A Political Thread pt. 2

[ncurd]

These sound like some pretty extreme circles to be honest. Maybe you have your finger on the right wing pulse better than me but this just sounds like standard "White Replacement Theory" ********. I wouldn't tar the majority of right leaning/right wing people with this brush.

You're probably right that it's growing, though. However, I'm not sure pandering to these kind of extreme views is the way to go. That doesn't mean to say that we should, as I said above, tar everyone who has concerns around immigration as racist white replacement theorists.

Regardless anyone saying they see too many minorities on TV and its makes them angry is racist.

I think that's a pretty uncontroversial opinion apart from racists do not like being called racist.

 

[Welsh Exile]

Regardless anyone saying they see too many minorities on TV and its makes them angry is racist.

I think that's a pretty uncontroversial opinion apart from racists do not like being called racist.

I would say a lot probably are but not all. I’d also say that maybe bigot would be a better word to describe most who hold these views (with some being undoubtedly racist)

 

[dirty harry]

These sound like some pretty extreme circles to be honest. Maybe you have your finger on the right wing pulse better than me but this just sounds like standard "White Replacement Theory" ********. I wouldn't tar the majority of right leaning/right wing people with this brush.

You're probably right that it's growing, though. However, I'm not sure pandering to these kind of extreme views is the way to go. That doesn't mean to say that we should, as I said above, tar everyone who has concerns around immigration as racist white replacement theorists.

It used to be extreme, but i think youd be amazed how main stream these things are now, the fact that politicians are testing the water to discuss race issue in the context of white victimisation.

If there was a culture war we are losing by a country mile, im seeing this stuff everywhere recently. Noticing, fatigue, culture etc...

The algorithm really is radicalising all sides, i would determine quite a few people here radical in their views, the same on other boards, and even in real life, from all angles.

So the question is, is noticing these things racist, like the fact channel 4 reported that 50% of adverts use black people?

Is infact even discussing something like the Kalergi theory racist?

 

[dirty harry]

Regardless anyone saying they see too many minorities on TV and its makes them angry is racist.

I think that's a pretty uncontroversial opinion apart from racists do not like being called racist.

Racists definately dont care about being called racist any more, it is meaningless because groups of mums and grandmas sitting around wearing pink asking for children to be safe are being called it lol

Infact i think the general public just chategorise anyone who uses the term racist these days as a lefty lunatic with all the same pilitical opinions.

 

[Welsh Exile]

It used to be extreme, but i think youd be amazed how main stream these things are now, the fact that politicians are testing the water to discuss race issue in the context of white victimisation.

If there was a culture war we are losing by a country mile, im seeing this stuff everywhere recently. Noticing, fatigue, culture etc...

The algorithm really is radicalising all sides, i would determine quite a few people here radical in their views, the same on other boards, and even in real life, from all angles.

So the question is, is noticing these things racist, like the fact channel 4 reported that 50% of adverts use black people?

Is infact even discussing something like the Kalergi theory racist?

I've never heard of any of "noticing" "fatigue" or "Kalergi Theory" so you're probably right about the algorithm but I'd also suggest it's not quite mainstream either as I'm a pretty mainstream guy to be honest. (Though I'm not exactly an expert as this sorry place is the only forum I frequent)

I don't think noticing trends in race or anything like that is inherently racist as that would be a stupid position to take. It's what you do and how you apply that information to whatever world view you have that is the bit that could potentially be a bit suss.

 

[Welsh Exile]

Racists definately dont care about being called racist any more, it is meaningless because groups of mums and grandmas sitting around wearing pink asking for children to be safe are being called it lol

Infact i think the general public just chategorise anyone who uses the term racist these days as a lefty lunatic with all the same pilitical opinions.

I'm not sure, historically speaking, racists have ever been bothered about being called racists. In fact many, most even, would be proud.

 

[ncurd]

I'm not sure, historically speaking, racists have ever been bothered about being called racists. In fact many, most even, would be proud.

Some racists sure but there are the racists who don't realise they are racist the "I'm not racist but" crowd.

I would say a lot probably are but not all. I'd also say that maybe bigot would be a better word to describe most who hold these views (with some being undoubtedly racist)

Can't say there much difference between bigotry and racism if I'm honest. Racism is just the more specific term for a type of bigotry.

 

[dirty harry]

Some racists sure but there are the racists who don't realise they are racist the "I'm not racist but" crowd.

Can't say there much difference between bigotry and racism if I'm honest. Racism is just the more specific term for a type of bigotry.

This is the greatest example of what im talking about, those who say theyre not racist just dont know theyre racist...

Its why the word means nothing any more.

So is noticing that black and asian people are massively over represented in adverts in the UK racist?

 

[Welsh Exile]

Some racists sure but there are the racists who don't realise they are racist the "I'm not racist but" crowd.

Can't say there much difference between bigotry and racism if I'm honest. Racism is just the more specific term for a type of bigotry.

For me racism has to entail some kind of belief of superiority of your race over others. Bigots can just not like other races without thinking they’re superior to them in some way. All racists are bigots but not all bigots are racist kind of thing. Some people (a lot even) are just xenophobic and generally don’t like any foreigners no matter what colour their skin is.

I can appreciate this may seem like a subtle distinction but it’s an important one in my opinion.

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

Regardless anyone saying they see too many minorities on TV and its makes them angry is racist.

I think that's a pretty uncontroversial opinion apart from racists do not like being called racist.

I'm sorry but I disagree. If it makes then angry then certainly but if people push an argument that adverts etc should be representative of the country and then they end up even less representative than before, that's hypocrisy.

If we take it to it's logical conclusion, if straight white people ended up being in a small minority of adverts, would you say that it has achieved the target of making them representative or failed?

Much as it's not PC to say it, a representative sample of the British population is still mostly straight and white.

 

[ncurd]

I'm sorry but I disagree. If it makes then angry then certainly but if people push an argument that adverts etc should be representative of the country and then they end up even less representative than before, that's hypocrisy.

If we take it to it's logical conclusion, if straight white people ended up being in a small minority of adverts, would you say that it has achieved the target of making them representative or failed?

Much as it's not PC to say it, a representative sample of the British population is still mostly straight and white.

Utter nonsense mainly because why should representation of adverts actually matter, why are people spending any time thinking about it? Unless its zero/negligible representation as per the past for minorities.

 

[dirty harry]

Utter nonsense mainly because why should representation of adverts actually matter, why are people spending any time thinking about it? Unless its zero/negligible representation as per the past for minorities.

Because advertisers use psycholical and algorithmic strategies to manipulate as much as they can...

They utilise as many demographics as possible to sell products to as many people as possible. I think thats why demographics in advertising are always going to be skewed.

But those who are obsessed with diversity, are obsessed with replacing straight white people in any aspect, and i think its fare to push back on that.

There is a huge difference between telling a specific story of a black hero during ww2, and race swapping british monarchy in the 11th century.

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

Utter nonsense mainly because why should representation of adverts actually matter, why are people spending any time thinking about it? Unless its zero/negligible representation as per the past for minorities.

Because that's the argument that's been pushed for why they are that way...

People spent time thinking about it when minorities were under represented so why is it now wrong to spend time thinking about it when they are over represented?

You can't have it both ways.

There is a double standard when it comes to things like racism, representation etc and it's part of what is fueling the current rise of the far right. The absolute worst thing when trying to convince someone that something is right is to be a hypocrite about it.

Things like race swapping, cultural gatekeeping, racist language etc are all vilified when the instigator is white but barely cause a stir if a member of a minority does it. Let's not pretend this isn't a thing because it really is.

 

[ncurd]

Because that's the argument that's been pushed for why they are that way...

People spent time thinking about it when minorities were under represented so why is it now wrong to spend time thinking about it when they are over represented?

You can't have it both ways.

Are cis-white-het people still in adverts? Last I checked they were and even if the Channel 4 stat is correct still make up the majority of adverts...

Even then the bit I object to most is the idea over representation of minorities makes you angry.

Personally I've never felt under represented in media for my entire life (except when nerds were mainly portrayed as a joke, laughing at as opposed to laughing with).

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

Are cis-white-het people still in adverts? Last I checked they were and even if the Channel 4 stat is correct still make up the majority of adverts...

Even then the bit I object to most is the idea over representation of minorities makes you angry.

Personally I've never felt under represented in media for my entire life (except when nerds were mainly portrayed as a joke, laughing at as opposed to laughing with).

Over representation of minorities doesn't make me angry, hypocrisy and virtue signalling do.

I'm all for equal rights and representation for all people. I'm opposed to special treatment, pandering, double standards and injustice.

I'll happily oppose the white nationalists, the homophobes, the misogynists etc out there who want to oppress anyone who doesn't fit in their group. In fact I oppose any who want to oppress or control any other group. At times cis straight white males ARE the victim of that. Not often and on balance as a group we have more perks than downsides but pretending it never happens and there are none is simply not true.

 

[ncurd]

Over representation of minorities doesn't make me angry, hypocrisy and virtue signalling do.

I'm all for equal rights and representation for all people. I'm opposed to special treatment, pandering, double standards and injustice.

I'll happily oppose the white nationalists, the homophobes, the misogynists etc out there who want to oppress anyone who doesn't fit in their group. In fact I oppose any who want to oppress or control any other group. At times cis straight white males ARE the victim of that. Not often and on balance as a group we have more perks than downsides but pretending it never happens and there are none is simply not true.

Yes but it not happening over TV adverts is it?

Do you honestly think this an issue worthy of calling it anything other than what it is?

 

[General Melchett]

This extends beyond TV adverts. The goal of soap operas and other TV programmes is to maximise views/ratings and the best way to achieve that goal is to ensure the cast covers a broad range of ethnic minority groups and other groups including LGBTQ+ in order to attract more viewers.

That's why many soap operas will have a black family, an Asian family, young people, old people, disabled actors, characters of different faiths and LGBTQ+ representation. You're never going to get a fair reflection of British society with so many competing groups and a limited cast of actors.

 

[Saintjay]

Over representation of minorities doesn't make me angry, hypocrisy and virtue signalling do.

I'm all for equal rights and representation for all people. I'm opposed to special treatment, pandering, double standards and injustice.

I'll happily oppose the white nationalists, the homophobes, the misogynists etc out there who want to oppress anyone who doesn't fit in their group. In fact I oppose any who want to oppress or control any other group. At times cis straight white males ARE the victim of that. Not often and on balance as a group we have more perks than downsides but pretending it never happens and there are none is simply not true.

It does happen and has for years and in a employment perspective is illegal. The police aim for if 6% of the county is from a ethnic minority background then the work force should reflect that.

The below article is when Gloucester Police rejected white males. In 2023 they then got criticised for a photo of 27 recruits who were white. Guess they can't win.

BBC NEWS | UK | England | Gloucestershire | Force admits rejecting white men

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

Yes but it not happening over TV adverts is it?

Do you honestly think this an issue worthy of calling it anything other than what it is?

Well it is, and it's not just limited to adverts.

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

It does happen and has for years and in a employment perspective is illegal. The police aim for if 6% of the county is from a ethnic minority background then the work force should reflect that.

The below article is when Gloucester Police rejected white males. In 2023 they then got criticised for a photo of 27 recruits who were white. Guess they can't win.

BBC NEWS | UK | England | Gloucestershire | Force admits rejecting white men

I think the fact that active discrimination against the majority was labelled "positive action" itself shows the double standards.

It's a term you see a lot less these days because it was such a ridiculous term for active discrimination.