and the animation pre-defined by the combinations of players already there. This sounds tricky to execute but once all the combinations and outcomes (ie two forwards on 1 back, 3 backs, 1 forward etc) are animated the development side is done. This is really tricky to get your head around, and more work on the finer details obviously needs to be done, but I think it would really solve most gripes with the game; the random nature of rucks, the bunching that has occurred in defence and attack and the annoying inclusion of slow forwards in a backline move.

2. The Sprint Meter

These are slightly less complicated, thanks for sticking around through that one. Basically, I think the sprint meter isn't necessary. It basically ruined WCR and rugby challenge 06 because backline play was really limited. Added to that, it is also not really all that realistic. How many times have you seen a winger sprint 70m, only to slow down 10m out and be tackled? This event should be controlled by the acceleration and speed of the players in attack and defence. This would also do away with the R2 sprint button. (I don't know about you guys but everyone I play just always has this held down). R2 could then be freed up for some better attacking options for passing (L2 and R2 for forward runner) and defensive options (not sure here - maybe organising sliding defence?).

3. Subbing players

In rugby 08, players would suddenly get really, really incompetent when they moved to a position they didn't have in their stats. I think in 2012 it would be nice if the players have core stats (like speed/acceleration, strength etc.) and positional bonuses which add more stats to certain things if they're in their own position. If a winger is injured, an outside centre on the bench moves in. His core stats are still the same but he has no positional bonuses which add to them. The injured winger, who was already a winger, had speed, acceleration and finishing bonuses.

4. All-star teams, historic teams, more comps.

All can be worked in with a fairly simple team creator and customization option in-game. Development time should be spent on gameplay because that's where the game lives or dies.

I think the ruck idea has real merit it sounds great.

I also like the idea of getting rid of the sprint meter, that feature was just annoying.I dont think you should get rid of the sprint button though.
Alot of linebreaks in rugby come from a change of pace, from the cantering flyhalf jogging across field passing to the 2nd five going at full-steam. Or the fullback jogging up to the twenty two, feigning a kick then clapping on the pace.
Players are more skillfull and better passers when they arent sprinting top pace aswell, the ability to go halfpace then accelerate is very important. A sprint button is needed
 
it all sounded a tad tricky. but how would you put all of that in the game without complicating things??
sprint botton should stay the same. bt i think fatuige should play a big part in rugby. in fifa players can play up 2 3 games some times before they need to be rested. this sort of thing should occur in rugby 2012. players can run a lot an do whatever in the game but they also get tired wich may force subs. example, if a players fitness was 100% at the start of the game, after the game finished he finished on 65%. the team had a game in the next 2 days, the player might have not recovered in time and might start off the game an 85% and half way through the 2nd half was on 85%. now this might force a sub an change game tactics. i thing that should also be added. and to make the players revover fast, you will need to up-grade player fitness in staff up-grades.

also weather needs to play a big roll in the game. if its a realy windy wet game, you will want ball in hand an try score tries. if it is a sunny day with some wind behind you, you will want to kick alot. even a muddy surface you will want to kick a lot. if its a nice day/night an no wind, you will want to run lots.
 
Oookay heres my solution for the breakdown issue.

At the moment, there is no real feeling of control or input at the breakdown, nor is there a tangible reason why you win or lose any given competition. It seems to be down to a roll of the dice to be honest.
My solution is instead of pretending that we are in control, just take the step of actually making the breakdowns automatic. Much like in Madden. do you know how you control the offensive line? you dont, its done automatically because the focus is on running and passing. The focus of Rugby is on the running and passing game aswell so its only logical.

At the team selection screen, a player would be able to set his forwards to either "Automatic Rucking" or "Support". If you chose to set a forward to automatic rucking, they would automatically go from ruck to ruck sealing off and securing ball on offence, and counter rucking once a tackle is made on defence. Once the ball is secured by either team, they fan out to either defend the close channels or set up for the next ruck depending on the outcome.

The effectiveness of these players would directly depend on their rucking and counter-rucking ratings. Because it is decided by the AI who hits the rucks, and not just the closet guys around the tackle, you would visibly be able to see Richie McCaw hitting 5 rucks in a row, or Schalk Burger outmuscling two players to secure the ball. You could have openside flankers running specialist lines directly accross the field, taking them out of the play as far as recieving a pass goes, but getting them to the breakdown twice as fast. You would be able to program in world class forwards being awesome. This would give them value, unlike in the last games where the only good forward was a fast forward that can break tackles. This way, if you choose Martin Williams, you know you're going to get a steady supply of ball

The other major advantage of this system is the ability to choose "Support" forwards. This would mean that if you had a guy in your team like Sebastian Chabal, Sione Lauaki or Pierre Spies that are absolute monsters with the ball in hand, you can change the way their AI works. So instead of them being tied up in the tight, they would hang around in the backs more looking for opportunities to hit it up, they would follow the ball carrier looking to receive an offload at pace or drift backfield to hit up return kicks. I envisage you having the ability to change the players from "support" to "automatic rucking" during the game depending on how its going and vice versa.

If you think there is a real opportunity to steal the ball on defence and want extra numbers, you can hit the usual join ruck button to add backs into the fray to try and tip the balance, but this would leave holes or forwards in the backline if you dont turn it over, leaving an attacking opportunity. Similarly on offence you could throw the backs into the ruck if for instance you have made a break in the line and the closest players are backs. But ordinarily you would leave the forward pack to do their jobs

It would put a real tactical spin on squad selection too. I envisage a persons skill in selecting a balanced 22 being almost if not as important as a persons skill in the actual game. I want to see players not necessarily being "better" than each other, but better at certain aspects of the game. Some players would then appear better than each other depending on your individual style and philosophy about the game. Much like in the NFL when players are deciding between a predominantly passing or predominantly running game. Or in NBA where players decide between a halfcourt or fastbreak type offense.

-Can you afford to carry a front row of 3 scrummagers that arent very good at the breakdown? You might have to offset this by not having any "support" players, just a loose forward pack of ruckers to support the ball. This loss might then have to be offset by selecting a bigger unit at inside centre to compensate for the lack of a powerful runner coming out of the forwards. This would mean you lose a kicking and playmaker option from your inside centre and you might need to go for more of a tactical flyhalf-type fullback rather than a counter attacking one to compensate. The fact that you cant counter attack from kicks may mean you have to change your whole game plan and set moves.. Its these types of quandaries i want to be created

Love your work mate. First the scrum idea and now this! So you'd have the slider's like they do in Madden, and you could leave them 50/50 (ruck vs support) or lean more towards securing rucks etc.

Was going to hook you up with more reputation points but it won't let me as i gave you some rep points for your scrummage idea, got to share the love around first.

TAKE NOTES OF THESE IDEA'S HB!
 
id like to see a be a pro mode and teams for leagues like div 3 london south cos then you could build our player up from the bottom of rugby up to the top
 

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