[England] Post-6N/Pre-RWC Player Watch

Discussion in 'International Test Matches' started by Patchey, Apr 6, 2015.

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  1. goodNumber10

    goodNumber10 International

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    he played 10 for the Sharks in Super Rugby.
     
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  3. chippieolamus

    chippieolamus Bench Player

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    Even better.
     
  4. Tigs Man

    Tigs Man Hall of Fame

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    Was he a good number 10?
     
  5. goodNumber10

    goodNumber10 International

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    he did a job.

    Brett Sheehan didn't like him:




    Also just FYI it's, not good Number 10 as in he is a good number 10, it's good number 10 as in when you tell a dog he's been good, "good Number10, good boy", it was originally a play on "Good Will Hunting"
     
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  6. yaboyjj

    yaboyjj Academy Player

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  7. Tigs Man

    Tigs Man Hall of Fame

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    Wasn't 10 in that game though.

    Also what are you going on about.
     
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  8. TRF_Peat

    TRF_Peat Super Moderator

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    Good luck to him, but as they're probably not taking 2 specialist 13s who are both a bit on the raw side, I don't see it happening...

    Still think his chances would have been better at 15. I don't think he played there long enough to go as someone who can play 15 and 13 though.
     
  9. Raggs

    Raggs Bench Player

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    It wouldn't surprise me if he continues to practice fullback skills at Wasps to be honest, most players can cover another position at a real push (injuries/cards etc). He also fills in at scrumhalf if really needed (not that I'd ever want to use a non-specialist there, it could be worthwhile for a 10 minute yellow to have him).

    He also easily covers wing, and that's not something he'll lose. Tailor made for the 23 shirt in my mind, been saying it for some time. And Joseph coming in at 13 has suddenly changed the mould for what England will want out of their 13, and now it fits Daly a lot closer than it did.
     
  10. TRF_Peat

    TRF_Peat Super Moderator

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    Yes, because Lancaster has shown sooooooooooooooooo much interest in having a really versatile number 23!

    Not that Daly's actually looked like a genuine contender in more than one position either.
     
  11. Raggs

    Raggs Bench Player

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    He has tended to have a player that can offer the most cover in the 23 shirt. It's not always a back 3 player. With Farrell in the 22 shirt, able to cover 12, we arguably need someone who can cover 13 and fullback, seeing as Joseph can cover the wing, and neither Farrell nor Ford cover fullback (like Cips).
     
  12. goodNumber10

    goodNumber10 International

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    never claimed he was, just wanted an excuse to show him getting smashed :D

    Just explaining my user name as people seem to think it's a claim to greatness (of which they'd be right) :D

    - - - Updated - - -

    he won't go to the World Cup, he's not been involved in the Senior Squad for the last three years, why on earth would they bring him? Even if he makes the training squad for the summer he's not going to go to the world cup, he doesn't bring anything to the squad we don't already have (other than a long range boot) and he's not consistent enough to be jumping through the current pecking order.

    You only have to look at how long it's taken Joseph to work his way back into the match day 23 to see he just won't slide up the ranks quick enough to make the World Cup.
     
  13. TRF_Peat

    TRF_Peat Super Moderator

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    I really cannot agree with this in the slightest and wonder if we're using entirely different definitions.

    We've just gone through a window with Twelvetrees in the 23 shirt covering 12, just 12, and necessitating a shuffle if there was ever an injury anywhere but 12.

    Prior to that we had Yarde on the bench, just covering wing, with Watson on the bench for one game.

    Out in NZ it was Ashton once, Burrell once, Pennell once. By my count, that's a solitary two in twelve games where the guy in the 23 shirt is genuine international class in two or more positions, which is being slightly generous to Watson at full-back and Burrell at international rugby.

    Going further back, you have that interminably long period with Alex Goode at 15, with all the attending disasters of Mike Brown on the wing it occasionally brought... Manu's been on the bench a couple of times, and he's sorta versatile, but he's only on the bench to regain fitness, Foden at 23 once, he did ok at wing I guess, Strettle once...

    In short, going back to 2013, Lancaster has shown absolutely zero qualms about sticking in a guy that covers one position and one position only in the 23 shirt. If you call that offering the most cover, we are using entirely different definitions. To me, it says very clearly that Lancaster is in fact doing the opposite of what you say, does not care at all how many positions number 23 covers, and that being able to cover multiple positions (in theory at least) gets you nowhere with him. Elliot Daly is quite clearly not Lancaster's dream of a 23.


    Oh, and Watson will probably be covering 15 from the wing, and Nowell's claim to covering 13 is as good as Daly's to covering wing. And full-back too. So, it's a fairly flimsy argument that we'll need someone who cover 13 and 15 from the bench - unless you want someone who come straight onto the pitch from the bench in any position without any reshuffle, which is a decent idea, but not one Lancaster has shown the slightest interest in.
     
  14. RedruthRFC

    RedruthRFC First XV

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    Interesting article. TBH, I've always thought of him as a one trick pony who crashes head first at his opposite number. To be fair that's the may be an out of date view as the opinion was formed during his time with the Pirates and England U20s. If he has developed an offloading game as the article suggests, maybe he's worth a look. What does anyone make of his distribution and (if any) kicking these days?
     
  15. ratsapprentice

    ratsapprentice Hall of Fame

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    His distribution is decent, and I haven't seen him kick.

    He could be a very solid player, but I think he's a year or two (and some dominant performances) away from being ready to thrive at international level.
     
  16. living sacrifice

    living sacrifice First XV

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    When I've seen him play I've never thought he was worse than burrell or 12trees, in fact every time I've seen him I think he has looked better than them
     
  17. ratsapprentice

    ratsapprentice Hall of Fame

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    If we were going to pick a hard carrying 12 then I would probably have Hill over everyone bar Manu, I don't want to rush him though.
     
  18. 91jmay

    91jmay Academy Player

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    Hookers: Hartley, Youngs, Ward (really not sure about this one)
    Props: Cole, Marler, Vunipola, Wilson.
    Second Rows: Lawes, Launchbury, Parling, Attwood
    Back Rows: Robshaw, Wood, Haskell, Vunipola, Morgan.
    Scrum Halves: Youngs, Wigglesworth, Simpson
    Fly Halves: Ford, Farrell.
    Centres: Joseph, Tuilagi, Barritt, Twelvetrees
    Wings: Nowell, Watson, Wade, Rokoduguni
    Fullbacks: Brown, Goode.

    That's who i think they will pick.

    I would get Eastmond in for Twelvetrees but think Twelvetrees is pretty much a certainty sadly.
     
    Last edited: Apr 10, 2015
  19. Tigs Man

    Tigs Man Hall of Fame

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    Would rather have Heywood than Ward TBH.
     
  20. chippieolamus

    chippieolamus Bench Player

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    One of the wingers (probably Wade) will drop for another prop, you don't need 6 back 3s.
     
  21. 91jmay

    91jmay Academy Player

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    If that is case I would drop Goode, have Watson as full back cover and bring in Corbi but SL would probably drop Wade like you say.
     
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