A great big Munster thread

[monkeypigeon]

I agree with you, Keatley could see action at 12. I think he'll be a very good player.

As good as the bunch of players getting new contracts is, perhaps it's worth noting who wasn't included on that list. By announcing 11 new contracts, I'm guessing that's the bulk of Munster's inexperienced players tied down. There's no mention of Stephen Archer, Sean Henry, Dave Ryan, Duncan Williams, Ivan Dineen, Simon Zebo and Danny Barnes on that press release. Henry may be off to Northampton as munstermuffin says. Could the rest be off to Connacht?

Would be a shame to see Henry, Ryan, Williams and Barnes go. I don't think much of Archer or Dineen, Archer's been ok but hasn't even had a chance to prove himself and Dineed is 23 and was just a gap filler when Barnes, Mafi, Earls, Tooitoopoo and other fella...mindblock....were missing, Zebo's a brainless gast guy. That said. We could do with some speed. I think Williams might be missing out because Murray, Stringer and O'Leary all seem to be ahead of him and Henry because Fogarty (broken), Flannery (broken) and Varley are ahead of him.


Looking at the players who did get these contracts :


1. Darragh Hurley
2. Mike Sherry
3.
4. Dave Foley
5. Ian Nagle
6. Tommy O'Donnell
7. Peter O'Mahony
8. Frank Butler
9. Connor Murray
10. Ian Keatley
11. Felix Jones
12.
13.
14.
15. Deasy


Looks like we might finally be planning on giving some recruits from the youth ranks a go. Shame there's no news for the problem area of INSIDE centre or tight head.

 

[munstermuffin]

Laurie Fisher finished at end of year. Lads it was a "mutual" decision for good of Munster Rugby.

Was expected and is 1st of a few revamps in coaching team

 

[munstermuffin]

I agree with you, Keatley could see action at 12. I think he'll be a very good player.

As good as the bunch of players getting new contracts is, perhaps it's worth noting who wasn't included on that list. By announcing 11 new contracts, I'm guessing that's the bulk of Munster's inexperienced players tied down. There's no mention of Stephen Archer, Sean Henry, Dave Ryan, Duncan Williams, Ivan Dineen, Simon Zebo and Danny Barnes on that press release. Henry may be off to Northampton as munstermuffin says. Could the rest be off to Connacht?

Snoop the likes of Zebo and Ryan still have long way to go on development contract. Remember Zebo still in 1st year of academy. Archer is still academy product too and well Barnes i think we will move on if possible.

 

[snoopy snoopy dog dog]

Fisher leaving is for the best. After a good start in which the ball carrying of Munster's forwards improved considerably, the pack have taken a backwards step since. Anthony Foley is the obvious choice to replace him and a couple of years down the line to take over from Tony McGahan.

Ryan is around 24. He needs gametime at this stage. I also think that Archer could do with a move since he needs to play and get battle hardened. As it is I'm not convinced he's good enough to make it with Munster who should be aspiring to be among the best club teams (if not the best club team) in Europe. I agree with you about Zebo and Barnes. They could do with another 12 months of AIL and B&I Cup rugby before making the step up.

 

[munstermuffin]

Archer isn't as effective as people may think. I was in at Young Munster and Cork Con last Saturday and well a front row that had Fogarty and Archer in it were simply destroyed by the Cookies frontrow. Archer could do well in a Connacht squad.
As for Zebo, he has a base but his skill and decision-making have to improve for him to cut it at this level.

As for who'll replace Fisher - options being noted (let's remember we want an assistant coach as well as forwards)
Axel could do both defense and share forwards with:
Niall O'Donovan - Munster man and proven
Jim Williams - Supposedly interested in a return and is welcome

 

[profitius]

Snoop the likes of Zebo and Ryan still have long way to go on development contract. Remember Zebo still in 1st year of academy. Archer is still academy product too and well Barnes i think we will move on if possible.

Do you mean Barnes is being let go? I thought he was supposed to be a decent prospect.

 

[munstermuffin]

Barnes is a decent player but a year or 2 at Connacht gaining 1st team games is vital for development

 

[monkeypigeon]

http://www.planetrugby.com/story/0,25883,16024_6755359,00.html

Buckley to Sale. Surprised but I find myself not really caring.

Kinda short on options again.

 

[munstermuffin]

That where your wrong Monkey, things happened and changes are needed. There will be options.

 

[snoopy snoopy dog dog]

Don't want to hijack the Buckley to Sale thread.

I meant that in terms of this season when we identified early in the season the problems in our scrum, I don't mean years ago. We had Ross in our sight to replace Hayes from early this season, That is fact.
Buckley was offered a contract and refused it because of incidents he isn't happy with. That is the truth.

That I can believe.

In some ways, Munster are very unfortunate. Once Simon Best was forced to retire, Hayes and Buckley were the only semi competent tightheads available to Ireland. As such the IRFU had to contract both of them. Having two Ireland contracted players at Munster meant the IRFU were never likely to sanction Munster bringing in a better tighthead who might take either of those players places. Meanwhile Leinster and Ulster who weren't restricted in such a way managed to bring in World Cup winning tightheads CJ van der Linde and BJ Botha to fix their scrums. Two years ago Munster weren't in a position to repatriate Mike Ross so Leinster stepped in and it has worked out brilliantly. Now that Buckley has moved on and Hayes is likely to retire, Munster should be free to sign whoever they want. I'm ust a bit ****** off that it appears to be Leinster's best tighthead who is in their sights.

What are Munster's other options (apart from Mike Ross)? Of the players on their books, Peter Borlase hasn't impressed so far but he needs time to settle in. He can't be properly judged until next season in my opinion. Even if he does improve, Munster need somebody to compete with him for the 3 jersey. Stephen Archer isn't up to much. Dave Ryan is a better loosehead than tighthead. I know nothing about their academy players Pa O'Regan and Alan Cotter but both are approaching their mid-20s and haven't yet made a breakthrough. Any truth to the BJ Botha rumours from about a month ago?

 

[munstermuffin]

Snoop agreed but I think in fairness Hayes served us well but fact we neglected it a bit meant he has been used for last 2 years or so when he should be just enjoying his time on the farm.
We don't have many on the books and while I agree with you about Dave Ryan been better at loosehead he is considered an option more at TH.
Archer won't cut it at this level.
Borlaise will be good as in people forget he's in training for past 12 months now non-stop and needs a break.
Darragh Hurley can play TH but is a LH. Sort of the same as Du Preez in he can do a decent emergency job but not permanent TH.
Alan Cotter in the academy is a good TH from Cookies and doing fine job in AIL.
Pa O'Regan is fine prop comfortable on both sides but I think he will be a LH in time

 

[profitius]

Are Munster having trials for props? UCC's John Ryan was mentioned too a while back.

I'd say they'll have to let some props go.

 

[munstermuffin]

What we do is invite different guys in from various clubs but also keep eye on schools and AIL

 

[snoopy snoopy dog dog]

There are good props in the AIL. Jerry Cronin has stepped up for Ulster this year and looked decent. Rob Sweeney has similarly done okay at loosehead for Connacht while I've been really impressed with Simon Shawe for Leinster. In 8 games he's held his own, only struggling once against Connacht. For a guy coming from amateur rugby, that's no mean feat.

In the Irish Times today it's said that Mike Ross is happy to stay with Leinster. This saga is going to run and run.

 

[munstermuffin]

He will meet Munster officialls tomorrow but I'm sure Mike will be happy either way.
We do need a big recruitment of props though as we are well off the required standard at TH

 

[snoopy snoopy dog dog]

The Irish Indo is also saying today that Mike Ross is unlikely to move to Munster but BJ Botha may be open to a move if the money is right. Ulster suffering instead of Leinster would be fine by me!

If Ross joins Munster, I suspect he'd get a nice big 3 year deal with a scrum coaching gig at the end of it. That would be too hard to turn down.

Botha would be a quick fix. He's a very good scrummager but isn't great elsewhere. Then again, what Munster need is a player to lock the scrum and they can leave the ball carrying to others.

 

[munstermuffin]

Only thing there Snoop is we have to watch our NIQ allocation. I know we have spots open but we would rather Irish TH. BJ would be good but I'd still prefer Ross and yes he'd get a lengthy contract. But I would think the Jamie Hagan deal too is dependant on Ross coming.
Also interesting to see Bracken rise from nowhere looking to be signed

 

[Logorrhea]

The Irish Indo is also saying.

Farrelly hasnt a clue what hes talking about. He has had Ross going everywhere, Botha going everywhere, Healip and Sexton to leave. He makes **** up.

Ross is in negotiation with the IRFU for a central contract, thats the only reason he has yet to resign with Leinster. He wont be moving anywhere.

Hagan is coming back to cover for Ross and Healy who will both be at the World Cup for half of next season. There is plenty of room for all of them.

 

[munstermuffin]

Logorrhea I think Munster would appeal to Ross in a big way as it is his home province. Hagan is a quality player and I doubt he'd return to just cover when Ross is at world cup. Leinster have Newland and Wright already.

 

[Teh Mite]

http://www.rte.ie/sport/rugby/sixnations/2011/0217/rossm.html