[2023 Six Nations] England vs Italy - 12 February 2023

[TRF_Olyy]

Isiekwe still doesnt fill me with confidence and is not a back rower.

Yeah, I'd swap him with Ribbans - I know I'm in the minority of really rating Isiekwe (at lock) but Borthwick can't be trusted not to play him at 6

Cole we know is a short term option but is there really noone else?

Only other realistic options is Heyes, who Cole is ahead of at their club so you can understand why their club coach continues that selection policy at international level

 

[Pieter Steph du Teague]

Replacements are confusing, Earl should have come on for Ludlam, Willis was having a great game and real nuisance at the breakdown. Earl did smash it when he came on.

Isiekwe still doesnt fill me with confidence and is not a back rower.

I think these substitutions make some sense. Willis was having a great game and Borthwick had probably decided that he'd seen enough. Given that it was his first international start in a long time, it makes sense to ease him back in and keep him fit for the Wales game.

As for Isiekwe in the back row, it meant that we managed to get Dombrandt off and gave Ludlam some time at 8 while also not disrupting the Itoje-Chessum pairing who were going well and needed game time together.

In a game that we'd comfortably won by that point I think the calls make enough sense. Nothing to hold against Borthwick.

 

[Geordie]

Yeah, I'd swap him with Ribbans - I know I'm in the minority of really rating Isiekwe (at lock) but Borthwick can't be trusted not to play him at 6

Only other realistic options is Heyes, who Cole is ahead of at their club so you can understand why their club coach continues that selection policy at international level

Trevor Davison?

 

[Lé Ddanno]

What happened to Ehren Painter? Never kicked on?

 

[Crash Hamster]

What happened to Ehren Painter? Never kicked on?

Unlike Farrell who is constantly doing so...

 

[Don't Skip Leg Day]

What happened to Ehren Painter? Never kicked on?

No he's never kicked on at all I'm afraid. Not even got the starting berth at the saints.

 

[Everyday EggChaser]

Paul Hill seems to be another that never came to be

 

[OllyM97]

I thought we were better than last week in terms of the defence and set piece. Italy were disappointing and only played in glimpses. The atmosphere over the last two weeks has been absolutely dreadful, even by Twickenham's standards. Mind you, that second half would test anyone's patience, geez is was dull.

 

[LIONSxv]

Some England based observations from the game
9 and 10 poor for England. Lawrence and J Willis were great in their comeback games
Itoje much improved
It hasn't quite clicked for Dombrandt and England and has a couple of mistakes in him. He carried and tackled well
We still kick far too much even deep into the opposition t.erritory
England's intensity wained in the second half and we looked tired..is fitness an issue ?
The scrum still doesn't seem right to me
If 90% of our attacking game is based on crash ball at 12 or up and under or the occasional grubber, what's the point of slade at 13? Can't remember him getting the ball in the second half
Their is little or no faith to run the ball back from our own half. We need to mix up the kick chase with the occasional piece of running play.

 

[Don't Skip Leg Day]

I thought we were better than last week in terms of the defence and set piece. Italy were disappointing and only played in glimpses. The atmosphere over the last two weeks has been absolutely dreadful, even by Twickenham's standards. Mind you, that second half would test anyone's patience, geez is was dull.

Rubbish. Atmosphere last week in twickers was electric, best I've seen in years and I know because I was there.

You are talking rubbish, so shut the hell up.

 

[Pieter Steph du Teague]

Rubbish. Atmosphere last week in twickers was electric, best I've seen in years and I know because I was there.

You are talking rubbish, so shut the hell up.

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

For me Ludlam again seemed solid. Maybe not the biggest highlight reel player but he doesn't seem to be doing very much wrong at the moment at all.

 

[Geordie]

Will Negri get investigated for having his hands all over Farrels face on the ground?

 

[Jimbo]

Rubbish. Atmosphere last week in twickers was electric, best I've seen in years and I know because I was there.

You are talking rubbish, so shut the hell up.

You wonder why you get called twat etc, you could disagree in a polite constructive way, differences in opinion are expected and this seems to be the perfect place for it, but being obnoxious for the sake of it does you few favours.

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

Will Negri get investigated for having his hands all over Farrels face on the ground?

I really don't see how he got away with it or that it won't even be looked at. Incident is around 1:33 on the ITVX player.

 

[McTallshort]

Only time there is a good atmosphere at Twickenham is for the Army v Navy game. Let's be honest, it never matches Cardiff on international days

 

[BPM]

Some England based observations from the game
9 and 10 poor for England. Lawrence and J Willis were great in their comeback games
Itoje much improved
It hasn't quite clicked for Dombrandt and England and has a couple of mistakes in him. He carried and tackled well
We still kick far too much even deep into the opposition t.erritory
England's intensity wained in the second half and we looked tired..is fitness an issue ?
The scrum still doesn't seem right to me
If 90% of our attacking game is based on crash ball at 12 or up and under or the occasional grubber, what's the point of slade at 13? Can't remember him getting the ball in the second half
Their is little or no faith to run the ball back from our own half. We need to mix up the kick chase with the occasional piece of running play.

Agreed on most of the above.

I though pt JvP was pretty good. Definitely not 'poor' anyway.

I'm surprised at the amount of heat Dombrandt is getting. Sure he wasn't brilliant, but I didn't think he was bad. Reading this thread you'd think he was awful, which is just not factually accurate at all.

 

[Jimbo]

Agreed on most of the above.

I though pt JvP was pretty good. Definitely not 'poor' anyway.

I'm surprised at the amount of heat Dombrandt is getting. Sure he wasn't brilliant, but I didn't think he was bad. Reading this thread you'd think he was awful, which is just not factually accurate at all.

I think Dombrandt is two fold, firstly people have had high hopes which he is yet to meet, secondly last week was pretty shocking and this week probably average, I am routing for him but his performances aren't screaming I belong on the international stage and the pressure only increases over time as he gets more game time under his belt but still hasn't procure anything like a solid memorable performance.

 

[Don't Skip Leg Day]

You wonder why you get called twat etc, you could disagree in a polite constructive way, differences in opinion are expected and this seems to be the perfect place for it, but being obnoxious for the sake of it does you few favours.

I don't and I don't. It's a BS comment from someone who wasn't there. All the knobs coming out to bash England at the moment.

 

[Pieter Steph du Teague]

I'm surprised at the amount of heat Dombrandt is getting. Sure he wasn't brilliant, but I didn't think he was bad. Reading this thread you'd think he was awful, which is just not factually accurate at all.

Dombrandt wasn't awful today by any means but after last week he really had to come out and have a stormer. Instead, he continued to have some dodgy hands and seemed panicked by the intensity of it at times (getting caught at the back of the scrum being the biggest example).

I don't want to **** all over him as he's obviously a good player but for me it's just clear that he isn't up to the level and I'd prefer to invest time into back rowers who have shown that they can handle test match rugby.