Tri Nations: Springboks - All Blacks @ Nelson Mandela Bay Stadium (20-8-2011, 15:05)

[nickdnz]

I don't agree with the criticism of Nonu's defense in the John Smit try. I don't think he is the greatest defensive player (although he's not a bad one anymore), but the Smit try would have been very hard to stop, and i doubt SBW would have made any difference.


Watch from 1:47.
How is Nonu supposed stop that, especially considering in a drift defense, you have to rely on your inside man to make the tackle. From the looks of it, Smit had a lot of momentum running on the angle, and Nonu was trying to grab him to hold him up (failing to do so). Either way I can't see any 12 stopping Smit running with momentum that close to the line and from that angle, while also covering the outside man of Smit.

 

[User1245]

Big game on other hands here. Lambie at 15 is so vital for this game.

I like the look of this team bar Steyn, although his kicking is a must when we play teams like Aus and NZ.
Our lineouts needs to be sorted out as in now, this is our last game to demonstrate dominance in a set piece that is vital to our game. I'd also like to see some more driving mauls from there as well. I rate our driving maul as the best in the world.

Our centers were not putting any pace on the ball last week, although I think it was because Butch James takes the ball so flat. We were using our most creative backs and crashball carriers. Lets not even start on our poor wings. They saw NO attacking ball. It was just hastily shift down the line until the last guy had to cut inside and take the tackle.

Once again our ball retention the 22m has been lacking. I'm not sure what the deal is there. We just need to commit 1, just 1, extra player there. We can't shift the ball effectively 50 meters out so why are we spreading our players out when we are in the kill zone?!

I hope and pray that PDV's game plan doesn't work, not just because I want the All Blacks to win, but because I would not like to see the game taken back to the boring kickfest it was from 2007 to 2009; for the good of the game, the world does not need another World Cup final like 2007.

Yeah totally.

We also need refs to start penalising players more heavily when they lay over the ball when they're in their own 22.

Got any stats for how many metres McCaw and other the Australasian loose forwards have rolled this season?

 

[TRF_Ezequiel]

The Matfield-debate and Lezbian's so called statistic way of pointing out how great Matfield is as a captain is getting funnier by the second

 

[big ginger 8]

Don't know if it's been mentioned but from what Matfield said this week the boks won't exactly be spinning it (nothing new) they'll be trying to force N.Z. to actually take part in lineouts.

 

[Shaggy]

Just to throw another stat in there ... apparently the All Blacks have never won at Port Elizabeth ... the last game there between the two sides was in 1970 (obviously not at the new stadium)

 

[SavageLez]

The Matfield-debate and Lezbian's so called statistic way of pointing out how great Matfield is as a captain is getting funnier by the second

Ezequiel - You f***ing idiot. You have to start name calling to get attention. I can't believe that TRF have actually added you to their staff. They have done a brilliant job with this forum so don't go stuff it up by calling names. It is f***ing childish!

You carry on while I get ready to watch the HAKA live here today in Port Elizabeth.
Bet you going to say NZ had a crap team if Victor captains and inspires the boks to a victory!

Oh and according to Stats guru Victor has only captained against the AB once and it was in NZ and SA won!

http://www.espnscrum.com/statsguru/...max1=5;triesval1=tries;type=player;view=match

I thought it was more than once actually?

 

[Draggs]

Ezequiel - You f***ing idiot. You have to start name calling to get attention. I can't believe that TRF have actually added you to their staff. They have done a brilliant job with this forum so don't go stuff it up by calling names. It is f***ing childish!

You carry on while I get ready to watch the HAKA live here today in Port Elizabeth.
Bet you going to say NZ had a crap team if Victor captains and inspires the boks to a victory!

Oh and according to Stats guru Victor has only captained against the AB once and it was in NZ and SA won!

http://www.espnscrum.com/statsguru/...max1=5;triesval1=tries;type=player;view=match

I thought it was more than once actually?

There is a mistake with Statsguru, the 19-0 loss does not have an SA captain listed.
http://www.espnscrum.com/statsguru/rugby/match/25710.html

 

[SavageLez]

Thanks for the heads up!

 

[UilamOsa]

I don't agree with the criticism of Nonu's defense in the John Smit try. I don't think he is the greatest defensive player (although he's not a bad one anymore), but the Smit try would have been very hard to stop, and i doubt SBW would have made any difference.

How is Nonu supposed stop that, especially considering in a drift defense, you have to rely on your inside man to make the tackle. From the looks of it, Smit had a lot of momentum running on the angle, and Nonu was trying to grab him to hold him up (failing to do so). Either way I can't see any 12 stopping Smit running with momentum that close to the line and from that angle, while also covering the outside man of Smit.

I wouldn't say I was highly critical of Ma'as defense, I would say that there was an opportunity to put in shoulder and stop the try. You point out most centres on a sliding defense wouldn't stop Smit and that's probably true - it's just that I've watched and played league and know that on the line in a sliding defense, it is possible (it's a gamble) to stop those tries...but it is what it is...Nonu was/is my pick for WC starter. Over SBW every day and not on Sundays (in respect of Michael Jones)

Springboks need (can't believe I'm saying this) to follow the Aussies and make a choice for a Captain now that will be there after the world cup. They can still have leaders but ah well...it is PdV...

I hope it is a good game, some of the AB's are bursting out of their skin to shine and the Boks need some redemption or a bit of light for the RWC.

Hopefully, it will be minimal errors, multiple attacking plays, no matter who wins - I know both supporters want the same thing.

For the AB's to smash the bejayzus out of the Wallababies in Brisbane.

 

[Darwin]

Don't know if it's been mentioned but from what Matfield said this week the boks won't exactly be spinning it (nothing new) they'll be trying to force N.Z. to actually take part in lineouts.

The lineouts in this match are going to be crucial. Interestingly New Zealand has far more lineout options than the Boks; not only do they have two locks that are genuine lineout jumpers (rather than Thorn, who is solid but not as good as Williams/Whitelock), but all three of the starting loose-forwards, as well as the bench loose-forward (Vito) are all quality jumpers too. In contrast South Africa only really have 3 options: Matfield, Botha, and Spies. Of course there is much more to lineouts than just having a lot of quality options; the lineout throwing is equally (if not more) important. I'm sure the AB's will avoid throwing to whoever is marked by Matfield, and assuming Mealamu can throw accurately (which is not always the case with NZ hookers) I think they will be fine at lineout time. Indeed they may even attempt to put some pressure on the Boks lineout with all their potential jumping options.

 

[Sam Owen]

I wouldn't say I was highly critical of Ma'as defense, I would say that there was an opportunity to put in shoulder and stop the try. You point out most centres on a sliding defense wouldn't stop Smit and that's probably true - it's just that I've watched and played league and know that on the line in a sliding defense, it is possible (it's a gamble) to stop those tries...but it is what it is...Nonu was/is my pick for WC starter. Over SBW every day and not on Sundays (in respect of Michael Jones)

I agree with you brother hard out. I like Sonny and Ma'a both equally so that makes my perspective more neutral than some others on here who clearly like Ma'a over Sonny. There is no doubt that in my mind that Sonny is a far better defender but thats my opinion.

A lot of All Blacks would say...'yeah, John Smit could be stopped in that situation', and that sentence alone just ends this debate whether or not John Smit is unstoppable, 7m out, running sideways. If you know Rugby then you should know he can be stopped and thats all people need to admit not 'oh because of the situation and the drift and BLAH BLAH'.

Short answer: Can Smit be stopped 7m out from the line against an All Black defence? Yes or No?....its simple as that, we dont need a novel explaining an easy yes or no question. As soon as your intelligence gives you an answer to that question then thats you.

I believe Sonny couldve stopped him and many other All Blacks, including those who let him in.

 

[Jedi Rugby]

Sonny is a far better defender but thats my opinion and a NEUTRAL one at that, so its a fair call.

Not to be rude, but perhaps you need to look up the words "Neutral" and "Opinion". One of them doesn't mean what you think it does.

 

[Jedi Rugby]

It's hard to see SA winning this game, they weren't fit enough to go 80 against Oz and this is a well conditioned ABs side. The last 30 will see the blacks put them away.

 

[Sam Owen]

Not to be rude, but perhaps you need to look up the words "Neutral" and "Opinion". One of them doesn't mean what you think it does.

LOL you got me. I re-edited my post.

Im just a big fan of both and I know the differences between the two.

 

[Jedi Rugby]

LOL you got me. I re-edited my post.

Im just a big fan of both and I know the differences between the two.

I know what you mean, I'm just stoked that the ABs are so stacked in the centers, between Smith, Williams, Nonu, Kahui and even Toeava we have an unbelievable crop of players to pick from. And they're fit too! the 03 and 07 teams had major issues in the centers with Umaga and Smith injured, now we have real depth and a I personally would trust any of those players to beat any team in the worlds center pairings.

 

[big ginger 8]

The lineouts in this match are going to be crucial. Interestingly New Zealand has far more lineout options than the Boks; not only do they have two locks that are genuine lineout jumpers (rather than Thorn, who is solid but not as good as Williams/Whitelock), but all three of the starting loose-forwards, as well as the bench loose-forward (Vito) are all quality jumpers too. In contrast South Africa only really have 3 options: Matfield, Botha, and Spies. Of course there is much more to lineouts than just having a lot of quality options; the lineout throwing is equally (if not more) important. I'm sure the AB's will avoid throwing to whoever is marked by Matfield, and assuming Mealamu can throw accurately (which is not always the case with NZ hookers) I think they will be fine at lineout time. Indeed they may even attempt to put some pressure on the Boks lineout with all their potential jumping options.

It always amazes me how often people forget how important lifting is in the lineout. When the ball goes all the way through a lineout without being caught it's commonly called an overthrow but this can be unfair as often enough it's that the lifters were too slow. One of the reasons Ireland used have such a good lineout apart from Flannery's throwing and PO'C's jumping was John Hayes though a shocking scrummager his lifting is so good that he's known as the human forklift. In fact in the first Munster Leinster H.C. semi on Leinster's throw they could put Wallace out to put pressure on the midfield since Hayes was so good at one man lifts.

 

[RuckinGoodStats]

Goal kickers in 2011: Boks Steyn 79% (82 from 104); Lambie 77% (71/92). All Blacks: Slade 80% (12/15) #TriNations

Boks in 2011 on average per game: 24.3 lost possessions/turnovers (4.7 at ruck) 8.3 pens 10.3 hand errs, missing 24 tackles (1 in 4)

All Blacks in 2011 on average per game: 18.7 lost possessions/turnovers (3.3 at ruck) 7 pens 8 hand errs, missing 16.7 tackles (1 in 6)


Boks v All Blacks Ref is George Clancy (Ireland) 14 tests, has 1st​ game in RWC. 1st​ international was Uruguay v USA 30/9/2006.

Say whatever you want about Clancy but check out how his 80kgs frame handles being tackled in a game & continues http://www.rugbyweek.com/video/seil...eree-in-the-heineken-cup-video_a7c6a958e.html

 

[Dizzy]

Morning TRF... Let's go the All Blacks!!!!

 

[Seaton]

Must say, Cruden was absolutely awesome this 'morning' for Manawatu (sp.)

Whats the time there in NZ?

 

[DanCarterite]

tis 3am