Bok watch 2017

[TRF_stormer2010]

With the week still young and not much else to discuss but with 6 rounds gone and the men starting to be sorted from the boys what are your thoughts looking at SR form going into the Bok matches vs France? How is the form of current Bokke and who is pushing for game?

 

[TRF_heineken]

Well, I think we have a bit of a problem in certain positions, such as scrumhalf and flyhalf, but then we have oodles of talent in other positions.

Here's my recomendations from what I've seen so far:

Loose Head Prop:
Thomas Du Toit (Sharks)
Oli Kebble (Stormers)
Ox Nche (Cheetahs) - He is currently injured.

Hooker:
Malcolm Marx (Lions)
Akker van der Merwe (Lions)
Franco Marais (Sharks)

Tighthead Prop:
Coenie Oosthuizen (Sharks)
Frans Malherbe (Stormers)
Jacques van Rooyen (Lions)

Locks:
Eben Etzebeth (Stormers)
Pieter-Steph Du Toit (Stormers)
Lood De Jager (Bulls)
RG Snyman (Bulls)
Franco Mostert (Lions)

Flankers:
Sikhumbuzo Notshe (Stormers)
Jean-Luc Du Preez (Sharks)
Chris Cloete (Kings)
Ruan Steenkamp (Bulls)
Teboho Mohoje (Cheetahs)
Jaco Kriel (Lions)
Ruan Ackerman (Lions)

No. 8:
Warren Whiteley (Lions)
Siya Kolisi (Stormers)
Tera Mtembu (Sharks)

Scrumhalf:
Jano Vermaak (Stormers)
Cobus Reinach (Sharks)
Shaun Venter (Cheetahs)

Fly Half:
Curwin Bosch (Sharks)
Neil Marais (Cheetahs)
Elton Jantjies (Lions)

Centres:
Rohan Janse van Rensburg (Lions)
Lukhanyo Am (Sharks)
EW Viljoen (Stormers)
Francois Venter (Cheetahs)
Clinton Swart (Cheetahs)
Jan Serfontein (Bulls)

Wings:
Raymond Rhule (Cheetahs)
Travis Ismaiel (Bulls)
Lwazi Mvovo (Sharks)
Courtnall Skosan (Lions)
Kobus van Wyk (Sharks)

Fullback:
Andries Coetzee (Lions)
Jesse Kriel (Bulls)
Cheslin Kolbe (Stormers)

A lot of guys who are currently boks, I didn't mention as they are either injured or horribly out of form.

 

[saulan]

Loose Head Prop:
Oli Kebble (Stormers)

Scrumhalf:
Jano Vermaak (Stormers)

Fly Half:
Neil Marais (Cheetahs)

Centres:
EW Viljoen (Stormers)

Fullback:
Cheslin Kolbe (Stormers)

Just left the ones in there I wanted to comment on.

No point including Kebble on there, continuity wise he is overseas next season and there is no point blooding someone new if he won't be around for the next two to three years. I wouldn't be surprised if he has English ambitions.

I honestly think Duvenhage has been the better scrumhalf for the Stormers, he doesn't snipe as much, but has been very consistent with a much improved passing technique since going overseas. He has less injury concerns, and is 28 instead of 32.

I don't think Neil Marais should be on that list, this past week he wasn't used as first choice flyhalf for his team, and especially after seeing how well Rob Du Preez did at flyhalf against his team.

I think it's a bit early to be speaking of EW Viljoen as a Springbok, he has played well, but I would like to see more of him this season before I would put him in the running.

Kolbe shouldn't be the Stormers option for the fullback position, SP Marais should, he has made a huge difference in our backline since the start of the season.

 

[TRF_heineken]

Just left the ones in there I wanted to comment on.

No point including Kebble on there, continuity wise he is overseas next season and there is no point blooding someone new if he won't be around for the next two to three years. I wouldn't be surprised if he has English ambitions.

I honestly think Duvenhage has been the better scrumhalf for the Stormers, he doesn't snipe as much, but has been very consistent with a much improved passing technique since going overseas. He has less injury concerns, and is 28 instead of 32.

I don't think Neil Marais should be on that list, this past week he wasn't used as first choice flyhalf for his team, and especially after seeing how well Rob Du Preez did at flyhalf against his team.

I think it's a bit early to be speaking of EW Viljoen as a Springbok, he has played well, but I would like to see more of him this season before I would put him in the running.

Kolbe shouldn't be the Stormers option for the fullback position, SP Marais should, he has made a huge difference in our backline since the start of the season.

Keep in mind that this is purely on the players that is currently playing in Super Rugby. And I agree with you on all the aspects you mentioned, but if we are going to pick a bok team solely on SR players then this is the guys I'd like to be mentioned.

Kebble - I know he might be lost to SA rugby, but it begs the question on whether Steven Kitshoff will be allowed to play for the Bokke this year? he doesn't have enough caps to be selected based on the new overseas player policy. If we pick him now and he goes abroad, then he's lost to them forever, and to us for the near foreseeable future. But he's still very young.

Vermaak has been IMHO the form scrumhalf of all the SA teams. Jano is also already a bok, so his selection won't "cheapen" the Bok jersey any further.

I picked Marais because the other flyhalves haven't impressed me at all, and this includes Du Preez, Pollard and even Zeilinga. Marais has now also shown his versatility in being able to play at 12. But again, by lack of more players raising their hand, I chose him above others. If Pollard plays like he did against the Chiefs or even better than that, then he'll slot in ahead of Marais.

EW Viljoen has been a breath of fresh air. I can certainly see him being picked. He has unbelievable skill in offloading at the tackle, something our other backline players need to learn, he's solid on defence, and he can spot a gap. Sure it's still early, but he has been a threat every week.

SP Marais, ugh. I'm concerned about him. When he was at the Sharks, Kings and the Bulls he played a few games very well, and then self-destruct. I hope that it doesn't happen as he has been doing an amazing job for the Stormers. But neither he nor Kolbe would in any case be my first choice. As Andries Coetzee is my current favourite in the fullback position. He also has a massive boot on him.

 

[TRF_stormer2010]

I'm going to have a somewhat 'holistic' approach here focussing on SR but not leaving overseas based players totally out of the picture;

1
S Kitshoff - simply because he is confirmed as coming back next year. I wouldn't know if that is good enough for SARU to warrant his selection. I wouldn't pick Kebble to 'spoil' him for England. Sure, he is young and a bit of a prospect but it just makes the Bok jersey even cheaper than it already is IMO. Back-up beyond Kitshoff should probably then be black for the sake of numbers and giving us options elsewhere so then Ox Nche is a good shout. I like Thomas du Toit as well. Rotating these youngsters should give us plenty of options in the future. No real bolters here but Nche looked good when fit and Du Toit is steadily growing into a world class prop.

2
Malcolm Marx - has looked more secure in his line-out throwing and he has shown he can bring that physicality at test level the few chances he has had. I have Bongi Mbonambi and Akker van der Merwe as bench options.

3
Wilco Louw - I have revisited this spot. I'd prefer WP Nel but he is a Scot now. Malherbe has been eased in so need to have a close watch there. Koch is out of the running. I don't like the idea of Coenie in green still. This might be bias but I am backing Stormers greenhorn Wilco Louw.

4
Eben Etzebeth - no surprises here. Move right along.

5
PS du Toit - again, no surprises and this lock combination should be the core we build our pack around. Both established world class test locks. De Jager has yet to recapture form but TBH I'm not overly concerned as he has always looked a lot better in green than any other color. I'm backing him to step up in the test arena. SR- especially the way the Cheetahs and Bulls play- is not the type of format for that big frame to flourish in. Franco Mostert as back up so no bolters here. None needed.

6
Jaco Kriel - Coetzee would be my 1st choice but he is currently based overseas (and Heineken says he's injured too boot) and only on 28 caps.. not sure what the deal is there. The man should come back to SA as we are short of specialist fetchers though he is a bit of an all-rounder he is good enough at the breakdown for me to lump him into that category I think. Kriel is another pilferer/carrier. Should do fine here. Kolisi a bit of a 6/7 rather than out-and-out openside but a good all-round bench option. The only guy I can put down as a potential bolter here is Chris Cloete who is hurt by playing for the Kings. WP should never have let him go and I called it. Francois Louw.. is out of the hearts and minds of SA IMO. We simply cannot compare apples with oranges.

7
JL du Preez - Could actually be one of many I don't care the margins are so tight but here is where I am rooting for the bolters. JL du Preez, Mohoje (though he is already capped), and then 3 players that can cover 8 in a pinch in Notshe, and the two Ruans, Steenkamp and Ackermann (can cover 8). I don't necessarily have a firm favorite. It depends on the other positions and I'd pick here for balance. Alberts hasn't had a bad Bok game (I can remember) but I can't get myself thinking past our younger options looking ahead to 2019.

8
Warren Whiteley - I'd give him this series as a last chance. Vermeulen might be in with a shout of selection but I don't know if comments regarding SA rugby might have hurt his chances. I think Toetie might fancy what he brings though. I'm looking at no.8 for Bok captain either way. I've already mentioned the young no.7 cum 8 players I fancy to do bench duty and function as back-up.

edit; forgot about Jannes Kirsten until Heineken brought him up below- thanks. Will edit out Coetzee as well- didn't know he was injured. I think Kitshoff being confirmed for returning next year should be good enough to warrant selection. So for me, a mostly Stormers tight 5, Lions backrow and Sharks featuring more on the bench; 16) Mbonambi/A vd Merwe, 17) T du Toit, 18) F Malherbe/C Oosthuizen, 19) L de Jager/F Mostert, 20) Siya Kolisi

 

[TRF_heineken]

Even if Kitshoff returns next year, It won't help him this year, as he's currently still playing overseas, and doesn't make the 30-cap cut to be selected. So he can only be a viable option if he either returns earlier, or if Toetie pulls a few strings to make him the exception to the rule. I wish actually that Lizo Gqoboka gets more starts for the Bulls as I really think he can be a contender for the loose head position. He showed last year what a mobile unit he is and his scrummaging is improving a lot.

Marcell Coetzee got injured again, did you miss that article? http://www.sport24.co.za/Rugby/Springboks/marcell-coetzee-suffers-knee-injury-20170313 Seems like he's out for the whole year. I'd stick with Jaco Kriel, he needs to make that jumper his own, and luckily for us it seems like he's one of those guys that doesn't suffer from the 2nd year syndrome... I hope Roelof Smit can recover quick enough.

The Blindside position is still a bit of a tussle for me in choosing an out and out favourite, bear in mind that Ruan Steenkamp is actually an openside flanker. One guy I forgot to mention is Jannes Kirsten. And he had a good run against the Chiefs after his injury problems. He reminds me a lot of Juan Smith, in that he's a workhorse and puts in a lot of tackles.

One guy I'd like to see make a step up in whichever position he plays, is Kwagga Smith. it's a pity he's used mostly off the bench.

 

[TRF_stormer2010]

9
Reinach, Duvenhage, Vermaak, De Klerk, Cronje all options. I can't split them so at this stage its up fr grabs to my mind. Just hoping we don't see Pienaar or Hougaard sneak in.

10
Here's another spot I'd like to keep tabs on. If fit then Lambie is my man. Pollard needs to step up. His playing very deep and tentatively. Goosen is an enigma. Jantjies I have question marks over his BMT. Its probs too earl for Bosch. Du Preez and Du Plessis need to settle it at the Stormers and prove themselves in big games. A lot of options and good prospects. That means little if it doesn't translate to on-field performances on the day. ATM I am excited by the prospects of Bosch. I feel we have enough other options at 15 and there are asterisks next to the names of each of the encumbents; Pollard/Lambie/Jantjies/Steyn/Goosen.

11
Oh, how I wished we'd have seen more from Senatla by now. Lleyds in with a shout. So too Rhule and Van Wyk. Up for grabs really. Surely we won't see Habana again? I'll revisit this one later on. Might throw in a consolation Bulls or Cheetahs player here.

12
Rohan Janse van Rensburg - even if De Allende wasn't unfit.

13
EW Viljoen - my bolter and probably most daring call. Will be tested properly over the next 5 weeks so might cement his spot in my XV or drop out- we'll have to see but I'm calling it early. Am looking good at the Sharkies. Mapoe didn't have a great time with the Bokke and is in and out in any case. Francois Venter maybe but with the burly RjvR a must for me inside I like the vision, soft touches and extra boot Viljoen adds and he isn't tiny either.

14
Ruan Combrinck - if fit our most complete locally based winger. Kobus van Wyk looks in good form for the Sharks but I still see him as the guy that dropped way too many balls on the Stormers wide channel. I like the look of that Tambwe fella at the Lions but he need game. Lleyds in with an outside chance. Not big but dependable and has a knack to make good decisions.

15
Andries Coetzee / SP Marais - a two horse race and the good thing is they play a similar brand of rugby. Marais has lost a year at the Bulls and needs to prove himself against tougher opposition but is in top form.

 

[TRF_stormer2010]

Maybe not all Bokke but my SR form XV at this stage;

1 Thomas du Toit
2 If it weren't for out line-out woes I'd say Mbonambi but as is I'm backing Marx
3 Coenie Oosthuizen and I can't believe I'm saying that.
4 Eben Etzebeth has been in good form which bodes well for the national side
5 PS du Toit
6 Jaco Kriel
7 Jean-Luc du Preez
8 Sikhumbuzo Notshe
9 Dewald Duvenhage
10 Curwin Bosch / Rob du Preez
11 Dilyn Lleyds
12 Rohan Janse van Rensburg / Andre Esterhuyzen
13 EW Viljoen
14 Jakobus van Wyk
15 SP Marais / Curwin Bosch

 

[TRF_stormer2010]

Nyakane putting his hand up. I want to see more appearances like that but the Bulls seem to struggle at the scrum while the Stormers and Sharks are topping the scrum %'s. I wouldn't know how much is due to Nyakane himself but we can only judge on team performance at scrum time since you don't scrum as an individual. His versatility (and skin color or am I being unfair?) means he should at least make the squad and probably bench even if possibly not starting.

Jaco Kriel does not have enough Bok caps considering his form over the last 3/4 years. Whiteley looked good in the tight but the Stormers back three aren't known for being overly abbrasive.. I'll add both these into my mix.

I don't want too read too much into the Lions v Stormers though as I think got away with a lot though I'll concede they were the better team on the park.. just.. and very grudgingly. Rohan Janse van Rensburg apparently out for a long spell. Sad for the Bokke. I had him and EW Viljoen down as shoe ins for centre.

That's about all that's changed for me if at all.

 

[TRF_heineken]

Nyakane putting his hand up. I want to see more appearances like that but the Bulls seem to struggle at the scrum while the Stormers and Sharks are topping the scrum %'s. I wouldn't know how much is due to Nyakane himself but we can only judge on team performance at scrum time since you don't scrum as an individual. His versatility (and skin color or am I being unfair?) means he should at least make the squad and probably bench even if possibly not starting.

Jaco Kriel does not have enough Bok caps considering his form over the last 3/4 years. Whiteley looked good in the tight but the Stormers back three aren't known for being overly abbrasive.. I'll add both these into my mix.

I don't want too read too much into the Lions v Stormers though as I think got away with a lot though I'll concede they were the better team on the park.. just.. and very grudgingly. Rohan Janse van Rensburg apparently out for a long spell. Sad for the Bokke. I had him and EW Viljoen down as shoe ins for centre.

That's about all that's changed for me if at all.

Nyakane, is probably one of the choices that will be made due to his skin colour, but he did hold up his part at scrumtime too. I would really like to see him and Gqoboka start together for the Bulls, as both of them are mobile props.

I thought Warren Whiteley wasn't as effective as he normally is. He is starting to remind me a bit of Pierre Spies. As soon as the game becomes tight, he's not as prominent as he should be.

I feel very sorry for Rohan. He certainly was a shoe-in choice at 12. But this brings us back to the rumour mill, that Handre Pollard might be slotted into the 12 position with someone like Lambie or Jantjies at 10.

 

[unrated]

I see Rapport alleges that SARU has notified their intention of calling up Bissy and Frans to Montpellier. Let's hope this is true, will immediately be more confident in the Springboks.

 

[TRF_heineken]

I see Rapport alleges that SARU has notified their intention of calling up Bissy and Frans to Montpellier. Let's hope this is true, will immediately be more confident in the Springboks.

Well, it is 2 areas where we will need their expertise.

Especially at centre where all our potential choices are dropping like flies with injury, or will most definitely get a lengthy ban for stupid play...