Canada: moving forward.

[LittleGuy]

Will someone arrest the doppelganger that has obviously taken over Chauncey O'Toole's body since the end of the 2011 RWC!!!!




Yesh SMS really dropped off the face of the planet for the national team after the disaster the forwards had in Tbilisi in November 2010(I just saw he played in the Portgual game the week after forgot about that), he's still playing well in the RFU Championship and Albion love him. Don't think we'll ever see him back in the colours again though barring some sort of "Loose forward" plague hitting the side.

 

[canadafan]

It is almost like he has just given up.

 

[canadafan]

Don't think so, it would take an epic run of injuries for that to happen.

 

[LittleGuy]

Don't think so, it would take an epic run of injuries for that to happen.

My thoughts as well and likely on a European tour, where he would be readily available. Speaking of players that left after the November 2010 tour, I beleive Josh Jackson retired but could never confirm it, Montois released him last year and Jeff Hull had told me Jackson was still looking for another club but I don't think he found one so I'd assumed he'd retired, unless he's hiding in Federale 1 or something.

 

[canadafan]

Yeah thought as much about JJ. So you know Jeff Hull? What kind of inside scoop do you get from him? Anything good?

 

[canadafan]

By the way, next time you talk to Jeff Hull, tell him to talk up Flagg big time so he can get a contract over in Europe.

 

[LittleGuy]

Yeah thought as much about JJ. So you know Jeff Hull? What kind of inside scoop do you get from him? Anything good?

Occasional TRF poster Melhor Time(used to be a regular on here but can't post much due to his contract) talks to him frequently and sometimes realys me important info, I've only exchanged a couple of emails back and forth with Jeff over the years, just asking about a couple of players that have slipped through the cracks.

 

[Canadian_Rugger]

I honestly think O'toole's biggest problem is a lack of confidence. I think after the season he had at Osprey's his confidence took a real shake which is why he has never been able to regain the form he had prior to that season. I read on his twitter that he elected to take some time off this June and not tour with the team. This maybe is the best thing for him honestly and will give him some time to think about whether he wants to keep playing or not. Honestly, if I were Chauncey I would be thinking about quitting, he has no education and has been focused pretty much on rugby since he left high school, he is at that age where if you haven't cracked the big time yet you probably aren't going to and their are up and comers on the team who are hungry and want to start. I have a feeling O'toole gets left in the dust or maybe chooses to focus on Sevens instead.

My team in August:

1. Buydens
2. Barkwill
3. Marshall
4. Hotson
5. Cudmore
6. Sinclair
7. Ardron
8. Carpenter
9. White
10. Braid (Braid at flyhalf or Evans, if Evans comes on at flyhalf Braid goes to the bench)
11. Evans
12. Mackenzie
13. Van De Merwe
14. Hassler (I feel you gotta start this kid, he has phenomenal pace and has game changing ability)
15. Pritchard

16. Hamilton
17. Tieddemann
18. Wooldridge
19. Phelan/Beukeboom (either guy is a good fit for me)
20. Dala/Moonlight (Dala is a beast and he is def my impact sub but I was very impressed with Moonlight and his ability to get go forward ball)
21. Mack
22. Underwood (I like Underwood and I think he has a lot of potential)
23. Trainor (Trainor is good, but I will go with the pro's before I go with him)

Overall, I was very satisfied with the rugby Canada played this June. I saw some solid prospects and I believe we are steadily improving. We are starting to produce some real athletes and have some depth. I was even impressed with guys like Tay Paris, yah he made some boneheaded moves but the kid is so young and he is playing pro again this year with Agen which will only make him better.

 

[LittleGuy]

I honestly think O'toole's biggest problem is a lack of confidence. I think after the season he had at Osprey's his confidence took a real shake which is why he has never been able to regain the form he had prior to that season. I read on his twitter that he elected to take some time off this June and not tour with the team. This maybe is the best thing for him honestly and will give him some time to think about whether he wants to keep playing or not. Honestly, if I were Chauncey I would be thinking about quitting, he has no education and has been focused pretty much on rugby since he left high school, he is at that age where if you haven't cracked the big time yet you probably aren't going to and their are up and comers on the team who are hungry and want to start. I have a feeling O'toole gets left in the dust or maybe chooses to focus on Sevens instead.

My team in August:

1. Buydens
2. Barkwill
3. Marshall
4. Hotson
5. Cudmore
6. Sinclair
7. Ardron
8. Carpenter
9. White
10. Braid (Braid at flyhalf or Evans, if Evans comes on at flyhalf Braid goes to the bench)
11. Evans
12. Mackenzie
13. Van De Merwe
14. Hassler (I feel you gotta start this kid, he has phenomenal pace and has game changing ability)
15. Pritchard

16. Hamilton
17. Tieddemann
18. Wooldridge
19. Phelan/Beukeboom (either guy is a good fit for me)
20. Dala/Moonlight (Dala is a beast and he is def my impact sub but I was very impressed with Moonlight and his ability to get go forward ball)
21. Mack
22. Underwood (I like Underwood and I think he has a lot of potential)
23. Trainor (Trainor is good, but I will go with the pro's before I go with him)

Overall, I was very satisfied with the rugby Canada played this June. I saw some solid prospects and I believe we are steadily improving. We are starting to produce some real athletes and have some depth. I was even impressed with guys like Tay Paris, yah he made some boneheaded moves but the kid is so young and he is playing pro again this year with Agen which will only make him better.

Yeah I was probably a little harsh in my assesment earlier he has tons of time to grow and as Shaggy said earlier in the thread getting every one healthy at the exact same time is very difficult these days in rugby, Paris will be donning the Canadian jersey for a long time to come. I wonder if Agen will release him for any of the 7's events this year? I also think his move there was good, he played well for Glasgow and their feeder clubs but didn't get alot of game time.

 

[Canadian_Rugger]

Somebody needs to explain this one to me. I have heard Sean-Michel Stephen's name bounced around here a few times. What the heck ever happened to the guy? He is still playing professionally in Europe and is even Captaining Plymouth Albion so why did he have a falling out with the Canadian program?

 

[LittleGuy]

Somebody needs to explain this one to me. I have heard Sean-Michel Stephen's name bounced around here a few times. What the heck ever happened to the guy? He is still playing professionally in Europe and is even Captaining Plymouth Albion so why did he have a falling out with the Canadian program?

Is still captaining Plymouth Albion and I beleive was once again their player of the year for the 2nd year running. To be honest I have no idea what happened, he never seemed to get a crack at the starting lineup with Crowley mainly came in on the 19-20 jersey. I never noticed him playing terribly for us,(though maybe not great either). He is 30 now so maybe I can understand the need to move on but I was pretty surpised he was left off the 2011 RWC squad in favour of Jeremy Kyne.

There was a lot of turnover after the November 2010 tour with a number of Canadian players ending their international careers there, Josh Jackson, SMS, Tkachuk, Gudgeon, Pletch(with the exception of his emergency recall against Italy in 2012). Georgia beat the living crap out of our forward packs in that 22-15 win they had over us, and Canada failed to turn the screws against Portugal as well, though we narrowly won.

Maybe there was a personality clash, or SMS decided to retire from international play in order to focus on his roles at Albion and this just never got around Canadian rugby circles?

My nominee for fastest dissapearing Canadian talent ever: Dave Spicer!! Did he finally get his doctorate? Is he still playing in the CDI?

One thing that has to improve from June...in our five games we were outscored in final twenty in four of them, for a combined margin of 51-12 against in final quarters.(Not including a 58 minute Irish try which would make this look even worse.)

 

[Canadian_Rugger]

Is still captaining Plymouth Albion and I beleive was once again their player of the year for the 2nd year running. To be honest I have no idea what happened, he never seemed to get a crack at the starting lineup with Crowley mainly came in on the 19-20 jersey. I never noticed him playing terribly for us,(though maybe not great either). He is 30 now so maybe I can understand the need to move on but I was pretty surpised he was left off the 2011 RWC squad in favour of Jeremy Kyne.

There was a lot of turnover after the November 2010 tour with a number of Canadian players ending their international careers there, Josh Jackson, SMS, Tkachuk, Gudgeon, Pletch(with the exception of his emergency recall against Italy in 2012). Georgia beat the living crap out of our forward packs in that 22-15 win they had over us, and Canada failed to turn the screws against Portugal as well, though we narrowly won.

Maybe there was a personality clash, or SMS decided to retire from international play in order to focus on his roles at Albion and this just never got around Canadian rugby circles?

My nominee for fastest dissapearing Canadian talent ever: Dave Spicer!! Did he finally get his doctorate? Is he still playing in the CDI?

One thing that has to improve from June...in our five games we were outscored in final twenty in four of them, for a combined margin of 51-12 against in final quarters.(Not including a 58 minute Irish try which would make this look even worse.)

Yah I kind of have a feeling SMS had a falling out with the coaching staff which is why he has never been brought back in the fold. He is clearly a talented player as he has been able to not only hold down a place playing pro but also captain an english championship side. What I heard about Dave Spicer was all he did when he was with Auch in the Top 14 was party. I heard both he and Mensah-Coker were quite the boozer's which could explain why they both just disappeared. This is all just rumor though.

You are right our last 20 in each game scared me. The Tonga game I was literally on the edge of my seat watching that meltdown, luckily the boys pulled through.

 

[LittleGuy]

Yah I kind of have a feeling SMS had a falling out with the coaching staff which is why he has never been brought back in the fold. He is clearly a talented player as he has been able to not only hold down a place playing pro but also captain an english championship side. What I heard about Dave Spicer was all he did when he was with Auch in the Top 14 was party. I heard both he and Mensah-Coker were quite the boozer's which could explain why they both just disappeared. This is all just rumor though.

You are right our last 20 in each game scared me. The Tonga game I was literally on the edge of my seat watching that meltdown, luckily the boys pulled through.

I'd heard this as well through the grapevine, though I think some of the rumours with Mensah Coker came as a side effect from his moonlighting job as a bouncer. MC at least had a decent career in the RFU championship and in Canadian colours, and with all the depth coming up in the wings he was always going to be on the outside looking in eventually. Spicer was a huge dissapointment though was touted as a next best thing and has essentially dissapeared.

 

[Canadian_Rugger]

I'd heard this as well through the grapevine, though I think some of the rumours with Mensah Coker came as a side effect from his moonlighting job as a bouncer. MC at least had a decent career in the RFU championship and in Canadian colours, and with all the depth coming up in the wings he was always going to be on the outside looking in eventually. Spicer was a huge dissapointment though was touted as a next best thing and has essentially dissapeared.

Yah, I honestly think when Crowley came in he gave some of the boys a kick in the ass. I think some of them were treating playing for Canada like they were running out for the local brew pub. Another guy that fell off the radar real quick: Luke Cudmore!

Honestly, I am thinking back to 04 when we played Wales at York University. I still remember watching that game and seeing the Welsh break-thru Derek Daypuck like he was a piece of paper, boy we have come a long way!

 

[LittleGuy]

Yah, I honestly think when Crowley came in he gave some of the boys a kick in the ass. I think some of them were treating playing for Canada like they were running out for the local brew pub. Another guy that fell off the radar real quick: Luke Cudmore!

Honestly, I am thinking back to 04 when we played Wales at York University. I still remember watching that game and seeing the Welsh break-thru Derek Daypuck like he was a piece of paper, boy we have come a long way!

Derek Daypuck is a punchline my friend and I use frequently(though he has become an acceptable CRC player) that game along with the 04 game against England(where are pro players were on strike I beleive) are the only two Canadian games I haven't even been bothered to finish watching, he was absolutely dreadful in that game and (if canadafan gave Hirayama a 1/10 against Ireland than he should give Daypuck a -9/10 for that game ) and his goalkicking was abysmal, good old Suggitt felt we didn't need Pritchard in 2004-05 either for some reason than went crawling back to him in 2006 where Pritchard broke every single game record Canada has essentially.

Luke Cudmore was just so thin for a lock LOL, last I heard he went on the RGC 1404 trip but haven't heard anything about him since, considering how weak we were at Lock that speaks volumes, probably dosen't help the his brother hasn't turned up at every oppourtunity either.

 

[Canadian_Rugger]

Derek Daypuck is a punchline my friend and I use frequently(though he has become an acceptable CRC player) that game along with the 04 game against England(where are pro players were on strike I beleive) are the only two Canadian games I haven't even been bothered to finish watching, he was absolutely dreadful in that game and (if canadafan gave Hirayama a 1/10 against Ireland than he should give Daypuck a -9/10 for that game ) and his goalkicking was abysmal, good old Suggitt felt we didn't need Pritchard in 2004-05 either for some reason than went crawling back to him in 2006 where Pritchard broke every single game record Canada has essentially.

Luke Cudmore was just so thin for a lock LOL, last I heard he went on the RGC 1404 trip but haven't heard anything about him since, considering how weak we were at Lock that speaks volumes, probably dosen't help the his brother hasn't turned up at every oppourtunity either.

Hahaha I remember Daypuck went for a kick against England and he shanked it so badly it was like something out of my local high school game. He wasn't a bad club player but he should have never set foot on an international rugby pitch. Suggitt was brutal for the Canadian program and I can't believe we even hired him. He had zero experience coaching professional rugby and it was all a big joke! Luke Cudmore was supposed to be the next biggest thing, atleast they hyped him as such and he even spent time playing for the London Irish academy. Unfortunately the only thing he shared in common with his brother was the same last name.

 

[LittleGuy]

Hahaha I remember Daypuck went for a kick against England and he shanked it so badly it was like something out of my local high school game. He wasn't a bad club player but he should have never set foot on an international rugby pitch. Suggitt was brutal for the Canadian program and I can't believe we even hired him. He had zero experience coaching professional rugby and it was all a big joke! Luke Cudmore was supposed to be the next biggest thing, atleast they hyped him as such and he even spent time playing for the London Irish academy. Unfortunately the only thing he shared in common with his brother was the same last name.

I love the foam at the mouth "patriots" over at canadianrugby.ca who argue that results under Suggitt were just as good as Crowley....like you have to have your pants on your head when you watch the games to think that(all because they are ****** we don't have a Canadian coach...yawn...). The commentators at the 2007 RWC were laughing at us playing 1970's rugby on the pitch, and began to actively cheer for Japan in the final pool match because they were at least attempting to swing the ball out wide.

Perhaps Luke Cudmore was following in the other Cudmore brothers(Daniel... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daniel_Cudmore) footsteps and was persuing an acting career...his piece de resistance a role as a Canadian rugby player in some sort of avant garde performance art!!!

Edit: I'm also shamelessly stealing the Daypuck as a piece of paper line...thats gold!!!

 

[Canadian_Rugger]

I love the foam at the mouth "patriots" over at canadianrugby.ca who argue that results under Suggitt were just as good as Crowley....like you have to have your pants on your head when you watch the games to think that(all because they are ****** we don't have a Canadian coach...yawn...). The commentators at the 2007 RWC were laughing at us playing 1970's rugby on the pitch, and began to actively cheer for Japan in the final pool match because they were at least attempting to swing the ball out wide.

Perhaps Luke Cudmore was following in the other Cudmore brothers(Daniel... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daniel_Cudmore) footsteps and was persuing an acting career...his piece de resistance a role as a Canadian rugby player in some sort of avant garde performance art!!!

Edit: I'm also shamelessly stealing the Daypuck as a piece of paper line...thats gold!!!

The guys over at canadianrugby.ca are the biggest bunch of idiots there is. I hate Clyde the most and can't even stand reading the **** he spews. I remember the Suggitt years and Canada has improved leaps and bounds since then. The game has also changed as well and is changing in Canada for the better. I still remember playing club rugby and it being super bush league. The standard is improving and those days are slowly but surely behind us. High School programs are also getting a lot better and the standard of coaching is really improving.

Edit:

Too add to what I just said, a big problem with Canadian rugby is most players and fans within Canadian circles don't actually watch pro rugby or international rugby and have no idea about anything else outside of Canadian Rugby. I try talking to people about The Heineken Cup, Super 15, Pro 12, Aviva Premiership, Top 14 and people know F All about any of it. I was talking to a guy at the Tonga game and he tried telling me that Chauncey O'toole wasn't playing because Glasgow wouldn't release him. I said buds, O'toole hasn't been at Glasgow in 3 years and he only played a game for them before he was cut. The guy quickly shut up as he realized I probably knew a lot more about rugby then he did.

 

[canadafan]

Agree that the Suggit years were the low point for Canadian Rugby and I was glad he was fired. I think that was when rugby Canada realized that they needed to change the direction of ugly in Canada and they have slowly been doing that.

 

[LittleGuy]

The guys over at canadianrugby.ca are the biggest bunch of idiots there is. I hate Clyde the most and can't even stand reading the **** he spews. I remember the Suggitt years and Canada has improved leaps and bounds since then. The game has also changed as well and is changing in Canada for the better. I still remember playing club rugby and it being super bush league. The standard is improving and those days are slowly but surely behind us. High School programs are also getting a lot better and the standard of coaching is really improving.

Edit:

Too add to what I just said, a big problem with Canadian rugby is most players and fans within Canadian circles don't actually watch pro rugby or international rugby and have no idea about anything else outside of Canadian Rugby. I try talking to people about The Heineken Cup, Super 15, Pro 12, Aviva Premiership, Top 14 and people know F All about any of it. I was talking to a guy at the Tonga game and he tried telling me that Chauncey O'toole wasn't playing because Glasgow wouldn't release him. I said buds, O'toole hasn't been at Glasgow in 3 years and he only played a game for them before he was cut. The guy quickly shut up as he realized I probably knew a lot more about rugby then he did.

Clyde is almost certainly mentally ill, I can't believe Mark at BCrugbynews quoted him last year when Clyde was bashing Pritchard as an "aussie" and that no one was interested in watching Pritch play or break Gareth's record...I honestly can't think of almost anybody who's sacrificed more for Canadian rugby than Pritch (Rees and Charron maybe...), the guy was on the field while his daughter was born for ****s sake!!

Yeah O'Toole's cup of coffee at Glasgow was unusual they did bring him in on an extremely short trm contract but I guess he couldn't have impressed that much if they didn't even give him a chance in a 2nd game.

I hear you with high school improving, my high school formed our team in 2000 and it was a bit of a lark, now they are going to OFSAA chamiponships, and have converted over morons who thought girdiron was the be all end all in my time.

Hopefully TSN will start to pick up some more rugby and expose Canadians to at least somethign aside from the national team, we need to get the casual sports fans hooked, I was talking to some at the Canada vs. Ireland game and it was great to see people taking the plunge.